FoF is over rated anyways. Real WWs only tiger palm and SCK.
1 Like
we got to the aotc and dont have the ppl for ce. so farm heroic is where we’re at. taht being said I dont think I’m being overly dramatic - I’m pulling 60k hps when the holy priest and glimmerdudin are both doing 120k hps? as far as current content is concerned i dont care - but we arent seeing any changes (or even recognition that something is wrong) for the next expansion then I’m worried. and I wouldnt call this being overly dramatic.
Here’s overly dramatic:
“omg blizz if you dont fix monk I’ll unsub” 
Okay then lets talk about those numbers. I pulled up your must recent log for Maut.
Holy Priest - ilvl 475 - HPS 104k - Parse 82
You - ilvl 471 - HPS 57k - Parse 24
My worst Maut with ilvl 449 I pulled 66k.
To put this simply. That holy priest is pulling good numbers because they are playing their class well.
Look I don’t care if min/maxing is your thing. As long as you are progressing the content you’re attempting it doesn’t matter. But I don’t think someone who can’t optimize their class has a voice in balance discussions.
Monk are fine right now for progression. We’re still working on tuning for Shadowlands where most classes are all over the place.
That doesn’t mean you don’t have reasons to complain about something. It’s possible you don’t like the boring mastery, or the overall feel of the class.
1 Like
if you think hps is mistweavers weakpoint idk what to say pal.
2 Likes
because I find upwelling the most boring gameplay ever I’m not supposed to voice my opinion on balance? perhaps players without aotc shouldn’t comment on balance? but that sounds a bit childish dont it? so I’m going to ignore it.
what this sounds like to me is that you dont want me to speak up that MW monks need changes and that you instead like seeing monks behind in healing. that is your prerogative but dont take it out on those that actually want to play monk.
I would agree upwelling is boring. Feels bad to wait for a cast bar to expire. That’s not even a numbers issues that’s a class mechanic issue.
But when you come in and try to tell us monk HPS is so low you have to switch to a druid I find these comments damaging to the overall discussion.
I’ve been raiding for three weeks. I came back for Shadowlands and jumped right into raiding. I may not have downed all bosses yet, but for the ones I did down I clearly have a better handle on Monk performance and rotation.
1 Like
I suppose I should also explain that talking about HPS in today’s patch isn’t really worth it since this is a thread about shadowlands and the class tuning is still going on.
I suggest we focus on getting a blue post about the bugs and overall class design
1 Like
To clear things up here.
MW in current form are lacking raw HPS. The mistweaver monk is trying to play the Rdruid/Holy priest game. That game would be the raw hps in the form of small baby heals. We are not winning this game as a MW monk. We do the same type of healing that Rdruid/Hpriest are doing which is useless non-threatening healing. Our problem vs Disc/Hpally/Rshaman is a whole different reason.
This is the problem with how we heal right now. We will never win the raw hps numbers game with Hpriest/Druid. This is also the reason I argue that Blizzard switches us back to WoD style of healing. Or at the very least, change our essence font. Ninh had a good idea of lowering the amount of targets essence font can hit. Less people would mean the direct hits of essence font might do meaningful healing.
We currently are a bad version of Hpriest/Rdruid. Disc/Hpally/Rshaman will always be better due to their healing cd’s. It will be the same in SL as well.
I would also like to every1 to know that our Revival is actually not bad. We just need Revival to do a bit more healing or lower the CD.
2 Likes
I don’t see how my complaint of low HPS is damaging, but its a valid opinion. Its not a false statement though - you are welcome to explore warcraftlogs and see where monks stand comparing to other healers (tldr: they are at the bottom)
does it matter for heroic raids? no, it does not.
why am I here? because the op asked to yell up.
do you want to call me bad? feel free to do so. but disqualifying my points because I’m a bad player is not cool. especially as my points are valid. the logs confirm them.
that being said - I feel no joy going into a new expansion on a class that is locked into a boring gameplay. I feel even less joy being forced into specific talents and specific gameplay to be able to progress raids with their guild.
Mistweaver really just needs more going on. It’s pretty bland as is and I hate fistweaving or using their dps rotation at all. I miss managing tea and chi as well as using chi torpedo to heal people.
3 Likes
I think most MW’s agree with this.
A monk should have Chi! It’s what we do.
5 Likes
There’s a difference between mythic world first and mythic progression.
The world first race has a tradition of excluding classes all the time. But that’s not us. We’re not world first. This is where I criticize the wanna-be hardcore who think the have to bring the exact composition. It’s unfortunate and I hate the race for what it does to the community perception or balance.
Monk had fine enough HPS for mythic progression, you may not make world first race but you can do it. Looking over all other logs of guild who pushed CE it’s possible. You can’t blame the world first race for your bad performance and being asked to go druid.
However, you’re right it feels bad being locked into a boring gameplay. Personally I think we need more utility. I don’t understand why they were willing to make a taunt available to all classes but not an interrupt?
I don’t really care about HPS numbers atm. I just want Blizzard to give us a blue post talking about the class.
Its a MAJOR problem that our class is getting ignored.
6 Likes
Yep some insight would be nice, I’m likely gonna stick it out with MW into SL I love the class and love the idea of it. But I miss what it was before I took an xpac off for the birth of my youngest. I left WoD and came back to whole different class which left a bad taste in my mouth.
3 Likes
whether I suck or not I agree. we need a blue post.
1 Like
And have a graphic that’s pretty and doesn’t look like a wimpy mist puff lol.
The HPS floor is quite high because it’s difficult to screw up taking Upwelling and pressing EF. The problem is the ceiling is low because once you’ve taken Upwelling and pressed EF there isn’t much left to do that matters.
You can keep Enveloping on the tanks but you’ll go oom so fast you won’t be able to Vivify much. If you ignore Enveloping and press Vivify you’re left hoping ReM is on good targets and the damage goes out while you can stand and turret spam.
Do the above with gear, press Revival at a good time, keep ReM on CD and you’re now a 90%+ MW parser but you’re still doing 20-40% less than the Hpals and Druids and Discs that can choose who they heal, have DR’s/Brez, better mobility and mobile healing, better defensive’s, better mana sustain and simply better healing.
alwayshasbeen.jpeg
1 Like
Its a weakpoint when the spec doesn’t bring anything else like DR or any raid utility; so having low hps on top is a real stinger.
2 Likes
This is why MW and Hpriest should be the undisputed kings of throughput and Druids not far behind but more mobile.
Instead we have the DR healers also having the highest throughput.
Blizzard introduced Warfronts, Islands and Visions without any thought given to healers. Blizzard expect people doing those activities to swap to DPS offspecs because they don’t care about healers. It’s hardly surprising the healing meta has been backwards for so long.
2 Likes
I’m adding my voice here in hopes that Blizzard does something about this class. I really like playing windwalker, but it’s due for some attention. In particular, I’d like to see some changes to the talents given that I’ve basically been using the same build for two expansions.
I’m sort of torn on Whirling Dragon Punch. In general I like it, but the animation is kind of clunky. The fact that you can’t use it and keep moving is sometimes problematic. It’s also been annoying in horrific visions because it counts as movement for some reason even though you jump straight up into the air. However, we’ve been using it for so long it feels like it’s part of the base spec now. I would like to see it go baseline and have the jumping animation removed so we’re free to use it while moving.
Hit Combo should be replaced at this point. The mastery is one of my favorite aspects of windwalker, but having a talent slot being used up that basically says “do your mastery or your next 5 abilities will be punished” is pretty dumb. Fury of Xuen seems like an obvious replacement here. It encourages you to use your mastery properly and rewards you for doing so instead of punishing mistakes.
Also, I would like to see SEF replaced in favor of Tigereye Brew. I know SEF is rooted in the brewmaster hero from Warcraft 3, but it doesn’t really add anything to the class fantasy. At this point, SEF is just a flat dps increase that sometimes doesn’t work right, and it doesn’t seem worth keeping around. I think Tigereye Brew is more interesting to play with because you can build up your damage in combat instead of just waiting on a timer. I also like the flexibility of being able to choose when to use it based on how many stacks you want to use.
There’s also a lot of talk of issues with scaling. I don’t really specific ideas for how to improve this, but there was one idea I heard that I thought was cool. Make Fists of Fury a fixed duration and have the number of hits you get in that time scale with haste. That change seems to fit the spirit of the ability. Also it would be nice if Fists of Fury did full damage to all targets it hits since the max number of targets it can hit is already being hard capped in Shadowlands.
4 Likes