Yes, he made an analogy that sports players use performance enhancing drugs to enhance their performance while playing the game.
You stated that it is a terrible analogy because WoW players gain nothing from the Chicken. If you are not currently gaining any benefit from the Chicken, then a nerf will have no impact.
If you ARE gaining an edge in performance, then your statement is a complete lie.
Ignoring how contradictory that last part is…
Skull of Impending doom is the same, as well as nets and brooch and all sorts of things in Vanilla wow that are still relevant in TBC. It’s a design choice and completely intended; you believing you shouldn’t use them =/= not intended.
Hi, not slicy here. Just decided my first ever post should be to jump into the middle of a convo i know nothing about and say that you cant possible compare gaining millions of dollars to arbitrary meaningless numbers in a video game without sound extremely desperate
What sport are players gaining absolutely nothing for is overrun with rampant steroid and performance enhancement problems?
If money isnt the thing then it must be something else right? Oh wait its the money.
None of those other items nerf every raid boss in the game by like 10-15% (by increasing total raid dps by 10-15%).
And that huge increase in raid dps by a level 45 item was almost certainly not intended. It was obviously an oversight.
The fact that blizzard changed virtually all +% items to a rating system is a pretty strong indication this one was simply missed.
Assuming your raid is mostly melee dps sure. But it only affects one melee group with warlocks and mages STILL having more dps.
This isn’t an imbalance thing, this is a “melee are comparable dps” thing, which is a flawed criticism.
I don’t believe that to be true, considering everything in engineering was completely redesigned for TBC release.
High school sports? College sports? Hell, a lot of dudes use steroids just to look good in a swimsuit.
To get to colleges
To go pro and make $$
Idk if thats a sport
Again, if the numbers are meaningless, then how does a nerf affect you?
Right now, you do X amount of DPS with the Chicken Squawk.
You would do less DPS if the Chicken is nerfed, but as you said, the DPS numbers are meaningless. It would have no impact on you.
Or, maybe, the sports players care about a number (the money in their bank account) and the WoW players care about a number (their DPS) and both sides want to make their number go higher. In that case, his analogy is sound.
Sure, money is a motivator. But it’s not the only incentive. Most don’t make it to the pros. They’re doing it to gain an edge, to be more successful as compared to their peers. To win. For the same reasons you use the chicken.
They arent meaningful when comparing them to a professional athlete making millions
you are trying to compare a melee dps pulling 500 more dps (still losing to the ranged dps by 500 but you guys are ok with that) To a guy trying to make 200m and its just a desperate reach that really is more comical than on point.
Even with the squawks ranged stacking is the meta. People are just mad that melee got something that brings them more in line
Those numbers are exaggerated. Looking at your last log, on bosses, you only averaged about 100 dps less than your hunters and about 200 dps less than your mage at the top.
Besides, you’re there for expose armor, right? You’re a support class. You’re not supposed to be at the top.
Either way, rebalancing the classes is a separate issue. It’s not an argument to keep a severely broken level 45 trinket broken.
Rogues are not a support class at all lol. In the top 18 speed clears there is 1 rogue. They bring nothing
I consider them one and the same. You are advocating for a more sever imbalance. Hard pass on that
I’ll post on my main since you indicated my posts from an alt was causing you difficulties previously.
The fact that the sports players make millions is irrelevant. His analogy was about players of any game seeking an edge. But, even if it were relevant, you need to consider the risk to the player in addition to the reward.
The sports player is taking a severe risk with their health and likely taking a severe legal risk as well. The payoff is millions of dollars.
The WoW player is not risking anything in terms of health or legality, yet the payoff is a few higher numbers on a video game epeen ranking.
The magnitude of the risk vs reward is relatively equal. Big risk for a big gain in sports. Risk nothing for a meager gain in WoW. It’s just a matter of scale, which makes it a fine analogy from that perspective.
If you really wanted to attack his analogy, you would have keyed in on his statement that "if you leave it up to the players, they’re GOING to use [the performance enhancer].
This has actually been proven false in WoW. Right now, you can pre-clear to any boss in TK, go kill Kael, then run to the other boss with your legendary weapons still in effect. If everyone in your guild does this, you will all have 99 and 100s. Why do players not do this? Because WCL will invalidate their log.
A method of increasing performance was left up to the WoW players and we DID police ourselves accordingly. This evidence goes against Kerg’s statement that the players WILL use any edge we can.
I main an enhance shaman. You state I want the Chicken Squawks nerfed because I don’t like seeing melee get close to ranged on the meters? No, completely false. I am melee.
What I do want is to see you stop attacking an analogy for nonsensical reasons. Stick to points based in logic.
Best of luck to you on your crusade. If you win and the Squawks stay as-is, great, I get to do more DPS. But if the chicken does eat a nerf, I’ll be fine with it. The numbers are actually meaningless to me. I’ll have just as much fun either way.
I bet you were crying for ranged to get buffed in classic right? I mean you wouldn’t be hypocritical right?
How come when I search for the top tbcc DPS rankings on warcraft logs, I see a bunch of warriors? Can you remember seeing any hunters at the top in classic? Maybe melee are actually alot better than you think.
Its extremely relevant. If youre talking crimes and you try to compare shoplifting a candybar to murder you better believe im going to laugh at how extreme your analogy is. If you are trying to compare two things let them at least exist in the same stratosphere. Being that ezxtreme screams desperation
On this we agree. Im trying my best, but comparing 500 dps in a dying mmorpg to a guy trying to make 200m makes it hard.
Honestly its best to just stick with whats being discussed and let that horribly comical analogy die. It served no purpose other than to derail the convo. What I REALLY want someone to answer me is why are all these people against their raid so much? Why are they ok with their ranged dps destroying everyone while having better utility and that is perfectly acceptable but melee closing the gap is a sin and they want to punish their own raid and those who enjoy it? Really it sounds like lazy people want to be rewarded for being lazy. They see others doing more and instead of stepping up or just accepting that those who do more deserve more they want to drop everyone down to their lazy level.
I wont win and I know it, blizzard tends to cater to the lazy. But I am entitled to my thoughts even if others (including blizzard) dont agree. Just as every person on here who disagrees with me is very entitled to that stance.
I was super pro buffing the ranged. I root for my teammates to go above and beyond. Our hunters were so stoked when blizzard made items benefit ranged dps on top of melee. And you know what? I was stoked with them. I didnt come here asking to bury them further, i cheered and applauded it because it made them happy.
Should maybe sift through my posts again. I have mentioned multiple times that fury is the 1 spec that with squawks can compete. I can go get those dps rank %s you asked for a week or so ago for you again if you want. It was funny watching your argument dissolve then, it would be equally funny this time too. But arms, ret, rogues, ehn. They dont fare as well
Nobody is trying to gimp melee DPS, Melee aren’t Rosa Parks, there’s no malice or hate. The trinket is broken, it only helps melee and it scales with a stat that melee are going to get plenty of in the upcoming phases.
It’s simply too strong of a trinket that’s slowly more and more becoming a thing in raid. If the chicken buff gave caster haste too there would be issues. It’s a huge oversight in the game. Besides if the trinket isn’t that important or nobody uses it much then nerfing it won’t be an issue.
My god is the desperation thick here lol
Nobody said that. Please
You’re literally saying people want to hold melee DPS back or don’t want them to compete with ranged when that’s never been anyone’s stance here.
Terrible take. No need for you to try and compare people fighting for literal human rights to this fiasco.
Lets keep it somewhat on course here. Lets discuss why this is REALLY bad? Because its strong? Sure, but even with it melee are not anywhere near ranged as a whole. So why do we allow ranged dps to exist in that state but were now advocating to knock melee down a notch? Even with scaling melee never run away with dmg anywere near the level ranged do the first few phases. They basically break even by the end