Zeratul is still massing cannons

Sentries always Had Been the Go to for cannons cause of their ridiculous dps and they are the best gasdump.

And gasp, still can AND ARE enjoying a completely viable and strong strategy. :slight_smile: No “was” to it.

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You know what, I never played cannons outside of specific mutations, because army was just stonger and more viable. But now, every time I will get Zeratul while playing random commander I will on purpose go ONLY CANNONS for all those dirty Zeratul haters to feel the PAIN.

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This is true punishmet for the co-op universe. But, hey, finally someone brave enough to carry this burden!

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Same idea :innocent:

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Btw, if we count free upgrades, superior stats, the fact they dont need pylons and they can project themseves and count as free units in this scenario … Zeratul cannons are still cheaper than Karax cannons. Like i t or not.

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Please go back to school and learn mathematics.
Or learn to troll properly.

Did you check the prize of Karax upgrades, stats of cannons, calculated what number of cannons, shiled batteries and pylons equals certain numbers of Zeratul Cannons and considered the fact Karax simply can not project cannons and those produced in the eraly game on many maps are efectively lost, because there will be never ever any enemy atack wave facing them again, except the first one, while Zeratul cannons have global range…

Or are you just flowing on “weeeee, cannons dead, I want refund” wave?

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Did you? Have any calculations to show?
Or are you just flowing on “weeeee, Zeratul finally nerfed, somebody is not happy” wave?

Sure, simple example

Karax:

10 pylons
30 cannons
10 shield batteries
triple shield upgrades
Optimized Ordnance upgrade (to come even close in terms of damage)

Thats rouhghly 6525 minerals and 1025 gas (you need twilight, co its prizes is also counted)

Fot this prize, you can have 15 zeratul Cannons + 7 shieldguards with global presence, able to defend certain area with option to project themselves (and got even buffed in the proces) anywhere on the map, with ZERO chance to loose them.

Anything else?

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Do you even understand that 30 Karax cannons have 60% more dps (with couple energizers) than 15 Zeratul cannons and 4,8 times more hp than 15 Zeratul projections (not even mentioning all the heal from batteries)?
And 2 more range with upgrade.
Also, no need for 10 pylons, 3-5 will be more than enough.

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Mate, you are lying again :slight_smile: Did you count the prize of energizers? Did you count the shade barier of zeratul cannons? Did you count the range upgrade? Did you even realized shiledguards act as bateries, except they cannot be harmed, becasuse they are sitting in base with cannons? No? I see. Lying and ignoring facts and exact numbers… again.

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I counted shield batteries barriers as the same as projections barriers because while they have half of damage barrier, they have half of the cooldown also.
And if you think that adding 2 cannons and some shieldguards (money for two upgrades and 3 energizers) to Zeratul will change situation, you’re really bad. But we can try.
41% more dps and 4,23 times more hp for Karax still.
And if we are speaking about “theorycrafting, lying and pretending those claims are facts” you’ve just prooven thats your field. Shieldguards can’t heal projections from the base. And if projections is dead, than mission objective is dead and the fact that shieldguards can heal cannons after that doesn’t really matter.

Lying and ignoring facts… again.

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3.2 actually. And, since her projections are the free unit, not the actual cannon, it’s not at all fair to use the projection hp rather than the total actual hp. Meaning Zeratul Cannons are actually tankier, though with 15 cannons vs. 30 Karax cannons the Zeratul cannons are just over half the hp.

Well, we’re talking about situation where cannons are at home.
And even if count hp for Zerarul its 4,8/2 = 2,4 (4,23/2 =2,12).
Not sure what are you talking about since even 1 Karax cannon tankier than 1 Zeratul cannon.

Quick erase your post before people read it! Don’t embrace yourself.

So, I recalculated from the scratch, just in case.
For Karax 3 shield upgrades + 3 forge upgrades + Twilight + 1 twilight upgrade + 3 pylons + 3 energizers + 10 shield batteries + 30 cannons = 7310/1665
For the same money Zeratul can get ~ 11 shield guards + 16 cannons or just 18 cannons (since projections on the field doesn’t benefit from shield guards in any way).
In case 16 cannons, Karax have 50 % more dps and 4,5 times more hp + healing from batteries and healing from beam (2,25 more hp + healing from beam if count static cannons, not projections)
In case 18 cannons, Karax have 33 % more dps and 4 times more hp (2 times more hp if count static cannons, not projections) + healing from batteries and healing from beam.

In a larger scale (add 3 energizers, 3 pylons, 10 batteries, 30 cannons += 13295/2055) Zeratul for the same price can have ~ 14 shieldguards + 30 cannons or just 33 cannons.
In case 30 cannons, Karax have 60 % more dps and 4,8 times more hp + healing from batteries and healing from beam (2,4 more hp + healing from beam if count static cannons, not projections)
In case 33 cannons, Karax have 45 % more dps and 4,36 times more hp (2,18 times more hp if count static cannons, not projections) + healing from batteries and healing from beam.

So, either you have to learn math first before posting such stupid things or just stop lying.

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Last time I checked the stats, Karax cannon was 150hp/150 shields and had no shade barier, so I guess you have to do the math again. Or you really want to compare level 11 Zeratul (thats when he gets upgrade for shade barrier) with full mastery Karax? And even than, its 240/240 vs 200/200 + 200 hp barrier (with teseract matrix) And you are completly ignoring the fact that Karax cannons, bateries and pylons can be destroyed, while destroying projection means the cannon is stil there. And we have still that question of free unit, as Karax cannons cant defend and than push objectives, While zeratuls can.

I understand that with lack of experience it might be hard to realize how Zeratul cannons work.

So play Karax and check again. Shield batteries give barriers to cannons.
And you’re completely ignoring that if projections destroyed or on cooldown, Zeratul has nothing on the field and only has useless cannons at home. And because of that he can easily lose game to runaway trains/shuttles, dead Harvesting bots/Aurana.
And I understand that with lack of experience it might be hard to differentiate unit from building.

He said while completely forgetting about the barrier ability that gives Zeratul’s cannons effectively 500 hp (assuming you take the wrong topbar passive) compared to the 480 hp of max mastery Karax.