But that is the classic experience for hybrids.
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I had a post way up higher saying my guild had everything up to Naxx on Farm and I remember doing first boss Naxx, but that was it. Pretty sure it was close to BC release and everyone just stopped.
So no, I had next to no Naxx experience.
I just remember needing priests with enough +hit for mind control for something.
100%. I’m an officer in my guild and we’re vetting memespecs very hard. We accept exceptional players on the classes, but if they suck, they suck and we make them go heals. I’m not saying that raids should bring garbage memespec players. I smack talk other rets in my discord more than I smack talk horde or anybody else.
Bad rets and other memespecs are legitimate sandbag players. I wont argue that. I’m an advanced player with a handful of retail CEs and naxx raiding under my belt, both in the last 2 years. It’s not realistic to expect many ret players to know what they’re doing or have the level of understanding in the spec that I do.
My whole point is to say that it’s possible, and viable, with effort.
Maybe for you. If that’s the case, I genuinely am sorry. I really mean that.
More of a dungeon thing than a 40 man raid thing? lol
Well, again there may be a more “effective” choice. But guess what? Joe in the guild is a Ret pali… and he’s a great guy who helps everyone and is always present for raids.
It’s already established you don’t need min-maxed groups/classes. Why would ANYONE in this game spend the time, effort, and arguments… to make sure their raids are?
You going to sit him and pug a Fury Warrior?
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Make your own group, bring who you want. and you are only 50 so both our opinions are meaningless by your estimation
I literally am 
I listed 2.2
2.3 is for AoE and isn’t relevant to 95% of boss encounters, nor the ranking discussions or viability concerns here. No fight hinges on AoE more than single target in the slightest.
There really isn’t, which is why the game really isn’t for everyone if they are dead set on a particular class theme or fantasy aesthetic and the game doesn’t deliver it.
/shrug
Some people just HAVE to finish things 5 minutes faster than other people.
I’ve not heard any stories of anyone saying their guild kept them benched because they were Ret. I’m sure some conveniently fabricated stories will arise just because I said this.
Typo, I meant 2.3 and 2.4
It still exists, no matter how much you don’t like it. Rets existed, PUG’d and raided in vanilla, they’ll do the same here.
If you don’t like them, don’t invite them to YOUR group.
Hey man, you and I are on the same page. It’s not a solo game… it’s a SOCIAL game. People playing the same game together doesn’t mean playing it the way they tell you to. It means playing it with people of like minds.
As this thread indicates there are plenty people wiling to bring the player, not the class.
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But the problem is that even the exceptional memespec players you are accepting are still only going to be on par with below average players from other specs.
I don’t consider a spec viable if the best that an elite player can accomplish with them is to be below average DPS. I guess we just disagree on that point.
if someone is so damn good they can do almost half the damage as an optimal spec then they’d be amazing as an optimal spec. That’s all I’d think of it
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Thats fair.
From my perspective, I dont see any guilds but the top 1% to have the level of optimization necessary to render a genuinely good memespec player useless. Sure, they’d be better on rogue or warrior, but the fact that they are at 60, geared, ready to go, ready to farm consumes, etc just means SO much.
Even if they’re average in raid DPS, I’d rather have a middle of the pack Shadow or Feral player than a low hanging mage.
If you think forcing hybrids to heal in raids is some 2019 retail mindset then you weren’t around in vanilla. Not trying to be mean but you seem to act like that didn’t even happen.
And yes my kid self leveled a shadow priest for 3 months then had to be Holy for raids. One of the other priests dipped into shadow just for weaving and healed.
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May the Roster Boss have mercy upon their souls…
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Save the min/maxing and spreadsheet jockeying for Retail and the Elitist Jerks. > They love that sort of thing. Leave Classic for those who want to actually play an MMORPG that has better fantasy roles than simply tank, dps, and heals.
And an Elitist Jerk literally runs the show in retail! Am I the only one who found that amusing regarding this comment?
Yeah?
Okay.
Demanding that players accept sub-optimal specs is hypocritical because this whole thread is whining about not being allowed to play how you want. Well, I want a raid (don’t care about MC, talking AQ here) with players that put the group ahead of their personal desires. Anyone running a bad spec doesn’t fit that mold
this doesn’t stop anyone from making a raid with rets
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2.4 is solo AoE grinding… what does that have to do with Raid performance on bosses…
Never said they didn’t, but they aren’t preferred, and they are suboptimal. That may not matter to you, by all means, go wild, but it matters to others. You aren’t going to be the holy-infused warrior that can go toe-to-toe with big bad guys the same way a Rogue will and that bothers some folks.
That’s just the reality of Classic.
There’s reason to be discriminatory, and I’m hugely pro-memespec. Not a lot of players can objectively make them work. Let the good ones in, but the bad ones do genuinely sandbag raids really, really hard.
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