Are Arathi good because they're racist zealot HUMAN villains, or bad because humans get more spotlight?

[Gothicist-moon-guard]

@Dreadmoore-wyrmrest-accord

Your ancient tweet is second hand information. Even if it was officially canon (and it literally never was), new lore trumps old lore.

Conveniently that you focused on that, and that alone, instead of also where I brought up Heartlands. You know, the book that’s even more recent lore than Anduin mentioning the ancient Arathi.

We send their armies our grain while the Stromic starve. We send them our fighters while our children grow up not knowing their storied legacy

“The 7th Legion, the Stromic army!” The raider’s wolf mount rose up on its hind legs and howled at the rising moons. “They march! We are under attack!”

While it was reasonable to expect the citizens of Stromgarde had retired for the night, there was also no sign of the 7thLegion or Stromic army below.

The Mag’har leader, still on her mount, was perhaps half a mile distant, her axe swinging as she fought off one hapless Stromic soldier who dared get too close.

She was in a farmstead—a human one. It seemed she’d been swept some distance from Go’Shek, to Stromic holdings.

The 7th Legion were mighty, but even before the battle Geya’rah knew the Stromic were fewer in number.

“There will be no battle here! There is no honor in this slaughter! The Kor’kron and Mag’har will hold. I call upon the 7th Legion and Stromic army to do the same!”

It also illuminated the terrible cost of the fight. She could see bodies
strewn across the Highlands, many fallen on both sides—Stromic, Mag’har, 7th Legion, and Kor’kron.

Jaina stepped to one side as Danath Trollbane walked out onto the field, leaders of the Stromic army following close behind

Marran took a step toward Jaina, but was restrained by a Stromic captain.

I know you don’t like having your headcanon challenged, but fact of the matter is, Anduin isn’t speaking of the modern day Stromic. He’s speaking of the ancient Empire and the Tribe, both of whom have fallen into nothingness by this point. Before we reach Hallowfall Anduin comments on the Earthen calling him Arathi.

Anduin Wrynn says: Some of them have been calling me Arathi. Like the ancient human empire. I… wonder how they know of it.

If the Stromic were called Arathi, why would Anduin say they are calling him Arathi like the ancient human empire?

[Zerde-sargeras (Zerde)]

Good. The Alliance are good guys and should be focused on trying to actually make the world better. Yes it may stumble every now and then but it is still probably one of the greatest institution of good on Azeroth.

[Liangni-azshara]

@Gothicist-moon-guard

It’s the first time we hear of it because they are in the Storming Seas, a place so treacherous that barely even dragons fly over it. And yes, such magical shenanigans happen all the time, including visions.

No this is a lazy plot device…just to in the same time add a new landmass and still have more humans…

Also the vision thing…this was stolen to draenei, because having vision of the Light was a Velen thing, but heee why not make humans have it too.

@Gothicist-moon-guard

Almost as though that wasn’t by chance, is it?

Its again lazy plot device, you try to say it like if it was rp or lore, but in a creative level its lazy.

@Gothicist-moon-guard

Stromgarde was rebuilt in 1 year, all of the Kingdom of Stormwind in less than 10. Teldrassil with all of its cities was built in a few years, Theramore in 1, Orgrimmar in a similar timeframe. It’s hardly an issue.

So bascially you use bad precedents to justify bad lore…Teldrasil was a bs thing, it always was, look just how the building look old as if they were here for centuries, like full of moss and all, you clearly would not have such looking building in few years.

Stormwind is more realistic, and its ONE city that got REBUILD which mean it was not rebuilt from scratch.

You cant compare rebuilding with already existing stones and landscape with building from scratche.

Theramore again, its one tiny city…look just the size of the building in Hallowfall.

@Gothicist-moon-guard

The reason why is explicitly given? Beledar started shifting and with it came many creatures like the Karbyss, making the journey so difficult that none who tried to venture to the Earthen returned.

Ho yes, you remind me of a 6th point that make them even more inconsistent : their shadow faith, if we consider it date from the moment when Sargeras stabbed the world with his sword, which is the moment when Beledar shifted for the frist time it means that faith is less than 10y old…which thus makes no sense that 1st we have so little info about it, like who started it? who is the messiah behind is, and also well…it cant be so strong, you can take any real world faith and you will see that it cant be so spread out in less than 10y…its just so poorly made and also a reason why having the arathi being here for so little time is bad writing.

@Gothicist-moon-guard

There’s plenty of elven things amongst their culture. Their culture, ultimately, is neither human nor elven but simply Arathi.

I love how you tell me there is plenty of elven thing in their culture but dont mention any…so go on tell me what elven things are there.

@Gothicist-moon-guard

They’re also not racist.

They are, read the quests in the isl of Dorn, the Arathi guy constantly tells you that you are “not an arathi” even in the siren isl they remind you that you are not an arathi, they are racisit.

But coming from a Scarlet Crusader rp’er i am not surprised to see such blind take.

@Shredow-wyrmrest-accord

People cry for years that WoW just rehashes lore infinitely. They finally write a new major faction with the Arathi

As if taking yet another human kingdom is “new lore” lol its the ARATHI as if the name did not exist before.

@Shredow-wyrmrest-accord

and then people cry that they “came out of nowhere” even when they’re coming from an area we’ve never seen before.

Because that area itself come out of nowhere.

@Adelaide-proudmoore

I haven’t seen people complaining about the Nerubians or Earthen in TWW coming out of nowhere even though they are completely new lore.

Exactly, and the same problem is with Nerubians, as you cant really explain how they came from Northrend, like they dug under sea to come here? Since Nerubians did not exist yet at some points.

@Shredow-wyrmrest-accord

They aren’t overrepresented in the story at all. You literally can’t overrepresent humans in any story. You know why? Because humans write and consume said story. Absolutely nonsense. Humans are always going to be the default PoV for any work that has them. Complaining about it is just sad cope.

Hum, interesting point, but it dont really makes sense, what i mean by that is, we dont need to have more humans, look at Legion, where are the humans? Its mainly elves.

@Solarion-wyrmrest-accord

Uh… I don’t think the Arathi are racist?

Read the quests, you will see that they consider all who are not arathi to be inferior to them, you just have to read quests.

Oh and, there is the dungeon too, when they are completly being full like “conquer all the lesser races!!!”

@Shredow-wyrmrest-accord

People conflate them with the Scarlets because their primary color scheme is red and white and they worship the light. I do think the Arathi are going to be antagonists at one point, but it’ll be because they’re imperialistic light zealots, not because they’re racist.

Cought cought have you done the dungeon? How would you dare to tell me that that dungeon is not a re-mashing of the scarlet monastery?

@Galenar-khazgoroth

You know as soon as the Arathi Empire show up they’ll be pure evil and their offshoot that estranged from them in Hallowfall will take up the mantle of morally pure good guys who stand against their kin then join the Alliance.

You already have the teasing of that in the dungeon.

[Mopawl-wyrmrest-accord]

Here these two go again…

[Karestae-moon-guard]

@Mopawl-wyrmrest-accord

Here these two go again

Want some popcorn? I got plenty

[Alynsa-wyrmrest-accord]

@Dreadmoore-wyrmrest-accord

Arathi Highlanders

there can be only one…

[Gothicist-moon-guard]

@Liangni-azshara

No this is a lazy plot device…just to in the same time add a new landmass and still have more humans…

Arathi, not humans.

@Liangni-azshara

Also the vision thing…this was stolen to draenei, because having vision of the Light was a Velen thing, but heee why not make humans have it too.

Humans have had visions since before draenei came around.

@Liangni-azshara

Its again lazy plot device, you try to say it like if it was rp or lore, but in a creative level its lazy.

It’s a mystery.

@Liangni-azshara

So bascially you use bad precedents to justify bad lore…Teldrasil was a bs thing, it always was, look just how the building look old as if they were here for centuries, like full of moss and all, you clearly would not have such looking building in few years.

I’m not justifying it, merely pointing out that this is the norm of WoW’s lore. If your biggest issue is “They built too much in too short of a time”, then, well, Blizzard has done this since Warcraft 3.

@Liangni-azshara

Stormwind is more realistic, and its ONE city that got REBUILD which mean it was not rebuilt from scratch.

Old Town is the only place in Stormwind that wasn’t rebuilt from scratch, hence the name Old Town. And it isn’t just one city, the entire kingdom was rebuilt.

@Liangni-azshara

Theramore again, its one tiny city…look just the size of the building in Hallowfall.

Because Theramore was made in 2004, when the game couldn’t handle too many big locations without breaking. If they made Theramore today, it would be as big if not bigger than Mereldar. And all of it in 2 years as opposed to nearly 2 decades.

@Liangni-azshara

Beledar shifted for the frist time it means that faith is less than 10y old…which thus makes no sense that 1st we have so little info about it, like who started it?

Or that’s part of the upcoming story? Why would they reveal everything immediately?

@Liangni-azshara

I love how you tell me there is plenty of elven thing in their culture but dont mention any…so go on tell me what elven things are there.

Their culture is distinctly Arathi, a hybridisation of human and elven. Can you point to anything that isn’t elven in their culture?

@Liangni-azshara

They are, read the quests in the isl of Dorn, the Arathi guy constantly tells you that you are “not an arathi” even in the siren isl they remind you that you are not an arathi, they are racisit.

I’m not sure saying “You are not Arathi” is a racist thing. Plenty of similar things are stated all over the game.

@Liangni-azshara

But coming from a Scarlet Crusader rp’er i am not surprised to see such blind take.

Also not a Scarlet RPer, I just like the mog. This character is in actuality RPed as an Alteraci loyal to the Alliance and a devout follower of the Three Virtues.

[Karestae-moon-guard]

@Gothicist-moon-guard

Their culture is distinctly Arathi, a hybridisation of human and elven. Can you point to anything that isn’t elven in their culture?

Point to something, ANYTHING, that screams elven. You did make the claim first after all.

[Drahliana-earthen-ring (Drahliana)]

@Waredrin-moon-guard

I’m seeing a lot of people ask for less humans in the story but also inversely want more humans with thoroughly human aesthetics to be evil.

You’ve missed the point. Horde players simply want more representation in the story period. They want Horde leaders to have their share of story moments. The only activity they’ve had so far is Thrall giving some minor help to the calling of stormrooks.

All the important stuff has been Anduin, Allleria, Khadgar, and Jaina. The only reason we haven’t seen Tyrande is that she’s been making up for 13,000 years of forced abstince.

[Drahliana-earthen-ring (Drahliana)]

@Gothicist-moon-guard

Their culture is distinctly Arathi, a hybridisation of human and elven. Can you point to anything that isn’t elven in their culture?

What’s “elven” besides the ears? There literally is no other trace of elven infuence, not in customs, clothing, or architecture.

[Gavik-zuljin (Gavik)]

Cat mounts. That’s pretty much it.

[Karestae-moon-guard]

@Gavik-zuljin

Cat mounts. That’s pretty much it

The Lynx is an awesome looking mount though. Gotta give blizz that

It’s soo fluffy!

[Gothicist-moon-guard]

@Karestae-moon-guard

Point to something, ANYTHING, that screams elven. You did make the claim first after all.

A lot of them have elven-ish names, their architecture (including airships) are like a mixture of human and elven architecture, as are plenty of their weapon designs and objects in general. They have a grasp and knowledge of magic that goes beyond that of humans barring Dalaran.

[Kaileath-wyrmrest-accord]

Their holy flame is also a strangely close analog to the Sunwell as well, to the point it is a manifestation of the same twin forces of Light and Arcane (order).

[Gothicist-moon-guard]

To the point that Lady Liadrin points out their ways of wielding the Light is more comparable to the Blood Knights than it is the Church of the Holy Light.

Writing them off merely as human is akin to just looking at their human models.

[Alynsa-wyrmrest-accord]

@Gothicist-moon-guard

their architecture (including airships) are like a mixture of human and elven architecture

Eh, I don’t see it. I see very human buildings. The airships? Very human-looking to me. We don’t even see elvish airships.

I dunno, everything I see with the Arathi would fit in very well among the EK humans.

@Gothicist-moon-guard

They have a grasp and knowledge of magic

Uhm, don’t they not have a lot of mages though? I might be missing something, but I do not see much magic there beyond holy light stuff.

I could be missing quite a lot in all this, but I’m just really not seeing it on a surface level. I see the Arathi and think “this all looks as human-like as the Kul Tirans and Gilneans when they were first introduced”. I don’t see anything that screams or even whispers much elf-influence.

[Kaileath-wyrmrest-accord]

They are Warcraft’s version of Elder Scroll’s Bretons. That’s how I tend to view them anyways. They are a large enough population they ceased being applicable to the trope of “Shunned outsider who fits in no culture” that you see with half elves—They became their own dominant culture in their homeland where everyone has human and elven ancestry, but neither original species seem to be around anymore.

[Spyrn-wyrmrest-accord]

@Alynsa-wyrmrest-accord

Uhm, don’t they not have a lot of mages though? I might be missing something, but I do not see much magic there beyond holy light stuff.

There’s only one mage in Hallowfall but he says that’s just because the others died when they crashed. There’s presumably a fair amount back in Avaloren.

Though I agree they don’t have any elf aesthetics outside the lynxes.

[Karestae-moon-guard]

@Spyrn-wyrmrest-accord

There’s only one mage in Hallowfall but he says that’s just because the others died when they crashed. There’s presumably a fair amount back in Avaloren.

That mage is also murdered soon as he discovers the means to open a portal back to the mainland

[Renat-moon-guard (Renat)]

The Arathi are just not boring Lordaeron/Stormwind humans. Shout outs to the plague for making Lordaeron more interesting than it ever had any right to be.

Bigger shout outs to Kul Tirans for being actually cool.