Now where have I seen a spell like this before…
I definitely think that if Surrender to Madness were to remain this is the design it should have. And honestly the gameplay fits Shadow more than Druid since it is exactly what we had for two expansions, just on a cooldown instead of being permanent.
Just wanted to post that we’re already at 1k replies to this topic. 
Right now we basically just have to be patient and see what kind of updates they do to the trees. It’ll probably be a few weeks.
Ill agree with it ll prolly be a few weeks but they said they want more feedback, so keep it coming.
and to that point persoanly i would appreciate some more focus on dots as a source of damage amd to include some class interactions of abilites shifted from vamperic touch and back into shadow word pain, its mostly just a maintenance buff now and if everythig as is allow apparitions to proc from any insanity spender
I wish they would turn Lightwell into (The well of exstence) from BFA.
But making it doing an AoE Heal divided on all player when activated instead of the one from BFA that was every 15sec on solo target. But keeping the old passive of storing healing and healing the target if they drop at 40% hp
I do hope they can consider bringing back the Divine Insight talent for holy. With Flash Concentration gone, it does feel lacking and I think Divine Insight could fix a lot of issues.
FC was great and all but it led us to neglect most of our toolkit and with Divine Insight it would actually encourage us to use everything we have.
Holy also need an equivalent of Wickedness from Disc but as a supportive option to boost Star/Halo
You do get the talent for multiple holy fires every 30 seconds. Thats not too shabby really plus a stun. which can be on a short cd if your dpsing enough
X’anshi, Shroud of Archbishop Benedictus (not sure why this isnt a talent option already tbh)
After Spirit of Redemption expires, you will revive at up to 100% health, based on your effectiveness during Spirit of Redemption. After reviving, you cannot benefit from Spirit of Redemption for 10 min.
Persisting Prayer
Your Prayer of Healing applies Renew to all targets affected.
Even the shammie rez is not 10 mins so this wont happen
Wont happen either because you could blanket cover a raid pretty fast with prayer circle
Holy doesnt lack raid healing or prob even key healing.
It needs to do enough dps to be useful but not more then disc otherwise disc becomes pointless. It needs to have enough utility beyond hps to make it brought to RWF which it kinda has now
Its nice to wonder up new spells and abilities but needs to be targeted to whats likely and whats needed.
I DO think they should go more the PoM route, like the artifact power divine hymn dings PoM all around the place without using it up etc
It was possible during Cata with Chakra all you had to do was use direct heal and Prayer of Mending count as Direct heal
So how did a priest legendary from Legion happen then?
They are bringing stuff back from the past.
Shamans has self rez then as well.
Come up with a better counter then “no”
As far as prayer granting renew, it can be happen very easily. It might no be for the full duration or have a chance to apply etc.
Simply just saying no is not constructive. All it does is show you have nothing to offer but wanting to say something just to say it without considering the intent which is the interaction itself.
Let the balancing come AFTER the idea of the interaction has come first.
You really need to take a moment and think about HOW someone would like to play a specialization, not ONLY what is lacks or needs. Sometimes a play style direction is enough to be a talent option.
Look at all the Paladin talents, they have a lot that is pushing for a more consecration type builds be it for good or not… it’s happening.
Stop being so single minded and just let ideas get discussed instead of just saying “no”.
Not all ideas are perfect the 1st iteration, I don’t think you are grasping that thought as you have multiple times now shown that to be the very case.
That self-revive cape was way too op for PvP imho. I only really PvP’d in Season 1, but when I did if anyone killed me early in the match I just popped out after 15s like nothing happened. No other healer had a 2nd life ability for arenas.
Losing Podtender kind of hurts for PvE as well, but it’s just something we can live with though.
I think with PoH the only way to buff it up is to lower its mana cost, increase its baseline healing, and add talents that increase its healing on the lowest HP target. Also, adding in some support with things like Trail of Light and Surge of Light would help.
Holy really could use multiple different playstyle options instead of just using one hammer for everything.
You can add kiss/curse effects as well for balancing. I see a lot of those in the various talents tress released so far.
An example could be to increase the casting time of Prayer of Healing or increase the mana cost or reduce the healing it does.
As for the self rez, it can have additional restrictions like how Mind Control doesn’t work against players either at all or is reduced… this counts for for Mind Control and Dominate Mind.
For example, the self rez effect an be categorized in the list of abilities that can’t be used in arena… or above a certain cooldown to then not be used.
It’s not about dismissing ideas, it’s about seeing HOW they can be implemented.
I did. you didnt read. Shammies have a rez on a 30 min timer They arent going to give you a 10 min one., A leggo item isnt the same thing because you are losing out on another leggo to take that one. Instead of just arguing. Think about the reply first
It already has a hot. Its called echo of light. So no… renew on it wont happen
Neither is coming up with fanciful ideas that dont address the issues that need addressing for holy
Nor did i simply say “no” i said why
#removevoidform
A big part of Holy’s current meme status is the damage that boon brings. Boon seems to be going away, but hopefully talenting into damage will compensate so that I can go questing without wanting to smash my head into the monitor.
Also of note is that FC is going away. Holy priests were shunned in M+ dungeons last expansion, simply because they were the only healer that routinely runs OOM in anything but a near-perfect group. I have no idea how they’re going to fix that after they remove FC, FC covered that up that crippling single target mana shortcoming really well.
I don’t think that voidform is Shadow’s issue here, I think that Shadow’s multitarget playstyle and how many GCD’s you need to burn before you start getting the AoE throughput that almost every other class gets in 2 or 3 GCD’s, is the issue.
Voidform has been the problem since it was implemented. Its existence hinders all acceptable solutions to shadows problems and gimps our dots. They should have killed it completely with the rework after bfa.
You are missing the point… again.
You are too focused on why it shouldn’t be in the game instead of thinking of how it can be… again.
By your logic, every Legendary effect in legion should not be in the game again in any form because it used to be a choice and now it wont be???
The talent tree is built on choice… That is why you have to sacrifice 1 thing for another. That is the ENTIRE purpose of it. Talents are balanced by a whole slew of different variables.
Additionally, you have to perform X action in order to get the rez effect, it is not automatic and it is not done instantly. Meaning it could be wasted and you might rez in danger without meaning to. There are draw backs to the effect.
Finally, you are too focused on how things currently work (Inside the box) I am focused on how things might work (outside the box). At this point in time, Blizzard needs “out of the box” ideas to consider when they are building these talent trees. They need new interesting stuff and less balancing feedback. The balancing will come later when things are more solidified.
So that means your response to my idea is absolutely pointless because you are basically saying that unless they get what they need, they done need anything else. That is a place where only stagnant ideas are allowed to prosper because you are working within the confines of a very restricted idea of playstyle. You are assuming there is only 1 way to do things and are unwilling to even consider a different approach. Because of that, your input in completely invalid and confirms what I said in that you are just wanting to say something for the heck of it.
The better approach is considering the playstyle it would offer and see what adjustments it needs to fit as a choice. You bypass that and jump to just straight saying no… it wont happen.
That’s is why I said you just saying no. You are not giving suggestions as to how it can happen, you are just focusing on trying to find a reason to not let it happen. You are stuck in the box.
The mastery? That does not provide any type of ability interaction. I mentioned Renew because then it can have more interaction with the spec in a route to make both Prayer of Healing a more included button to press in that it can help spread Renews so you can get more interaction with other talents that works with Renew.
You missed the entire point of the idea… again.
You missed the point once again…
It’s coming up with options of playstyle choices. Not every choice needs to solve a problem. Some choices can be to define the way you play… have you even looked at what other classes talents have? They offer talents that change up the way you play / in what buttons become a more priority and your placement be it more range or in more melee etc. Actually changing how you play your specialization.
You simply do not want or cant not see the potential of playing differently because as I stated, you are focused on in the box thinking… meaning you are only considering what blizzard already has talents and how they currently work… not what other options it could have.
Therefore you feedback to my suggestions in how you just wanted to find a way to just simply say “no” because its not already a thing is feedback to be ignored because you are too 1 dimensional. You are unable to think beyond what things currently are.
um i play all 3 specs to a decent level. do you? so who should be ignored?
Nope didnt say that. your telling stories in ytour head again.
You arent changing playstyles. you are dreaming up new abilites for fun, with little chance of them being implemented so your just clogging the discussion eith fluff
No you are disregarding my points. Echo is a hot, you are asking to cast a spell, PoH that already has a hot and you want to add another hot on top of that.
In what world is that likely to happen? common sense pls 2 fot 1 tuesdays it seems in your house
Once again you dont heal. You are just dreaming up stuff. You live in the clouds, wheras i have played the spec and understand the longer reaching affects that you just dont
sigh im noit getting stuck in another convo with you where i say the sky is blue and your like ahh but it could be violet.
got watch the shadow vid i posted up. A good video targeting the issues and what they would like to see… No fanciful notions in there. Im going to leave it at that