Baine is going beastmode

[Dotandplot-emerald-dream (Dotandplot)]

Sorry, did those undead that were raised say before they died that they don’t want to be raised? Did you hear their spirits? No? Then you wouldn’t know, thank you. I think a Val’kyr who can literally hear the souls of the dead knows the intricacies of necromancy more then you.

Roflmao, wtf is this response?

“Ey, dead Kul Tiran war hero, you there.”

“Wtf I’m dead, who are you?”

“You wanna come back and help the Horde kill your countrymen?”

“Eh, sure why not.”

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.

That’s not even including the fact that pretty much all of them except Zelling hated what they became.

This is my last response to you, you’re just being petty at this point.

[Goshom-wyrmrest-accord]

Says the dude who had to resort to name-calling. Keep telling yourself that. As said, the Val’kyr in Darkshore is AFTER the War Campaign, thusly what she says counts and she states that she cannot raise certain Night Elves because they are not a willing soul to be raised.

[Dotandplot-emerald-dream (Dotandplot)]

Maybe if she did it to his people… which was pointed out in the SoO interaction between them. I think Lor is pragmatic enough to know that if UC falls there’s nothing standing between the Alliance and Quel’thalas. If she’s gotta raise some troops to try and stop that from happening as a last-ditch effort, well, sorry mooks. Lor isn’t as tethered to this bombastic idea of honor that Saurfang and Baine are.

How do we know that she didn’t raise Blood Elves at UC? Surely it wasn’t just Tauren and Orcs on the front lines. Also, it would set a precedent. If she would do it to the other races, why wouldn’t she do it to the Blood Elves eventually? But this would require competent writing, so .

[Dotzy-kargath]

Maybe if she did it to his people… which was pointed out in the SoO interaction between them. I think Lor is pragmatic enough to know that if UC falls there’s nothing standing between the Alliance and Quel’thalas. If she’s gotta raise some troops to try and stop that from happening as a last-ditch effort, well, sorry mooks. Lor isn’t as tethered to this bombastic idea of honor that Saurfang and Baine are.

How do we know that she didn’t raise Blood Elves at UC? Surely it wasn’t just Tauren and Orcs on the front lines. Also, it would set a precedent. If she would do it to the other races, why wouldn’t she do it to the Blood Elves eventually? But this would require competent writing, so .

I’m like 90% sure that the only Belves at BfL were Rangers up on the wall. Maybe if Lor sent more troops we could have held UC without having to resort to blighting and raising

[Goshom-wyrmrest-accord]

You are arguing with a obvious troll XD

[Ariël-drakkari (Ariël)]

I think I’ve mentioned this lots of times, but these are sad times indeed when the pro-slavery Goblin and the elf that wanted to GTFO a couple of years back are better candidates for the job.

[Rikiya-velen]

Raising mindless undead? I point to you back to the Val’kyr who states that only the willing can be raised.

This is freaking killing me.

I consider THIS to be the absolute biggest, stumbling, idiotic Lore Assassination they’ve committed in years.

Yes, I get it. Its supposedly canon now. Unless its a lie to pacify those who’d be concerned by raising people unwillingly (because suddenly Sylvanas or the Valkyr care about PR), its apparently a thing now.

Then I look across the boat and see LILLIAN FREAKING VOSS standing there in direct contradiction to this entire statement. Her entire back story that WE PLAY THROUGH involves her being raised, immediately freaking the hell out, immediately being scared and having no clue what the frell is going on, and having to learn to cope with it. There is no way she was raised “willingly”.

I also am pretty sure I remember back in Cata that there was the option of, “If you dont want to be Undead, you can just be put back in the grave…” THIS LITERALLY IMPLIES THE CHOICE ISNT MADE BEFOREHAND!

I’d go ask those poor Horde souls meandering aimlessly in the blight in front of Undercity, but they attack EVERYONE. Alliance and Horde. Did they willingly come back to be that way? To not even have the mental capacity not to attack the Red Team?! I highly doubt it. (and if they’re supposedly just “soulless wandering monsters” and not who they used to be raise in undeath, I remind you Blizz made it canon that you need a soul to have an undead… … unless I read that one wrong, the retconning is leaving me dizzy)

AND. AAAAAAND. Why were the Forsaken so angry at Arthas all this time? Clearly they wanted to be raised to serve him in the Scourge. Geez. (Edit: Unless the implication is that the Val’kyr can only raise someone if they’re willing)

Pushing this new “Only the willing are raised into Undeath” canon re-write is the new pinnacle of lore stumbles. I actually want a Retcon of this retcon.

/end rant (sorry guys, I needed to vent that out)

[Goshom-wyrmrest-accord]

Dude, I understand, it sucks, but what I am trying to make that troll see that as uch as it sucks, it is lore and is canon now. I agree, stupid and you have Lilian try to explain why some people go bonkers bananas the way they do, apparently the ressurection messes with your mind, and perhaps, and I am trying to benefit it. Perhaps it is how the question is asked: Do you want to be raised and live again? Doesn’t sound so bad when the alternative is whatever hell-hole the Naaru and the Void have in store for you.

[Akiyass-moon-guard (Akiyass)]

I was under the impression that Willing resurrection is a Night Elf thing? Something like, because of their connection to the Emerald Dream and Elune or something…

… Which, kind of already contradicts Night Elf Death Knights still so…

Sigh idk man.

[Ponex-moon-guard (Ponex)]

Well they definitely weren’t talking about Arthas since the only wholesome undead he ever made was his horse.

[Rikiya-velen]

… Which, kind of already contradicts Night Elf Death Knights still so…

Right!?

Delaryn I can somewhat understand, as it would emphasize Sylvanas killing her hope in her last moments before death. The horror she saw in her last few breaths could have driven her soul insane and made her a more agreeable participant.

But the others?! That has to be the worst internal dialogue of anyone they’ve written into the story: “I’m so angry about the events that led to my death and the burning down of my home that I am going to let them raise me from the dead and kill whats left of my people in service to the people who killed me and burned down my home!”

… Worst. Vengeful spirits. Ever.

[Echeyneahok-wyrmrest-accord (Echeyneahok)]

Sylvanas murdered a bunch of high-ranking officials who were breaking the treaty. There was nowhere said that they could leave, they were told they could meet their families. That is it. No one said they were allowed to desert their positions. She executed traitors. She didn’t murder people, seeing how you can see that the Alliance people all were allowed to run away. (And now, that Instigator does not count as Alliance, if she did, then it would have been another Alliance aggression to add to the list, inciting a coup among the enemy populace)

Allow me to make a correction here. She did murder people, her people in fact. True she kept her word and did not harm any alliance humans. But she did not simply kill the “traitors”. She killed everyone! Even those turning back after she had had enough. Did they do so out of Fear or Loyalty? It didn’t matter all were left dead from her dark rangers.

Which is quite hypocritical, seeing how the Alliance started this war and that he is best busom buddies with one of these Warmongers.

Did they, did they really? I mean Saurfang is correct, they did come for us, all of them. Sylvanas started “This War” with the War of Thorns and Burning of Teldrassil. You could argue that it is retaliation for something the alliance did but it’s not. It was Sylvanas being Sylvanas. There was no reason to burn the Tree filled with civilians other than for malice. Because one Elf said the wrong thing. It had nothing to do with Malfurion though that head cannon works for some.

Funny, Taurjo comes up a lot with regards to Baine, but are we not seeing parallels here with Teldrassil? I mean the World tree could be seen as a much more viable military target than some village in the Barrens. Just the same the attack on the village was not planed by alliance military but a rogue group. Just the same the “Warriors” were gone and only civilians remained. Civilians that were burned alive with no option for escape.

[Pyrano-area-52 (Pyrano)]

This is where the Horde Players and obviously MANY of the Horde Leaders are at right now and I have no idea why this seems to mystify some people. Not everyone casts aside morality and honor so easily, and honor can be a very different concept to different people. To Baine, Sylvanas has repeatedly gone too far and made too many amoral decisions. To a Pragmatist or someone who’s honor is based more in loyalty than morality, Baine is a traitor and Sylvanas is doing what she has to do to win.

You are free to look at this any way you want. Support Sylvanas if you want, I do not fault you. But do not disparage the values of those who believe in a moral honor code for the Horde and do not support the methods Sylvanas has employed. To them, the Horde stands for something, and Sylvanas’ actions thus far have led them away from that something.

Thank you!

[Paulde-moon-guard]

Baine sucks, lol.

[anon95961490]

Baine is epic. Was cracking up when he was smashing on those Dark Rangers and then when he pointed his finger at Sylvanas telling her off. Then he marched off like a boss.

[Mediarama-rivendare (Mediarama)]

Here’s to hoping for a public execution where they lop off his traitorous head.

[Hahahahahaha-grizzly-hills (Hahahahahaha)]

Anything you can whine about Baine, I can name 2 things Sylvanas has done that actually hurt the Horde.

Sylvanas’ “traitorous actions” are arguably For The Horde
Baine’s “traitorous actions” are arguably For Anduin, Jaina, and The Alliance

[Trivelfrank-wyrmrest-accord (Trivelfrank)]

Sylvanas actions are not for the Horde. They are for herself. Being the scourge 2.0 doesn’t help the Horde. The real traitors are those who defend Sylvanas instead of the Horde.

Here’s to hoping for a public execution where they lop off his traitorous head.

You’re a Blood Elf. Seeing you Blood Elves acting like total loyalists to the Horde is just completely cringe. You don’t even want to look the part as Horde… You’re practically an Alliance race masquerading as Horde.

[Mediarama-rivendare (Mediarama)]

You’re a Blood Elf.

I’m actually a human. We’re in the story forum, not the world’s end tavern, direct your RP silliness there.

[anon95961490]

nope this isn’t a gotcha. you post on these forums with a chosen character and its fair for people to point out what you’re posting as and how it relates to your opinions.