Anyone else repudiate M+?

I get that. I feel the same way about raiding.

My advice: don’t do things in a game that aren’t fun for you.

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Idk I feel like healing m+ is the most chill thing I have done.
I’m weird though and find being a dps too be very stressful in m+.

I’m sorry you don’t enjoy M+. My two cents why I enjoy it:

I’ve had expansions without M+ with dungeons I hated (WoD, Cata) and with dungeons I loved ( Wrath, MoP). With or without the LFD tool, the problem was always the same: once you get to cap, the content is mostly relevant for 3 weeks at the start of the expansion, unless they add new dungeons, and then later on with incentives (badges, CTA) but that’s it. In Warlords, I was basically done with PVE content by the first month or so (not counting LFR, which I did partake in) and after that I would just loop around and start a new alt. That sucked for me, as I haven’t raided since 3.3.5 basically.

I’ve had expansions with M+ dungeons that I hated (BfA) and with dungeons I loved (Legion; Shadowlands is a mix for me) and even with BfA, I prefer the option that the content remains somewhat relevant for me. It keeps the content relevant for much longer.

As for the effect it’s had on the playerbase, I dunno man…I remember the game before LFD, and I remember the game immediately when LFD was introduced. YMMV and all that which means I either am/was a HORRIBLE tank, or the server I was playing in was just the worst (Cairne Alliance) but I had my fair share of toxicity back in wrath.

I don’t think M+ would scale to raiding or leveling. For one, Mythic raiding is exclusive enough, and whomsoever wants a challenge while leveling in open world can just start taking gear off.

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Mythic + highest gear is obtained with +15 keys. What you do past that is purely optional and not necessary. I’m not judging Mythic + difficulty based on the highest keys since there is no ceiling.

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I do too, I heal them on 3 characters but I loathe when one of my friends wants to try healing and I have to DPS.

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There are people who dislike M+ and don’t do it, so yes you aren’t alone.

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It’s not just about properly playing in M+ as I mentioned. It’s also about not ruining the route, getting quickly from A to B and it’s just a really hectic atmosphere in my opinion. Every step is contributing to the timer, even sitting down for a few seconds to drink something. In the raid I don’t have this pressure. It’s just a much more chill environment where after a wipe we don’t have to rush back to the boss like “gogogo, pull in 5, we’re a few seconds behind guuuuys - healer drink while we’re pulling”.

Well, it’s a really subjective thing. :smile: Some people I know really enjoy M+ and just don’t get why I don’t like it or can’t understand THAT I don’t like it. Every week I have to listen to several pleas how it’s sooo easy and fun and how I should think about the gear that I’m taking from the raid while others do the extra work… sigh

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I have always counted up to 20. That’s just how I have always viewed m+.

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When it comes to M+, everyone’s mileage varies. But that shouldn’t discourage people from trying it.

I’ve pugged this entire season, and I’d say 90%, if not 95% were normal runs of people just playing together who like the mode. Some runs had a-holes. Some died right at the start after the tank bit off more than he could chew and proceeded to blame everyone else.

It happens. But at the same time, the chances of playing with any of those people again is slim.

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Nobody tell her. :grimacing:

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Okay buddy guy.
:ok_hand:

#HashtagDab

Considering both in-game power and prestige rewards go up to 20 (278 Conduits), 20 is absolutely a more important threshold to look at than 15s in terms of “completing M+”. You aren’t done until you’re done. You’re not done raiding when you get AOTC or Duelist, and you’re not done with M+ until you hit KSH.

Beyond that, then you can say it is fluff.

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I also count up to 20. I usually stop about there because it’s more than enough to secure getting into whatever 15 I want and helping the group rock it for the rest of the patch, almost guaranteeing max vault ilvl every week. But I might do some more 21/22 this patch because I’d like those 278 conduits eventually. My key is a 22 TOP right now and as a pug-only player, I don’t see it happening! Hopefully someday.

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I actually enjoy m+ a lot! I don’t do high level keys, just single digit keys with friends.

We really enjoy it and as we are pretty casual we are always getting upgrades. The progression feels good.

The way the affix’s change the the dungeon feel is also fun.

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You are not alone.

Ever since M+ became a thing, we have less and less dungeons per expansion, and i’m afraid raids are becoming to standardized.

In WoD, M+ where challenging and you were done, you could repeat them for fun, but since then all dungeons become a pool of 4-5 bosses with a linear path, rinse and repeat.

We won’t have any other Halls of reflection, no other dungeon similar to stratholme or the scarlet halls.

Why can’t we have dungeons with 1-2 bosses, and others with 5-6, more variety. Same goes for raids.

The amount of potential to tell a story in different landscapes is immense

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world time gate inc in 10.0.

I think it’s the rush rush rush nature of it due to the timer making you feel like you need to keep moving. When you don’t move you feel like you’re wasting time and won’t time it. Then if/when you don’t you beat yourself up over the mistakes you made.

I had a lot of fun early on with guildies pushing keys regardless of whether we won or lost because the difficulty curve of the dungeons was fun to do despite the timer, not because of it. I actually think the plaguefall dungeon might be my favorite, specifically because of the last boss. We had an epiphany at one point when we realized the tank add spawn was always a safe spot from her tentacle smash.

Having to learn the dungeon mechanics at a high level was genuinely fun. Personally wish the timer would get removed and each boss would drop loot rather than a chest at the end. Let the timer remain, but have the relevancy on the level of minesweeper so that the competitive people can still track it, and then maybe in order to do keys past a certain level you have to complete previous key levels.

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That is basically all of shadowlands hahahah, we had the main four zones end game quest hidden behind an anima grind.

On the Maw it was the eye thing. Korthia had the research… which won’t work, mainly because of 2 things, grind and add ons (or the community) killing the exploration.

Zereth Mortis ?.. you mean grind the entire table to be able to see all the quest on the zone…

I mean, MoP was hell of a grind, but at least the rep hubs had their story told there and had plenty of quest since day 1

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Speaking from personal experience, nothing changed. It’s been this way as long as I’ve played.

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I haven’t looked at it this way until I read your post. I think you might be right, yeah.

I would also love to have some dungeons that encourage a bit of exploration, have events with “waves” and small timed events like in Culling of Stratholme or Halls of Reflection. Something like the basic Stratholme or old Scholomance would be so great… but nowadays every dungeon is designed with M+ in mind because it’s cheap extra content. I would love to have dungeons that don’t translate in M+ and just stand on their own.

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