I always wonder why people think Baine is lame.
And then I remember these people are the same who are so basic as to think: “Ooh if evil or insane then interesting, if good then boring.”
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Tauren specifically were assigned to silithus iirc due to the sword during the war of thorns, they werent involved with the tree burning. Because sylvanas knew it would cause issues
Except he did exactly zero fighting for his people when Sylvanas was actively murdering them.
Not sure how its relevant to anything I said?
Why didn’t he take actions earlier? Why did he wait until it would mostly benefit the Alliance to take actions? This is my issue.
And you keep looking at him in rose colored glasses.
Pot meet kettle.
Once again. Tell me how well written he is to suggest surrender…at the funeral of the king the Alliance just killed?
I give him crap for being poorly written.
They had so much potential to have Baine stand up for the Horde for him to take actions specifically for the Horde.
It was wise advice to say…AT THE FUNERAL “Hey, you know the people that just killed your dad? And I know you are currently morning him right this very second. We should surrender to them”
Except this isn’t true.
The way people want to demonize anyone that doesn’t like Baine is amazing.
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Odd that this is barely represented within the game - in fact, outright contradicted by the presence of several Tauren mobs. But nice to hear someone, somewhere, at least considered it. 
I always see people who hate Baine come with this generic sentence:
- Lol you can have him. He supports/likes Alliance. He’s too peaceful.
Same people like Cairne who was more or less like Baine except he didn’t openly support the Alliance.
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Sadly many on the Horde side can only handle playing by emotion:
Hulk angry. Hulk smash.
This is why I barely play the Horde anymore after 14 years of maining Horde. Mostly Tauren…
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Your only point you keep repeatimg is the funeral scene.
Honestly it wasnt nearly as bad as you make it out to be.
Furth his “betrayal” that wasmt actually a betrayal didnt just do it when it endangered alliance.
Sylvanas literally going scourge 2.0 was the trigger. Your completely ignoring that point to the point its comical
It wasnt derek that drove that, it was -literally- sylvanas adapting scourge tactics and trying to make the horde scourge 2.0 that did it.
You need to stop ignoring that fact and trying to twist it into being pro alliance.
That was a pro azeroth move. Period
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Exactly.
Some of the Baine haters (not all) are just zero beyond their “He supports alliance so he’s useless or boring”.
What’s wrong in doing something for Azeroth? Unable to think beyond “Oh he likes Alliance” is just childish.
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Because Sylvannas was pushing to throw their only strength away in a vain attempt at retribution.
Ever notice many of the Baine haters wish they had Cairne back?
Yet none of them play Tauren enough to see when Cairne told Baine how proud of him he was. Proud of his actions. - See Tauren Heritage armor quest line.
BTW - I loved Cairne, but I also love Baine. Honestly I loved all of the OG Horde leaders and even tolerated OG Sylvanas (before Cata). Somewhere later the Horde went from good guy monsters into we need to be evil monster because we look like it.
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These people have no idea about Cairne. They just see the Horde symbol on Cairne and think OMG good.
These are the same people who can’t use common sense to understand why Blizzard makes villains a lot more from the Horde.
They sign up for Horde because the Horde is interesting (a mixed bag of good, evil, deranged, insane, anti-hero) and make pikachu faces when their faction has the bigger chance of producing more villains compared to their “good two shoes boring Alliance”.
They’re just ignorant.
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And I am pretty sure I have said none of that.
I am fine with Baine being peaceful as a rule of thumb.
I was not fine with Baine being peaceful while Sylvanas killed his kin and he just muttered “for the Horde”.
I was not fine with the entire storyline being cooked up where it took the Alliance being threatened for Baine not to be peaceful. In my perfect world, that entire storyline would have been changed to have effected the Horde more directly and tangibly.
I was not fine with Baine’s idea of “peace” being that he should suggest surrender at a funeral right after an Alliance attack.
Baine can be peaceful and push for peace and I’d be 100% behind him.
I did not like the writing they gave him in BFA.
Except its not. I have regularly pointed out multiple scenes.
Almost as comical as how you ignore almost everything I said.
So bring it up after the funeral?
I saw that.
Notice how most of the Baine Supporters play Alliance yet get mad if you say Baine is pro Alliance?
Bigger chance?
Basically the only chance.
Horde has had a consistent WarChief rotation for over a decade.
Alliance is always painted in the better light.
Alliance almost did something mean during BFA, but forum outcry made them literally change the quest so they were nice again.
Pot meet kettle.
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So basically you want Baine to fight back against Sylvanas who was in fact the catalyst for the War and you just mald over the fact that he suggested a surrender because it was the Alliance who once again acted like a mature brother instead of seeking to destroy the Horde.
Yeah you’re basically raging because it’s the Alliance. The Horde in it’s entirety was complicit in each crime Sylvanas did. You don’t get to say the old “Hey but our warchief isn’t the Horde” every damn time.
About time you people knocked some common sense into your heads and think why Baine would do that.
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See what I mean? A typical Horde player who has no idea what his faction is truly about while whining about “But Alliance are never villains”.
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Why would I play Horde when the writer love Sylvanas and hate Tauren?
Why would I play Horde when most of the players love Sylvanas and hate Baine?
What would I continue to play Horde when the Horde is no longer good guy monsters and turned into generic evil looking villains?
The lure of the Horde from Vanilla to Cata was that we look like monsters that are honorable good guys. Thats gone forever.
Metzen wrote a good game. The people that destroyed what he wrote (like the devs who couldn’t understand the difference between Scourge and Forsaken) have ruined the Horde except for edgy angsty emo Kill the Alliance players.
Faction were stupid in 2004 and should have been destroyed long ago. Give me EQ faction system anyway over WoWs.
I wouldn’t play anything other than a Tauren.
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I wanted Baine to fight back against Sylvanas, and I disliked the writing they used for him in BFA.
I have never once stated “hey but our warchief isn’t Horde”.
You can’t be this dense.
This isn’t what I am saying at all, in any way, whatsoever.
Are you able to communicate without putting words in my mouth?
Is any one that is pro-Baine able to communicate?
Someone says they don’t like Baine and yall just take over the rest of the conversation. Making up an entire negative backstory for anyone that didn’t like Baine’s writing.
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Except that Sylvannas was pressing Telanji to throw away her only strength AT the funeral. Baine can see the writing on the wall and he tried preventing the obvious from happening.
Why are you getting so hung up on the funeral?
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Because I think its a pretty silly thing to say “Hey, you know the guys that just invaded your homeland and killed your dad? Our next course of action should be to surrender to these people”.
Any talk of that should be tempered for post-funeral.
This is called “bad writing”.
I am not saying Baine was horrible for suggesting diplomatic talks. I am saying he was written badly in how this went down.
This is an example of bad writing that people are choosing to largely ignore. So I keep bringing it up.
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No. It’s exactly what you said. Your own words into your own mouth.
I’ll say the same thing to you: You shouldn’t be this dense with your “Me Horde me Hate anything which equals Alliance even if it is for the good of Azeroth”.
It is this misunderstanding you people have of your faction as to why you get disappointed why Blizzard makes you villains again and again.
You didn’t sign up for your headcannon “noble savages”. You signed up for a faction which has a little of everything like I stated: good, evil, bad, insane, anti-hero. It’s about time you knocked some sense into yourself.
The Horde would be a bunch of boring nobodys if they are just “noble savages”. It’s about time you people realize that.
Ok.
So can you show me where I said “hey, but our warchief isn’t Horde”?
Because I didn’t see it.