The debuff change was implemented before LFR came out too, no thought was given to how it’d effect backfilling in LFR. LFD and LFR should not have the same debuff given. It’s different content with different loot restrictions all under the umbrella of “queued content”. This change may have actually benefited LFD, but it’s at a cost of making LFR function incorrectly.
I’d really like to know if this is actually how Blizz intends for it to work in LFR or not.
Punishing backfillers in LFR isn’t okay.
Well lets look at it from a normal persons perspective. Mind you im not defending blizzard, as this thought had just occurred to me.
We’re able to queue for up to 4 instances at once. So right now we can queue for 2 LFR wings, heroic dungeon, and a random BG if we want.
Most of us are doing that. Queueing for all wings of LFR. When you finish one, your next one pops almost instantaneously.
The chances of falling into multiple backfilling raids in almost zero. So you queue into one, backfilling, finish it, instantaneously pop the queue for the next wing, full raid.
Now you queue for the one boss you missed. Complete it, leave, get hit with the deserter debuff.
But now youve run your queued content. The 30 minute timer isnt going to affect you as youve got nothing left to queue for. And lets not pretend people run LFR more than once for the experience. I mean its explicitly stated here:
Normally people aren’t queueing for all queued content. They’re doing LFD, LFR or BG’s. The only one that makes sense to queue for multiples is LFR (now that we’ve been ungated for more).
I tried queuing as a healer solo early on and my ratio of being pulled in to raid in progress was very high. I would have queued for the bosses I missed, but I’m stubborn and wanted to actually break the chain deserter debuff. When one legit deserter leaves it can extent a chain to multiple people giving them deserter for no reason except for “luck” upon entering a LFR queue. I sacrificed the loot I could have gotten… not because I didn’t want to kill the first boss, but out of principle of an unjust label being put upon me. I did not “desert” I helped Raid A finish. You want to call me a deserter for going back in and getting loot from Raid B because I helped backfill? No, no… that isn’t how it should work when I’m loot locked out of everything.
It’s the only queued content where loot is locked. It makes no sense to do said content if loot is unavailable. If LFD was loot locked I don’t think people would “desert” as much either, but here some people are defending this garbage of a blanket fix to a debuff that effects multiple areas of content.
I’ve not been solo queuing anymore and tend to get fresh runs for the time being, I can not express how unhappy I would be if there wasn’t other non queued content that I can play to avoid queued content all together right now. If I did LFR as much I did in the past, I’d be even more unhappy and vocal about it. Choosing not to do it, is best… will skip it for the most part entirely and go to normals if I want to raid. Trying to punish me with a deserter debuff definitely plays into that choice, so that is it’s intended effect… which is all sorts of bad.
I don’t want to “juggle” a deserter debuff because I backfilled.
1.) I’ve literally had this happen to me multiple times THIS WEEK.
2.) Some people do this super-weird (I know!) thing where as soon as they finish a wing, even with an instant-queue, they re-queue for what they just only got part of due to backfilling (I used to do this, anymore I just abandon the in-progress queue because there’s no penalty that way)
Right, when only queuing for a single instance at a time. But when queuing for multiple, i think it defaults to the system they have in place where if your first instance is a backfill, your next instance is guaranteed fresh.
Which then follows the example i outlined in my previous post.
Right, and you can enter the queue again, I never spoke against that. You’re going to have to anyway if you end up in a backfilled raid.
I guess I don’t fully pay attention, does it let you know if you’re joining an “in progress” instance?
Which worked fine when the debuff was only tethered to killing one boss, now we need to stay the duration of the entire thing, no exceptions? not even loot locked backfillers who are helping (a much larger pool of people) in LFR?
enter backfilled raid. Finish. Requeue for same wing
enter FRESH raid with insta-queue. Finish
enter backilled raid at your missing boss. Finish. Leave.
get deserter buff
have deserter buff stopping you from queuing up…which is fine because you don’t have anything to queue for at this point.
Wonder if there’s an exception where you can leave a raid once you’ve killed ALL bosses? I know i entered a backfill for the first boss in second wing and when i left my shaman got slapped with the debuff still.
um aren’t u able to decline before joining if u see the bosses are already dead etc like in other raids it tells u if any of the bosses are dead before u hit accept to join
They have the tech, why they don’t just fill with NPC’s when people drop/dc for whatever reason rather than putting players in LFRs in progress that will force them to have to queue again seems like a pretty simple fix to this problem.
If someone backfills a group, then they are going to requeue for that wing to finish the first boss or two that they missed on the backfilled run.
Then they leave. Then other people have to backfill. Probably someones 2nd or 3rd or 4th 80 for the week.
You know, we all want fresh runs. They feel good… but this seems like a mostly seamless design to me to guarantee your toons will get to loot each boss in LFR. The other side of the coin is nobody backfills and then your fresh run STOPS halfway because no backfill.
If you are filling, you get priority requeue after you finish.
If you bail after killing all of the bosses for the week, no deserter debuff.
If you bail BEFORE killing all of the bosses for the week, you get a 6 hour deserter debuff that affects your entire account. Repeated offenses double the duration each time for the entire season.
