The point of being able to set limits is so that people outside of what you’re looking for don’t even see your group and don’t join it.
I mentioned way earlier in the thread that they should expand on features like the playstyle option as well and allow for easy filtering based on that.
Also earlier in the thread:
Though I’d modify what I said earlier and maybe just show a ratio of successes to failures at the level you’re making a group for and allow you to set a limit.
People will still swap to meta regardless of keys degrading or not. This argument is asinine.
People will continue to do big pulls because people like big numbers and want to finish dungeons quickly. This has been true before M+ was even a thing and is true even in Classic iterations of past expansions. This isn’t about MDI and is the most overused and disingenuous argument you people on GD continue to spew. No one is doing MDI pulls. Big pulls =/= MDI pulls.
People will invite meta regardless of key depletion because meta is meta for a reason.
No it doesn’t.
Conclusion is that your ideas are bad and you create circular reasoning to back them.
Any comment on the discussion I had with Diablo?
I’m not playing this season so I don’t have a specific opinion on the difficulty level changes/key squish.
I also don’t personally play past +20 (in the old system) so my ideas aren’t really related to the really high level pushing of keys.
I think most people that would benefit from the suggestions don’t play at that level and probably still wouldn’t. I’d imagine being able to select a level from a UI (or at least not de-ranking like the thread was originally about) would benefit those players as well though since they’d be able to spend more attempts pushing higher without having to re-level a key when they failed.
This was the key point we discussed. I personally don’t think it would, because there is a limit to what uncoordinated groups can do regardless of how many attempts they get, and if the bottleneck for title moves above that threshold it means there is no aspirational goal for players without coordinated push groups.
This isn’t a good idea and Blizzard has already said they would not do this back in Shadowlands. They don’t want players to have the ability to spam run select dungeons. Yes, people can target certain keys but those keys are random.
Allowing people to select a key level at a font also encourages and enables carrying to an even greater degree. Someone can get carried once in a +10 (previous +20) and now they have access to that level for the rest of the season. This means that even though they might be no where near ready for that key level, they will continuously drag other groups down until they can get carried again. This will lead to more issues within the pug community, not the other way around. Short term gain, long term issues.
And how to vet beyond raising requirements even more to the point of absurdity? At least now, if it’s not my key, it’s not really my problem.
Keys are way too hard now. Bring back season 3.
If you have to complete all the dungeons at an average level of whatever to get the rating for the title I don’t think the systems I’d suggest would make it any harder, you’d just be able to try for it more often if you wanted to.
If your point is that Blizzard would raise the level of what’s required significantly because you’d be able to attempt it more frequently, I guess that could be a negative if they actually do that. I did see you mention it’s harder in this season than in the past to get to that level already so it seems like they raised the bar even without letting you try it more frequently.
Blizzard said they were getting rid of flying moving forward in Warlord’s of Draenor.
This might be true.
I would say:
We shouldn’t design around what people in that world do or don’t do. They’re going to sell carries anyway. If anything the carries will just be cheaper because there will be more competition in the market. I don’t know if that’s good or bad, it doesn’t affect people who don’t buy or sell carries.
Larger numbers of people not interested in carries would be participating and trying to get things for themselves, which is a positive.
but carried people plaguing LFG is a huge negative.
Buy one +10 carry and now you have it forever.
Regardless of how often you fail.
At least, depletion makes it financially prohibitive.
This is what I believe would occur, but to be clear that’s not blizzard’s decision it’s the playerbase. Title is top 0.1% of the key doing pushing playerbase, the easier it is to do 19s, the more people do them and the more the bottleneck shifts to 20s.
The way in which M+ scales with key level, especially at the high end, is a lot less… linear? I guess is how you’d put it. You reach a point where it’s not a case of doing the strategy cleaner or doing more damage, it’s drumming up a new strategy that is significantly harder to execute, and there’s a point where that barrier of execution cannot realistically be overcome with additional attempts.
Letting this happen in the 2-11 range is just asking for players to abuse it for BIS gearing purposes, and letting it happen for push keys specifically probably wouldn’t have the effect the OP desires.
All of the issues pertaining to other players dictating a meta or wasting time in the OP will still exist; all this change would do is alter where that time is wasted. Which may sound better on paper, but it would also most likely push pugs out of the running for M+ titles entirely with how much farther dedicated teams would go comparatively if given the option to practice the same key endlessly.
Like pulling trash along with the boss?
Which fundamentally changes how some stuff is played.
(But that happens way before +20s.)
Maybe? But this isn’t exactly some hard to execute strategy in a general sense. Respect to the nuance of specific situations, though.
Oh, I was thinking of the achievement you get for a fixed rating not the competitive title.
I never try to push to the top levels so I have no idea how it would affect the top .1% of players.
Trash on top of bosses, 4-5 packs at once that require complex coordinated setups to safely execute, snaps in AA.
For example the prevailing strategy to time 19+ Tyra AA is to do the whole dungeon in 7 pulls (Including Bosses). Including a pull consisting of G15, G13, G12, G11, G10, G6, G5, G3, and G4 all at once.
That is not something a pug will be able to do.
I don’t even want to think about it and I’m alone.
Come down to vexamus section after crawth, walk around the pack of 3, then pull every Wyrm, the big wyrm pack before the bridge, the pack on the bridge, the big wyrm after the bridge, and all the small wyrms on that side too.
16 Small wyrms, 2 big wyrms, 2 manafiends, 2 scepters, and 2 battleaxes. 24 Mobs.
I can kinda picture how my average PUG would attempt this tbh.
I’d paint a picture, but abstract art isn’t my forte.
18’s doable but tight on tyra doing more conventional strategies. Still very big pulls but stuff that at least bares a passing resemblance to your average vault key route.