Heh. Sounds fine by me tbh.
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Forsaken fans are really quiet right now because we are biding our time till the narrative shifts away from whatever the heck this is. Forsaken fans have expressed disappointment and rejection of this Calia story enmasse since she was introduced, but yet they kept pushing it. They have ostricized their whole Forsaken fanbase minus a few delusional stragglers.
I would rather have a lobotomy, than accept Calia as a Forsaken Queen.
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Agreed. I never felt anything but keen, spontaneous rejection for what theyâve been trying to push with Calia. I thought 9.2.5 was probably the best they could do in terms of handling the situation in a way that neither outrages the Forsaken fans to no end nor wipes off the picture a character that theyâve been trying so hard to build up (with little success) over the course of the last expansions and books.
I am okay with the concept of Calia (the last representative of the fallen Menethil line trying to find her place within the new nation that developed on the ashes of Lordaeron) as well as with the idea of her playing some moderate, non-intrusive role in the future of the Forsaken. The insistent Holy Light bits and her relationship with Anduin are more than embarrassing though. Now that sheâs here Iâm willing to give her a chance, as long as she remains just a member of the Desolate Council like any other. However she has to become a Forsaken character. And a Horde character. This is the condition to me.
Derek though ? Oh my god Derek. Screw Derek.
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Until Sylvie betrayed the Horde and bailed on them. Along with quite a few other frustrating elements, there was a lot of extra dialogue around Org in the fallout of that moment. Gazloweâs appointment to Trade Prince. Rokhan officially and finally taking charge of the Darkspear. And Velonaraâs opinions on Sylvanas and the loyalist Dark Rangers that followed her. Frankly, she wasnât the biggest fan of Sylvanas even back as far as WoD.
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This is where Iâve settled as well.
I loathed Calia in Before the Storm. A friend once described her Undeath as âForsaken Blackfaceâ thanks to how quickly she went âOMG Iâm just like them now!â
I loathed her because she was so clearly being propped up to replace Sylvanas and she clashes with some of the Forsakenâs core aesthetics and themes.
It isnât even so much that Calia hasnât suffered. She absolutely has. But if suffering is all that was needed to become Forsaken, then everyone would be Forsaken. (Cause life is suffering amiright?)
Her current position isnât too incredibly bad. At this point, Iâd rather her remain as part of the Forsaken and see where it goes instead of just scrapping the thread.
But this content is dependent on her not being the only member of the Council who gets screen time.
They already had her be the only one at that cringe wedding, though I admit it makes sense that the others wouldnât want to go. Still woulda loved a quick scene describing the other 4 Council members brooding in a corner while Faranel feeds a smol abomination cake slices.
I think Calia has potential, but I canât say much else until more content comes out.
But Derek tho?
Derek!?!?!
Calia I can tolerate, but why is this dude even here?
What skin does he have in the Forsaken game?
Derek, just go home! Youâre family loves you!
Stop calling yourself the âChampion of the Pallid Ladyâ!
Itâs cringe!
The only thing youâre a champion at doing is immolating!
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Itâs the titles that Calia and Derek have now that just makes me want to gag. They could have been interesting and unique but The Pallid Lady and Champion of the Pallid Lady titles. Is insulting to anyone with eyeballs.
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And anyone without eyeballs as well. Probably even more so.
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Another small gripe for me is âI donât want to put my loyalty in anything but the Lightâ Alonsus Foal, who refused to be a Forsaken but now casually hangs out amongst the Forsaken.
It infuriates me because heâs clearly partisan to a Menethil heir, and who knows how much he orchestrated Caliaâs clever coup.
Clearly there needs to be some kind of Forsaken support group who reject Calia because thereâs a lot to say here.
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I really donât think it makes sense for either Calia or Voss to be on the forsaken council. Calia for obvious reasons, but Voss never even had a moment where she officially joined the forsaken; she just popped back up out of nowhere to be coerced into fighting for Sylvanas.
Unfortunately it seems like the game ran out of recurring characters to plug in the gaps BFA caused and tried to lump all human zombies under the term forsaken as if it was a race, same as how the term Darkfallen seemed to come out of nowhere as an unnecessary distinction for undead elves.
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Seems to be a Forsaken theme to take an hard opposite turn all of a sudden. Voss was anti-necromancy all the way up to Legion, then is all of a sudden okay with it in BfA.
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Itâs like Forsaken fans donât matter at all.
Calia Iâm willing to accept that she at least has a clearly defined role and purpose.
Velonara represents military matters.
Belmont is intelligence.
Faranell is the RAS.
And Calia can be diplomatic matters.
But I agree with Voss.
I donât know what role Voss fills or what qualifications she has.
Maybe sheâs supposed to represent the common people of the Forsaken?
Sheâs apparently an expert on the Forsaken experience, after all.
But that still doesnât change that Voss is incredibly under-developed.
They just stuck her into BfA with an assumed character arc that happened off screen.
The least they could do is make a short story detailing her re-connection with the Forsaken.
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Velonara is a low status Dark Ranger, sheâs not an authority in that faction. Anya is the highest ranking. Thatâs another frustration as it seems like they only appointed her because she sides with Lillian.
Blizzard has no idea how to write Horde so they put the Alliance aligned leaders in Horde positons. Calia and Derek, enough said. Thrall is not Thrall anymore and came up with the Council idea. Rokhan finally getting into the spotlight after Volâjinâs suprised pathetic death scene. Gallywix should have never been the goblin leader in the first place. Lorâthemar is the only good written character, but who became leader after Kaelâs blunt villain batting who would still be perfect for the Horde having a fire mage vs Jaina. Baine âŠ
Baine is the perfect example of the current writing for Horde. Jailer(Blizzard) finds Baine(Horde) useless and tosses him aside. Then does nothing with him through the entire expansion while Jaina, Anduin, and Sylvanas get the spotlight, even Blue Uther got more action and spotlight. At the end of it all, do we get the payoff to see a cutscene to see him and Cairne reunite and talk thatâs been hinted at since the Tauren Heritage in BfA? Nope, nothing, nadda, just like the Horde.
Even the entire council thing is supposed to be the Alliance stick. Now we have Horde Council (Alliance) vs Alliance Supreme Commander (Horde Warchief) the roles have been so reversed, but since Golden God King Anduin is going to be Supreme Commander, it will work out for the Alliance since itâs Anduin, and wouldnât for the Horde. Everything Horde does is wrong, while everything Alliance does is right. Blizzard current team has no idea what to do with the Horde.
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Iâm not so sure. I think itâs more likely that the people who put that prophecy in motion are no longer driving the story, and the new writers want to have the freedom to go their own direction without being constrained by the decisions of their predecessors.
Anyway, think of all the other prophecies that went nowhere.
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Honestly, as much of a Forsaken fan as I am, I can hardly tell one Dark Ranger from the other. The look nearly identical and most of them tend to not be real fleshed out.
I also didnât play BfA or Shlands in an real depth. You could stick any Dark Ranger in Velonaraâs position and I probably couldnât even tell the difference.
I even only recently memorized Velonaraâs name cause I kept forgetting which generic Dark Ranger got the Council seat.
To be fair, the Desolate Council is something that the community has been pretty earnest about.
Even before the book, it wasnât uncommon to see a council be suggested when theorizing who might replace Sylvanas.
Iâm not a fan of the Hordeâs War Council, but the Desolate Council is definitely an alright idea. Plus itâs name is a lot cooler.
Though -5 points for Blizz using the term âBlighted Congressâ for a quest name.
Blighted Congress would have been an amazing name for the council.
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Horde council no since itâs supposed to be Alliance. Desolate Council for Forsaken was the best idea since Forsaken were not supposed to be ruled by a single leader. Sylvanas outgrew her story arc after Arthas since she got her revenge. It would have made sense and become more interesting for the Forsaken to find their own path post Arthas, and no Sylvanas, and to take their place in the world on the Forsaken terms, not their queenâs term.
I would have agreed with this a few expansions ago, but the leaders are almost at parity now thanks to the Allied races. Besides, they have a spare female Forsaken leader in Lillian-freakinâ-Voss.
We have new writers. We canât assume theyâre going in the same direction as the previous ones.
This is the kind of thing they need to do more often with the Forsaken!
Youâre more generous than me, then. I still donât see how she could fit into a story that actually fits the Forsaken as they have been established, rather than wrenching them forcibly into something else.
Theyâve been doing a lot of that ever since Legion. Lillian Voss never wanted to be Forsaken either, until suddenly she did. Gazlowe suddenly went full Horde. At one point they even tried to convince us that Valeera Sanguinaar was chummy with the Horde leaders. It really irritates me how they refuse to develop OG Horde NPCs and shove previously neutral ones at us instead.
Why, though? Her experience is anything but that of the common people of the Forsaken. She refused to join and ran off on a one-zombie necromancer killing spree for years, developing super-special purple magics at the same time. What does she have in common with, say, the cockroach seller?
I was on the boards at the time, and I remember them being most popular with Alliance posters, funnily enough.
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Velonara had interesting potential.
But just like all Forsaken stories, they dropped the ball. She had a story in Cata relating to getting revenge against the Scarlet Crusade. Vishas killed her mother, so her and Lilian have similar backstories relating to the SC. I understand the connection between her and Lillian.
She had a story with Death Hunter Morgoth and that seemed to be dropped. In BFA prior to her leaving the Loyalists she was supposed to rescue Morgoth from the scarlets but that whole quest chain was dropped, but parts of it were on the PTR. Thereâs a lot of cut content that seems relevant to context on why Velonara choose to reject the Loyalist path.
Sheâs an anti-loyalist shill, but we never got why she became that way.