How exactly? The way I see it, removing it would rather increase micro: you have to use less time controlling your whole army and you get more time to control individual units. If this isn’t more micro, then what is it?
2 Likes
I agree
5 Likes
I wouldn’t mind having 20 Flying Machines in one group instead of 2.
It’s rare that 12 is not enough when you play with several groups, but I don’t see a downside of changing it.
5 Likes
I can’t believe this topic is still continuing. lol
I haven’t read any reasonable cons to increasing selection size but have heard many pros… out of all the threads on this forum, I hope this one is the most obvious one for the devs to be monitoring and considering.
6 Likes
The hard core melee players and the general feel of melee is arguably more designed around the idea of 12 unit selection limit, i’m mostly a custom map player and from the outside looking in i think removing this would reduce the barrier of difficulty for new players, and i have no idea how will the veterans react to it.
you have to consider that will the game be able to handle that many selected unit’s at the same time ? Reforged and classic are imbued in so you cant say screw classic (i will burn every heretic in holy fire if they think less of classic) so there are a few things to consider here, mainly how difficult will be to make it so units are stored in multi tabs after the selection and are pinned to the side like how it is in starcraft 2.
although my personal suggestion to this issue is mainly driving from another game i played in where if there was too many unit’s selected and of different types their icons would get smaller and also a number tab would appear on the top right corner just stating how many of these same units are selected and so everything was more or less just on the same page instead of having different tabs like sc2.
and will the classic team be able to fix the unit lag problem where if there are more then 800-900 units in a game/map the units will have a delayed time to move after a move order is issued.
and lastly, upgrading this “might” very well be attached to the core of the game, meaning that base wc3 itself can’t really do this without fully being rebuilt on a newer engine.
so it’s more of a question of can they do it then a question of will they do it.
i myself suggested something slightly different long time ago at the forums and it was to increase the selection limit from 12 to 24 (or 36 if possible) and make it possible to set the selection size from the world editor for some custom maps.
Yes it can. Firstly, CPUs are at least an order of magnitude faster. Secondly, you could just internally simulate a group of 13 as two separate groups, 12 and 1. Formation position calculation code may need some changes, but that shouldn’t be very hard.
Classic can just prevent selecting more than 12. Reforged can do whatever it wants. I think they should do multiple ways (grouping, smallifying icons, scrollbars, a mix) then let the players choose.
Shouldn’t be difficult. If it’s a deliberate limitation to help with slow CPUs, just remove it. If it’s a bug, fix it. The issue should be easy to track down, whether it’s a bug or intentional.
Nope. As a developer I cannot see how that could be. There might be a small bit of work if they used fixed-size arrays (and a reasonable bit of testing), but a competent programmer should be able to fix any issues pretty quickly.
So, the only way it could be a big issue is if they really screwed up when hiring their coders - but that would mean lots of other stuff would also suck.
3 Likes
whatever is done on Reforged is to be done on classic. that is their idea. you will split the playerbase in 2 if you say one can have something and the other can’t.
other then that. i read all the rest of your statements. i don’t have anything to comment on them, but i read it all.
By the way, just coming back here to correct some false information being spread by die hard wc3 old fans.
What’s true ?
There has been surveys.
The “Unlimited selection” side represent slightlty less than a third of the people who answered those surveys.
The “Increase the limitation” side represent a bit more than a third of the people who answered those surveys.
What’s false ?
The “Don’t change” side represent nowhere near the majority of the people who answered those surveys (It actually represent about another third of the public opinion)
Imo, given that those surveys didn’t probably reach all the new playerbase that a WC3 remake could attract, it’s safe to say that, despites what is being said from time to time here, a massive majority of player is down to change the unit limitation.
Here’s some source btw: httpx://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSf0ul5uDgAxdRbqGSMvoRhS-5ceKVWqXhSxv2A5wSN6ZM-GPQ/viewanalytics
2 Likes
I checked your survey, furthermore the fact a certain part of the warcraft player has been selected and the number of participants (1k5 people) wich is not little but not enough compared to the number of all players.
There is more than 60% of people who think the 12 units cap should be increased or even more, the half of them wants no limit. So a massive majority of player agree with the change limitation.
Please, do it at least (as an option would be even better) for non-ranked games.
The Classic max-12 selection limit can be a lightweight UI-only thing while the underlying (Classic & Reforged) game engine can be changed to accommodate unlimited without Classic players being able to see any difference. There’s absolutely no technical problem having them play together online (crossplay).
The playerpool (playerbase) count is a physical thing determined by server layout, and the only way it can be “split” is by deliberately adding servers (a Classic-only third-party matchmaking server would theoretically be possible but would almost certainly fail even if it were legal - blizzard has zero reason to create one of their own precisely because they don’t want a split pool).
I would love it if they removed the limit. To me it just get annoying when you have to manually press eatch controll group after another.
1 Like
While removing 12 unit cap like in SC 2 won’t change much for those who likes to micro units more quicker than using old fashion ctrl + left click I would also like to see hotkeys for unit selection (like in SC 2). This will help a lot.
Blizzard pls add the option to choose between UUS and unit cap. UUS makes the game more comfortable, easyer and more accessible for new players, while a cap makes it more micro-intensive and harder thus more appealing to hardcore players and purists. A unit cap is like a difficulty level for which reason it makes sense to choose between cap or no cap, or even different caps.
1 Like
As long as the unlimited unit selection (or increased selection) is A. kept as an option; B. Only possible in non-ranked games, everybody should be happy. The game would be more accessible to new comers, more enjoyable for most of us (especially in custom games, where some large armies may be controlled), and still challenging and allowing micromanagement for competitive players.
I’m kind of conlficted on this. On one hand, I feel the game was designed with the 12 cap in mind. As your Hero unit kind of leads a small elite force, rather than an army.
On the other hand, I can’t see how it would affect balance at all. High end players simply use control groups and control large groups anyways. I use them myself, and I’m barely mid level if anything. But thinking of new people coming in… unlimited or greatly increased cap may be beneficial.
No UUS supporters will be happy if it’s not available on ranked. Ranked is the most important place for UUS (see the thread title). Everyone will be happy once UUS is added and the opponents realize how little it harms their gameplay.
- Almost all arguments against UUS are also against increased caps.
- Almost all arguments for UUS are against limited caps. Many UUS supporters will see little difference.
So almost everybody loses.
I agree with you. If it were up to me, I’d go with the UUS all the way for every game type.
I was just being cautious so competitive players don’t get upset. Some people are so conservative about that kind of stuff.
UUS for every game type except ranked melee would already be a huge improvement, and I’d be happy with it, but yeah, UUS for everyone wouldn’t do any harm. People would get used to it quickly.
I doubt most competitive players oppose it. New competitive players should be almost entirely pro UUS (as that’s what they’ll be used to). Older ones are split. Vocal top pros might be more against it, but there’s not many of them and they have their income to think of.
1 Like
Macro/Micro is not defined by the amount of units that you can select at a time.
5 Likes
Please Blizzard, Remove this 12 units cap !
6 Likes