About the LGBT thread

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

Haha wow… you can’t process a hypothetical where malfurion or tyrande have a different gender.

Either Tyrande and Malfurion are actually the name of two males/females, in which case they would have been since Warcraft 3… and nobody would have cared about one saving the other in Val’sharah, 15 years later…

Learn to read.

[Truebow-suramar (Truebow)]

IT was being kept alive by just a few people as soon as it went of the first page one of the few would quickly post in it , I picked one of the guys and he had posted in it almost 100 times , let that crap die already

[Malkarus-runetotem (Malkarus)]

I agree, DHs need a nerf.

And I think your race needs to be deleted.

See this is accurate. Bronzebeard Dwarves are like, never used in any storylines, and Magni was a HORRID replacement for Khadgar.

[Kallox-draka]

Did someone ask for a “walking-talking sexual preference stand-in”? Nope.

I love how when someone suggests a gay couple gasp exist, that you assume it can only be a flaming stereotype.

What you want has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with what makes you personally uncomfortable.

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

Did someone ask for a “walking-talking sexual preference stand-in”? Nope.

“Write characters with interesting arcs

I love how when someone suggests a gay couple gasp exist, that you assume it can only be a flaming stereotype.

Write characters with interesting arcs

What you want has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with what makes you personally uncomfortable.

Less “we don’t like your politics”, more “keep all politics out of this”.

Learn to read.

[Kallox-draka]

I can see you had trouble understanding the question (or, more likely, were pretending to). The point was not “If there had been a 15 year relationship in the game, would players care if the story was continued?”

I’ll rephrase and see if it helps you:

If there was an LGBT couple as front-and-center and openly romantic as Tyrande and Malfurion, specifically as portrayed in a major questline during Legion, would players have a problem with it?

If you answer anything but a strong “yes,” you’re being disingenuous.

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

Can you imagine for a moment if the Val’shara Tyrande x Malfurion questline was an LGBT questline for a moment? I garauntee you with no other changes, we’d get weird people throwing a tantrum over it.

Malfurion and Tyrande have been an item since 2002, in Warcraft 3.

So…

1. Either Tyrande and Malfurion are actually the name of two males/females, in which case they would have been since Warcraft 3… and nobody would have cared about one saving the other in Val’sharah, 15 years later…
2. Or, Tyrande or Malfurion ditch the other for a nelf of the same gender, and chase them all over Val’sharah… in which case, people are going to be rightfully pissed that Blizzard broke up a couple who’s relationship has repeatedly been essential to the lore, on and off “screen” in order to create an LGBT partnership.
   …
   The example you provided would have required you to got back in time, or fundamentally alter a core piece of the lore, and instead of assuming people wouldn’t want that specific change, you are assuming that it just has to be about some kind of bigotry.

Learn to read.

As for your question:

If there was an LGBT couple as front-and-center and openly romantic as Tyrande and Malfurion, specifically as portrayed in a major questline during Legion, would players have a problem with it?

Most wouldn’t, as long as it made sense and was organic to the world.

You are making the same mistake as Arlenadja. People complain about thing #1, you assume it must be about #2, and therefor they must, must be bigots of some kind.

[Kallox-draka]

Nope. Keep trying to rationalize your discomfort. No matter how many times you post “Learn to read” like a twelve-year-old, you won’t fool anyone but possibly yourself.

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

No matter how many times you post “Learn to read” like a twelve-year-old,

Nope. Keep trying to rationalize your victimhood.

At this point, I could tell you that I didn’t like Taco Bell because of their food, and you’d assume it was because I didn’t like Hispanic people, even though one thing has little to nothing to do with the other.

You need to pay better attention. The world isn’t out to get you. Not everything is black or white. The people who don’t want politics in games generally and genuinely don’t care about the orientation of the characters… they just don’t want external political agendas used as a substitution for a quality product.

Also… learn to read.

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

There’s no political argument in this thread, care to try again?

Correct.

There is no political argument in this thread.

WOULD YOU CARE TO TRY AGAIN?

[Kallox-draka]

I hope at some point you can turn your mental faculties towards examining your own bias, instead of trying to come up with obviously contrived rationale like “it’s because i don’t like politics” or “i don’t like relationships in-game” or such nonsense.

I hope you gain a little self-awareness. Or at least try.

Beyond that, discussing with someone as stuck as you seems to be a waste of time.

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

Again, you need to learn to read.

instead of trying to come up with obviously contrived rationale like “it’s because i don’t like politics”

It’s more “Write characters with interesting arcs, not walking-talking sexual preference stand ins.”

…or “i don’t like relationships in-game” or such nonsense.

people are going to be rightfully pissed that Blizzard broke up a couple who’s relationship has repeatedly been essential to the lore, on and off “screen” in order to create an LGBT partnership.

Kallox, I hope you gain a little self-awareness. Or at least try.

Because it’s not good that I can refute your mistaken, nonsensical preconceptions by simply linking things I just posted.

You are assuming that I have positions I do not have, based on things I have not said, and trying to call me close-minded because of them.

You are throwing punches in the air… and missing.

Good luck out there. You’re going to need it.

[Desombres-mankrik]

And some of it’s just gross sh*t

[Ashlerian-ragnaros]

Malfurion and Tyrande have been an item since 2002, in Warcraft 3.

So…

1. Either Tyrande and Malfurion are actually the name of two males/females, in which case they would have been since Warcraft 3… and nobody would have cared about one saving the other in Val’sharah, 15 years later…
2. Or, Tyrande or Malfurion ditch the other for a nelf of the same gender, and chase them all over Val’sharah… in which case, people are going to be rightfully pissed that Blizzard broke up a couple who’s relationship has repeatedly been essential to the lore, on and off “screen” in order to create an LGBT partnership.

Nothing of what you just said here relates to what Arlenadja commented on.
If that Tyrande and Malfurion questline was about two other characters that happened to be LGBT, everyone would be screaming forced representation, or something something being shoved down my throat, let’s crucify the gays lol or whatever.

[Xyrtran-medivh]

like I said on the other thread keep real life things outside the game.

thanks.

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

Nothing of what you just said here relates to what Arlenadja commented on.

Yes, it did.

Can you imagine for a moment if the Val’shara Tyrande x Malfurion questline was an LGBT questline for a moment? I garauntee you with no other changes, we’d get weird people throwing a tantrum over it.

---

If that Tyrande and Malfurion questline was about two other characters that happened to be LGBT, everyone would be screaming forced representation, or something something being shoved down my throat, let’s crucify the gays lol or whatever.

[If] Tyrande and Malfurion are actually the name of two males/females, in which case they would have been since Warcraft 3… and nobody would have cared about one saving the other in Val’sharah, 15 years later…

If Illidan had suddenly been trying to save his husband Darion Morgraine in Val’Sharah, then a bunch of people might complain because that relationship makes no sense, and was clearly done to use a political position to sell the game.

If they were two brand new characters (or characters who relationship status is undetermined), and whose story is organic to the setting? Say, two Dryads, or two male druids? I doubt it would have been much of an issue. Sure, some people would have complained, but it wouldn’t be the majority, or issue that people are assuming it would be.

And that’s the deal.

People who say “let’s have more LGBT stuff in the game” assume everyone who says “let’s not” somehow dislike LGBT people; in reality, they dislike game companies using politics to sell underwhelming games, and breaking established intellectual property to do so.

So again…

Less “we don’t like your politics”, more “keep all politics out of this”.

[Glavemistake-zuljin]

my gay-dar was going crazy over Ragnaros… I always knew he was an absolute flame…

[Trivenom-dalaran]

Less “we don’t like your politics”, more “keep all politics out of this”.

except it’s not political to be gay, it’s a naturally occuring thing in all races and societies, even if societies have a varying level of acceptance of it. But acceptance is not politics, it is a purely social phenomena independent of politics, and people just like to loop it into politics because one group has a trend of being more accepting than the other.

the omission of LGBT+ relationships speaks as loudly as their inclusion.

saying this is about politics is like saying the civil war was about “state’s rights”.

A state’s right, to what, sir?

[Grøm-altar-of-storms]

except it’s not political to be gay,

It’s not.

However, saying “Hey, HEY. HEY EVERYONE! WE HAVE A GAY/FEMALE/[whatever] CHARACTER NOW! WE’RE SUPER INCLUSIVE, BUY OUR STUFF!”

That’s political.

Again, the problem isn’t the orientation of the character, it’s Blizzard use of a sociopolitical stance to sell games.

the omission of LGBT+ relationships speaks as loudly as their inclusion.

The omission of left-handed characters clearly betrays Blizzard’s dislike of southpaws.

Or… perhaps it doesn’t.

saying this is about politics is like saying the civil war was about “state’s rights”.

No, it’s like saying that taking a sociopolitical stance to sell games is bringing politics into games.

Because that’s exactly what they’re doing.

Don’t we have more interesting things to tackle?

Yes.

I wish we would.

something something tentacle joke

[Dexterworgen-nordrassil]

I think a lot of that hate comes from how demanding people are over it. I wouldn’t care if blizzard added it on their own but the constant demand for it makes me uncomfortable. It probably makes them uncomfortable too. Change is hard, not that it shouldn’t happen but it shouldn’t be expect to happen all at once either. It should also try to be respectful of the writers right to choose what happens in their story. Maybe that sounds insensitive to some I don’t know and it isn’t meant to sound that way. I do care about how people feel I just value freedom more then someones feelings.