Why has cannon rush not been fixed?

Starcraft is a taking a dive and cannon rush is still ruining Vs. With Co-op commanders reset at level 5 and Vs mode unplayable from cheaters, only player created games are left. How sad is that? The death of Starcraft folks. It was a good run.

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Genuinely, how so?

From what I’ve personally played and otherwise watched, I’ve seen nothing that makes sense as cheating, so I do want to ask what makes you say this?

I genuinely think I’ve been cannon-rushed less this season than I have in previous seasons.

i love how people whine about stuff like cannon rush. Youd think maybe if its that bad of a problem for them they would learn how to defend against it. Try defending against 2 people cannon rushing, or more for that matter. You might learn a thing or two.

Being able to build into someone else’s base before they’ve been given a “fair” chance to provide a proper defense is not “cheating” but rather just poor rules. But exploiting it game after game to get an easy win from a team not prepared to defend against the exploit is. Pretending otherwise is just fueling the problem and makes you look asleep at the wheel. There is no denying that cannon rush has changed the entire game. Not preventing it, or giving proper defense to it is negligence of the map makers for Vs. It’s not a hard fix to provide the proper balance to the game. The game has already severely suffered from it and lost ten of thousands, or more. Keep ignoring it, but the pie is on their face, not the people complaining about it. Been playing the game since the release of SC1, and we all had to agree not to rush back then too, because there was no rush guard. Same concept now, without the honesty in gameplay. Fix it, or lose the legitimacy as an actual VS. game.

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While i agree with everything you said, cannon rush will remain in this game - it’s part of that stupid dice-roll strategy where sometimes you have to gamble and get lucky rather than play normal game.

In WOL/HOTS defending cannon rushes were easy as terran. In LOTV with 12 worker start it became much harder, but when i learned how to defend it, it was no longer a problem for me. Besides forget about any changes in that regard it’s too late. All you can do is adapt to it and learn how to deal with this. Good luck.

So, remember: Like all cheeses, the amount of early investment in this strategy means that if it is held, the offender is significantly behind.

I agree that it feels awful and one-dimensional when a game only checks the ‘single skill’ of your rush defense level instead of the variety of skills available over the course of a normal game; but it isn’t like it’s hopeless.

The only easy fix is increasing the build time of static defenses. Others, like cost or statistics, have serious knock-on consequences that would be problematic whether we’re discussing units or buildings, and that I don’t think are particularly worthwhile?

I’m going to vaguely gesture at how the GSL has plenty of contenders who use lots of cheeses to grab their wins.

Three rax reaper, proxy Immortal, 14-pool-flood are all exactly as legitimate as a standard proper macro build or whatever thing you want to compare to.

And like, if you successfully remove cannon rushes, are we going to remove proxy Immortals? Proxy Oracle, Tempest, Reapers? Bunker rushes? Proxy Hatch spine rushes?

Because all of these have exactly the same set of issues as the cannon rush. You get a situation where you can quickly deal significant damage to workers or critical infrastructure, and do so in a way that makes it hard to answer effectively.

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This is a game of strategy, not of being fair for a player who cant keep up. Anything goes in this game if you can think it up and pull it off. So no its not poor rules, its a you problem for thinking the way you do.

Lmao, if youve been playing since sc1 and you cant figure out how to defend a cannon rush in over 15+ years, thats a skill issue on you, period. Learn to build a tank and you wont have problems with cannon rushs. or you know just build troops and scout properly, and youd still have no problem with it.

Secondly agreeing to not rushing, wow, never heard of that one at all. Probably the lamest thing ive heard in my life.

Honesty…lmao. again its a game of strategy, use your brain and learn how to strategize, there is no honesty in war, anything goes, dont be one of those weak people who thinks everyone should play nice. Its a game dude, play it, its not meant to be a missyfest.

Lmao, pretty sure the games legitimacy is pretty good considering after 11+ years now its still going strong and still has viewership in esports, let alone the amount of people that still play this game after this many years. How about quit your crying and get good.

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To add to this, when you start removing disliked strategies, it quickly becomes a slippery slope. What becomes acceptable and what doesn’t? When some people find some strategies fun, and others don’t, why is it that only some strategies that people deem as unfun get removed? There’s so many reasons not to do this, especially when it’s shown to be consistently holdable with little issue for the most part.

In the past, strategies have only been removed when they were genuinely to powerful and to abusive to be able to counter effectively. Proxy void into tempest comes to mind, as does Byun’s old reaper build.

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So in other words. It’s a recognized problem that isn’t going to be fixed along with what sounds like is a list of other exploits. And then there is always a crowd of gamers defending these practices as legitimate, “because the game allows it.” Or they are just cheesing and don’t want their own cheese method removed. Cheaters always defend cheaters. It’s a written law.

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well unless your running illegal software to maphack or something, then no its not cheating. Again this game is a strategy game. If you have problems facing certain stratgies thats a YOU problem. Especially for someone who claims they been playing for as long as you supposedly have. To be honest tho, if your crying like a baby over cannon rush of all things, then you probably shouldnt play the game anyways. That would be like joining the military and as soon as you hit the front lines you cry about getting shot and ask for them not use guns. Its lame asking for something to get removed just cause you have a problem with it.

Again, go play teams and try defending against 2 or 3 or more protoss cannon rushing, you’ll learn real quick how to defend properly. If i can do it playing zerg, than you sure can do it playing against one toss as terran. And for peats sake learn to scout. If you see forge first then omg your getting cannoned and need to look for where its at. Pull workers and shut it down, or again, your terran so just build a tanks and wow cannon rush completely shut down by one single unit…geee who would of thought it would be as simple as that…smdh.

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No; the actual stance from the Blizzard balance team – at least, back in what was it, 2012?

Was that they knew that certain rushes were too good in… silver? gold? and then gave a light nerf and said, basically, that if it was still a problem then you have to get better at dealing with it.

It’s not going to get fixed because it isn’t an exploit. It is working as intended.

That you think that it shouldn’t work that way is fine, but it is and that’s that?

I mean, I hate cannon rushes as much as you do?

Actually, Riot recently released some funny statistics about this - cheaters report other cheaters more often than normal people!

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Imagine having a 100 million dollar game and making it imbalanced for 99% of players.
Imagine making elaborate 12 base maps and then allowing one race to skip all that.
Imagine making a race that feels unfair to even play.
Imagine defending kids building stuff in the other base 2 minutes into the game.

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yall complain about the easiest race to beat way to much. serious pds in these forums. maybe if yall would just get better at the game you learn how to kill them easy.

I agree, Terran is broken. Do you see why this is pointless to say in vague form? Please be specific.

To actually rebut, the first is obviously not the case, the second doesn’t make sense, and neither does the third.

If it’s actually kids, then why aren’t you letting them have fun?

If you’re dismissing their intelligence because of their strategy, then why are you complaining about it? Surely, you are the better player and can whack them down, and aren’t just salty.

Do you see why that’s annoying and why this entire series of exchanges is incredibly blasé?

No. I don’t cheese with Protoss because I know it ruins the game for alot of honest players. End of story. That should be enough to warrant attention on the state of the game.

just becuase you feel that way doesnt mean the majority of the player base does. Feelings is what your problem is. Your worried about making peoples feeling hurt about a strategy. Dude its a strat game, anything goes. Feeling should of been thrown out the door the moment you logged into the game. Your playing to win, hurt peoples feeling shouldnt even be a thought in your mind. Thats girly logic man, grow a set and man up. Yall fathers should be ashamed they raised a bunch of weak girly boys.

Protoss wouldnt be Protoss without stuff allowing you to win games with 50apm and a xbox controller

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dumbest thing i heard all day, sc2 doesnt accept controler technology.

I agree. It’s very unfortunate.

I don’t disagree, but what’s over the line of sporting to you is entirely different than what it is for others, right?

The primary fix for many rushes is learning how to defend them - that’s so basic that even Wings of Liberty released with two rush defense tutorials and a holdout macro tutorial - It’s just also that responding correctly to a given rush tends to be fairly specific, and that if you react late to the situation it’s already past time.

So it’s a game knowledge problem and I don’t know how you’d really fix that for a lot of cases; and basically every opinion I’ve read that goes “It’s easy to fix!” includes things that ruin other cool strategies that aren’t the intended victim of the fix.

Apparently; I have to voice that having empathy for your opponent is a good thing. Both empathy and sympathy in general are, and rebuking the idea of these like this is genuinely a very toxic mindset to have.

Caring about people is good. It is not unmanly nor girly to do so. It is humane.

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