Lol of course you would. But when everyone you talk to ends up with the same opinion, at some point you need to look inward instead thinking that the problem is everyone else…
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Funny, that is the exact argument I’m using about why AV isn’t doing well for the Alliance. But part of me feels like you wont feel like a big-boy unless you get the last word and last jab in…so go for it i guess.
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He does this in every thread he is in. Just ignore him, he will always have to get the last word in, regardless of fact or intent.
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Yup, seems that way. He is even going to do it right in the face of the taunt to do so…he cannot help himself.
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Think I’ve said that motivations being different is probably the biggest influence as to what drives the effort of alliance players.
But there still is a map disadvantage. Sure it can be overcome with effort and gameplay. But it’s exhausting. And why should I bother considering with little effort I am still achieving the goal as to why I am there?
You wanted to talk about the map. And when I cornered you about disadvantages on comparable elements you changed the conversation.
Do do you now want to talk motivations?
Please tell me, what stopped the horde from making premades with 100% speed mounts? What stopped the horde from having all level 60 geared players?
Alliance was using the tools and resource to do better.
This word cheated when it comes to premades still baffles me. Alliance was using a voice system to communicate with each other. You do know horde had the same opportunity to do so, right? Please explain.
It’s not the community. It’s you.
Let me apply your logic to another AV topic. Were premades really a problem? It’s hard to tell since horde gave up as soon as they realized it was a premade. Maybe if horde had played start to finish, premades would have been fine.
Don’t even deny horde gave up against premades. We’ve all seen it said on these forums so it has to be as true as your belief that alliance give up.
Then you proceed to tell us the premades are why horde gave up but we ignore it just keep repeating that if horde had not gave up, maybe premades would be fine.
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I appreciate you actually trying to reason with the argument.
But I would argue the Horde didn’t give up in the face of Alliance premades, in fact the hate towards “turtling” and how unskillful it was became a hot topic.
But in the end, what matters is that Blizzard thought Alliance premades were bad for one reason or the other and decided to do something about it. If Blizzard things the map really is an issue here, then they have every right to do something about it too.
But don’t insult people for having a different opinion. Even if its one you simply cannot fathom. Calling them a liar and calling them disingenuous is antithetical to having a conversation. If you don’t like the argument, just say “I disagree” and move on.
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Alliance haven’t given up either
We’ve just started grief turtling too at SPGY, which is why you see the sudden uptick in horde backfill QQ
Like clockwork
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You nailed it.
Horde did give up. Horde players admitted as much on these forums. How can we tell how bad premades are if horde are giving up?
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I will engage your hypothetical.
Fundamentally, i think I would agree. If the Horde were giving up at the same ratio as today’s Alliance are…i think it would be extremely difficult to tell if Alliance premades were balanced or not. If the Horde had a defeatist mindset simply said “its no longer worth playing” or “I’m here for the rep and then i’ll /afk out” I would completely agree, there is no way to tell how bad Alliance premades were for the Horde.
I think the rate at which Horde did become non-participatory is up for debate…and that is a reasonable debate to have.
But I also don’t think that Blizzard killed Alliance premade for balance reasons. I think they killed them because of player-griefing. And since the majority of changes made to classic have been targeted at stopping griefing, it would be completely consistent.
horde can reach our GY before Alliance can reach theirs. seems to be the consensus of the main problem.
Also usually brought up is the two choke points into their base but we have the bridge is the counter argument to that (its longer but not as narrow so take that how you will)
Bridge isn’t a choke point because of the back door.
Although I do recall that alliance can jump a fence back in vanilla when I played horde.
They can also climb a waterfall but that takes either 200iq or slowfall to be consistent
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I’ve actually seen 2 different pathways up behind the cliffs to the aid station so the bridge choke is junked now.
If we both flat out race, I think we reach SFGY ramp at the same time roughly. Which I “think” was the goal of the original map designer.
There’s 3 that people use consistently
Honestly if the RH backdoor was even twice as hard as ours, you’d see alliance doing it
The fact of the matter is that most horde can’t do the RH backdoor, while most alliance can easily do the DB backdoor just from watching horde every game
Yeah I really never used this back door during vanilla. Or I have no memory of it. I was a healer though so I was always in the back of the main pack…
But it’s fairly easy to do. And considering Blizzard removed some of the wall jumping paths yet left these ones…one has to assume this is what’s intended.
Oh Blizzard!
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This dude has spent this entire thread for the last 24 hours it’s been up arguing with everyone who disagrees with him. Something something Alliance are the problem and reason why we suck.
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