Visual/Thematic Inconsistencies in Zagara’s Skinset

TLDR: Swarmlings should be reverted to their HotS campaign appearance for consistency’s sake, and Splitters should use the updated green Leviathan Brood Baneling skin. The current models deviate too much from their campaign appearances. Detailed reasonings below:

There are several discrepancies with the appearances of Zagara’s units that I would like to point out, which were introduced along with her Leviathan Brood skinset. Several of the skins look too similar to the unit variants of other Zerg commanders, or overwrite the appearances of campaign units in a manner that feels inconsistent. The main thing I would like to see is her Swarmlings and Splitters being returned to an appearance that more closely resembles their campaign incarnations – with her Swarmling being reverted to its classic appearances, and her Splitter being given the current multiplayer version of the Leviathan Brood Baneling skin (which is essentially the green campaign Splitter with spikes).

  • Swarmling – The Warchest Zergling skin doesn’t resemble the iconic appearance of the campaign Swarmling, with its imposing sail. This is at odds with Kerrigan’s Raptors, which retain their campaign appearance. The Warchest model also features only team color and no purple highlights, resulting in Zagara’s Swarmlings not being recognizably the same Zergling variant as in the campaign. It’d be like Kerrigan’s Raptors losing the green on their wings and being replaced with team colour (like the “mutant” multiplayer skin), resulting in a much less unique appearance. Furthermore, the level 12 talent still depicts the old Swarmling model. The Swarmlings should either be given back their old model, or the current model reworked to feature more purple highlights. Otherwise they just seem like a Zergling that’s been reskinned like Zagara’s other units; “Swarmlings” in name only.

(It should be noted that Alarak’s Slayers still use the appearance of the campaign Tal’darim Stalker, and Nova’s units use their Covert Ops campaign models and not the Special Forces skins. Zagara’s Swarmlings and Splitters, as far as I know, are the only player-made campaign units in co-op whose appearances were drastically changed from the campaign.)

  • Roach – Zagara’s Roaches too closely resemble Abathur’s Vile Roaches, despite having no special abilities. It’d be like another Terran commander using the Special Forces Marine skin when Nova already uses the skin it was based on. If her Roaches are going to look different from the baseline, they shouldn’t borrow their appearance from another variant when that appearance actually signifies a mechanical change.

(Zagara’s Hunter Killers have the same issue as the Roaches, in that they too closely resemble Kerrigan’s post-level 5 Hydralisks. There the webbing signifies the ability of Hydralisks to morph into Lurkers; with Zagara, the webbing signifies something entirely different. Even so, the Leviathan Brood skin and portrait suit Zagara’s Hunter Killers quite well, and they possess some visual features that Kerrigan’s Hydralisks don’t.)

  • Splitter/Splitterling – In the HotS campaign, Splitters were the green variant, whereas Hunter Banelings were the purple variant. Admittedly, the campaign Splitters did not have a distinct enough appearance from the basic Baneling. However, making the Splitters purple in co-op creates disconnect and inconsistency in relation to the campaign color-coding. I think it would be a considerable improvement if Zagara’s Splitters were changed to use the “fixed” version of the Leviathan Brood Baneling skin (which is green and resembles the campaign Splitter with added spikes). There’s no reason why Zagara – the only commander who uses Banelings (not counting Mecha Banelings) – should have her Banelings so drastically differ from the standard appearance. It’d be like Raynor’s Marines using the Tyrador or Umojan skin when no other commander uses the default Marines, or Alarak’s Wrathwalkers being changed to the multiplayer Forged skin (which resembles Fenix’s Colossi in shape).

(I also have a suggestion for Stetmann’s Banelings, which can be upgraded with the Hunter’s abilities. It would be a great change if, once upgraded, they could turn purple as a visual signifier. This would be a great visual nod to the campaign Hunter Banelings.)

I’ve always felt that Zagara’s skinset was somewhat tacked-on, especially considering that it doesn’t even apply to her whole army (and none of her structures). The units of hers that have the Leviathan skins don’t match her structures, her Aberrations and Scourges, or even Zagara herself. All other commanders with skinsets (which is most of them) have lore or thematic reasons as to their differing aesthetic, but Zagara does not. In co-op, alternate skinsets are mostly used to signify substantive alterations from base mechanics, (either in singular units or entire armies,) yet Zagara’s units mainly function they way they do in multiplayer and the campaign. I admit that I am perhaps unfairly biased against Zagara’s skinset, and one could easily go in the other direction and update the rest to match (although this is unlikely seeing as Stukov still hasn’t been given his due portrait-wise). Even so, I still think it’s a highly reasonable request that her Swarmlings and Splitters should more closely resemble their campaign versions. As it stands, the current Swarmling’s overabundance of team color looks too generic, and the Splitter’s bright purple color is too garish and differs too much from the previously-established norm.

Thoughts?

4 Likes

The swarmling skin from the campaign has no visual indicator for metabolic boost, unlike the leviathan brood skin. Since zerglings are such core units to zagara’s army, I think that visual is kind of appreciated.

Also, I hate the swarmling skin from HotS. I don’t care about slight differences in color as much as I dislike the fishling aesthetic. No opinion on splitterlings.

I prefer the zagara-specific banelings and swarmlings, but i think aberrations should have some spikes added for continuity. I like the purple banelings.

Others:

Stukov should use the Cerberus skin for overlords, at least with P1. With queens, they stand out awkwardly amidst a combination machinery/zerg army.

Alarak should use updated skins from the forges set- for example, on slayers.

Swann should use some sort of other skin for siege tanks. Probably the commando skin. His workers should use umojan skin.

Tychus should use junker skin SCVs.

Nova should have updated skins from the skin set.

Karax should use a special pylon skin, once he gets his instant-warp power.

Maybe Abathur should use classic drone skin? Also, Viper strain mutalisk.

There are a lot of ways the commanders could be tweaked with these existing skins to help diversify the look of each commander. For the most part, it should be simple to recognize which commander each player is on sight. Zag does this very well with her leviathan brood, abathur doesn’t.

Karax and Artanis look VERY similar, except for the solar forge. Vorazun usually ends up dropping dark pylons, so her bases start to look different.

Anyway, mostly they are great, and the little changes here and there over the years have really enriched the game for flayers like me. But there are still some outstanding issues that bug me every time i see them on the screen.

3 Likes

here what I think they can change for Zagara and all the others commanders:

Raynor
*N/D (he is perfect like this)

Kerrigan
*Change Lurker model with the HotS model
*Use Nydus Worm portrati for Nydus/Omega Worm

Artanis
*Use the Glacius skin and portrait for Tempest after level 12
*Use Adun skin and portrait for Immortal

Swann
*Options:
**Use Commando skin and portrait for Siege tank
**Use Collector edition skin and portrait for Thor
-or-
**Create a complete Mechanical theme skinset

Zagara
*Create Leviathan Brood skin and portrait for Scourge and Aberration
*Use different model and portrait for Hunter Killer (even just a redish light would be good for the portrait)
*Give TC for Scourge’s Nests and Bile Launcher
*Create buildings (and Larvas) Leviathan Brood skinset and use it

Vorazun
*Dark Archons creable fusing Dark Templars instead of warping them
*Options:
**Use the scythe skin and portrait for regular Dark Templars (to match the campaign)
**Use the Advanced skin and portrait for the Stalker
-or-
**Create a complete Nerazim skinset

Karax
*Replace Immortals with Annihilators after level 9
*Nerazim skin for Khaydarin Monolith
*Glacius console
*Create a complete Glacius skinset

Abathur
*Replace Swarm Host with Creepers after level 9
*Make Vipers an evolution of Mutalisk instead of Larvas
*Change Viper portrait with the Viper evolved from Mutalisks portrait
*Make a more purplish skin for Viper since the Vipers evolved from Mutalisks skin is just a bit darker (and is almost impossible to distinguish)
*Change Mutalisk skin and portrait with the Mutalisk Viper strain skin and portrait after level 8
*Use Nydus Worm portrait for Nydus Worm
*Options:
**Create a new portrait for Swarm Queen
**Use Bone skin and portrait for Ravager
-or-
**Create a complete Evolution skinset

Alarak
*Use Forged Stalker and Colossus skin and portrait for Slayer and Wrathwalker

Nova
*New portrait for Strike Goliath
*Use Special Forces buildings skinset and portrait
*Use Railgun turret portrait for Railgun turret

Stukov
*Create portraits for: Infested SCV, Infested Diamonback, Infested Instable, Infested Liberator, Brood Queen and Infested Adjutant (for buildings)
*Use the Infested Siege Tank portrait without googles (don’t make sense they gain googles after infestation)
*Create model and portrait for Infested Trooper
*Infested console

Talandar
*Use Purifier skin for Adept
*Use Purifier skin and portrait for Disruptor
*Rename Immortal and Carrier to Defensor and Bomber

Dehaka
*Change Primal Igniter skin and portrait with the Primal Ravager
*New portrait for Primal Host (to make it different from Creeper Host)

Han & Horner
*Create Special Forces skin and portrait for Asteria Wraith (when no-upgraded)
*Use Special Forces portraits for Theia Raven and Deimos Viking
*Use Campaign Special Forces portrait for Sovereign Battlecruiser
*Use regular Adjutant portrait for Dominion’s Starport and before the upgrade for the Strike Fighter Platform
*New portrait for the Assault Galleon

Tychus
*Give to Blaze his Heroes of the Storm quotes
*Options:
**Devil’s Havens console (if Blizzard don’t consider him the Umojans commander)
**Make the skins and portraits of the units more unique
-or-
**Umojan console

Zeratul
*Use completly the Ihan-rii skinset and portrait
*Completly change Xel’Naga Ambusher and Xel’Naga Enforcer portraits (since they are completly different)

Stetmann
*N/D (he is perfect like this)

Mengsk
*New portraits for Shock Division, Blackhammer, Imperial Intercessor, Imperial Withness, Sky Fry and Blackhammer

1 Like

That definitely is a problem, but I’d still like to see the current Zerglings have more purple to contrast the team color. In general, that set of Warchest skins had an overabundance of team color that could have been distinctive coloration. Later skins don’t have this problem. They could also create a winged variant of the old skin.

I personally don’t see anything wrong with it. I still think changing the skin wasn’t a great choice, as it disrupts continuity, no matter what anybody’s opinion of it is.

Either way, something has to be done about the level 12 icon discrepancy.

I just wanted to note that the purple Splitterling spawn are too bright compared to the green campaign version. Somehow the emissive got turned way up. They stick out like a sore thumb on the battlefield, in contrast to the muted purple of the Splitters they come from. The green Splitters from the campaign matched their spawn. At the very least, they should make the Splitterlings less glaringly bright. In addition, the green Splitterlings had (minimal) team color, while the purple ones don’t.

To be honest, that’s probably the one thing that bothers me the most. I’d be fine with the purple Banelings if it weren’t for that. But as it is now, the colors and brightness just don’t match – the Baneling spawn look like miniature violet Christmas lights.

I’m not convinced this is an appropriate choice, as the Cerberus skins are already associated with Mengsk, and it would raise some strange lore questions. In my opinion, it looks somewhat too high-tech for his aesthetic. I would prefer that Stukov receive his own skins for these units.

Apart from the Stalkers and Colossi, the skins are all exactly the same except many of them omit red light in favor of team color. And the Colossi uses the same model as Fenix’s with different textures. They had to create a new Forged skin for the Warchest because the Wrathwalker skin had already been made a reward. This doesn’t mean that the new model should replace the Wrathwalker model when the current one is perfectly adequate, and most importantly, matches the campaign model.

I see your point about the commando skin being a good fit, but it has a somewhat altered tint and it might clash with the rest of his army. Tychus, meanwhile, already uses an altered Umojan SCV skin, and Swann is associated with the Kel-Morians, not the Umojans. If there’s ever a Kel-Morian skinset, they can use those.

Meanwhile, if Tychus’ SCV skin was changed to the Junker skin, it would resemble Han and Horners’ SCVs too closely.

I think Nova’s structures are fine as-is, and they already use the new portrait. The Railgun Turret portrait is very basic and simply depicts the structure model; not changing it is better for consistency. I wholeheartedly agree about the Strike Goliath portrait.

Could definitely be.

Classic Drone skin might clash too much with the general co-op aesthetic, as the graphic style is slightly different. I think those Brood War skins are meant to be versus only as a kind of extra.

Viper strain Mutalisks would require them to change the current mechanics as to how Abathur’s Vipers are created. I did think it would be interesting if one of Kerrigan’s prestiges allowed her to morph Vipers from Mutalisks in place of Brood Lords.

Can’t disagree here. Although the Leviathan Brood Lurker skin might be more appropriate here, as it has the updated animations.

I must admit, although Purifier units aren’t really part of Artanis’ purview or aesthetic, this first would be a good lore choice. As to the second, I’m not sure. If anyone is going to use an alternate Immortal skin, it would be Karax.

Not sure what to say about this one. I don’t know if Swann really needs new skins, because he still falls under the umbrella of “basic Terran”.

Some fine ideas, although I like the current Hunter Killer portrait.

A Nerazim skinset would be lore-appropriate for Vorazun. I don’t think the alternate model for Dark Templar needs to be removed, as this is one area where matching the campaign adds nothing (unless to make her templar exclusive from Zeratul’s). The Dark Archon idea is a fine one, although it shouldn’t replace warping them in, but should rather be in addition.

The fact that they went to the trouble of creating a Khalai skin for his monoliths means this reverse change is unlikely. They probably want to avoid mixing too many factions and aesthetics. This also makes Annihilators unlikely, but I could see his Immortals using the Adun or Golden Age skin. A full Glacius skinset would likely cause overlap with Fenix, although I could see him getting a new console skin.

I think Abathur is fine as-is, to be honest. Using the Nydus Worm portrait and creating a new portrait for Swarm Queen are both good ideas though.

Absolutely nothing I disagree with here. Ideally, they would have done all this long ago.

Fenix’s units really don’t need to be renamed. The Purifier Adept skin would require reworking, as it lacks the special attachment point for Talis’ “halo”. The Disruptor skin would be an acceptable change, but not strictly necessary either.

The Primal Igniter might be too confusing if it resembles the Ravager but doesn’t have its signature ability. Primal/Creeper Host I can agree with, even if it’s just a new lighting.

All-around good ideas.

I think Tychus’ skins and portraits are already pretty unique. Blaze getting his own quotes wouldn’t match the other outlaws, but it’s a possibility. I don’t think Tychus would be considered the Umojan commander; a Heaven’s Devils console would definitely be appropriate.

Good suggestions, although I like his current building portrait. He should definitely use the Ihan-rii console.

Nothing to disagree with here.

I’ll second the thoughts about the Khaydarin Monolith change for Karax- it used to be Nerazim colors, stood out awkwardly amidst Karax’s yellow buildings, and made little sense lore-wise. The change to make them more Karax-colored is good and should stay.

Otherwise i like your list for the most part.

4 Likes

for this I said just this two, because the others match (except for TC), for me the Forged skin colossus make more sense, since Alarak is allied with Daleaam, and make sense he create new Wrathwalker based on the Purifiers Colossi instead of the Aiur Colossi, since the Purifiers are more advanced and powerfulls (and in this way he can have all the skins that match with the rest of the skinset.

The Special Forces buildings skinset are a lot more detalied, the one used right now are just a recolored version of the default skin, and I like the Railgun portrait.

But Zagara is the leader of the Leviathan Brood, not Kerrigan, so Leviathan Brood skin for Kerrigan’s Lurkers would make no sense.

Karax shouldn’t even have Immortals, since gameplay-wise they are actually Annihilators, is dumb he still have Immortals.

well… he got a proper console, for me a skinset for him could be cool

but no make so much sense. Hunter Killers are strains made by Tiamat Brood, Zagara control the Leviathan Brood, so, why they have the Leviathan Brood appearence? They deserve a proper look (I forgot they have model of Leviathan Brood btw… I would change that too and give them a more unique model)

yhea, add as an addition is a cool idea too

Actually… the Aiur skin existed before the Nerazim skin, because the Khaydarin Montlith are a scrapped structure of HotS, and people could find his death model in-game, then they reused it but with Nerazim skin.
But Karax’s Immortals aren’t actually Immortals, since they got the Shadow Cannon, and that make absolutly no sense. They are basically Annihilators but with aestethic and name of Immortals, and is dumb.

Replace Swarm Hosts with Creepers is absolutly needed. Abathur’s SH are Creepers with default SH skin, and here too is dumb.
For Vipers, in-game was said is really difficult make even minor changes for strains originated by Primals. Abathur never could make evolved strains be created by Larvas, so for a Viper would be even more difficult. For this Vipers from Mutalisk make a lot more sense for him.

But they are different units… if you check the editors that units had a different name, and since are completly different lore-wise (Immortals are nearly dead warriors inside a robot-walker, here we have robots with warriors AI). For Talis, I think they can just make a model for her to have the “halo”.

Well… I think right now is even more confusing since they are nearly identical to Primal Roaches.

Depend, some of them are just recolored Umojans portrait/skins, I would make something more unique for them.

Zeratul already use the Ihan-rii console :wink:

I’m hoping sometime down the line we will get a complete Purifier building skin set (Talandar doesn’t use all buildings and they just seem like recolored default skins).

Hopefully, Vorazun can get as full Nerazim base skin too (been asking for that for while).

1 Like

Like with Vorazun’s Dark Templar; Karax’s Immortals just happen to use the same ability as the Annihilator. It is supposed to be an Immortal.

They explicitly changed it to be NOT nerazim about a year ago, and it was brilliant. Why would you want to go back?

3 Likes

the ability is literally named “SHADOW cannon” make absolutly zero sense to be used by Immortals.
Dark Templars with Stasis too I don’t liked so much, but at least is not something strictly linked to Tal’darim. But SHADOW cannon is with Nerazim

Because in this way Karax can be a commander with a lot of types of technologies. He already use a lot of Glacius’ Purifers things, Aiur tech and have Annihilators (with name and skin o Immortals that is dumb) so for him have both Annihilators and Khaydarin Monlith would make totally sense and give him a bit of everyone tech (except of Tal’darim) with Glacius as main focus.

This is Karax we are talking about. He can modify his Immortals to use the Shadow Cannon. Like I said before; Vorazun’s Dark Templar use all 3 abilities from each variant of Dark Templar from the Campaign. It isn’t a big deal.

Karax isn’t in charge of a Daelaam mixed force. His is really just Purifier and Templar/Auir mix.

Just allow any skins to be used in Co-op, not just Ladder.

Easy money for Blizzard, and everybody can make their own brood/faction/whatever.

Shadow canon is not a technology, is an ability, Annihilators can use it because the pilot inside is a Nerazim and his nearly-dead state make him possible to use that. So, no, Karax could not do that.
Dark Templars just have 2 abilities. Their own and the Statis from Blood Hunter, but Nerazim at least have statis realated technology/abilities (think about Stasis Ward of Oracle), so is nothing too strange they have that ability.

He got Shadow Cannon and Khaydarin Monlith, both things are about Nerazims. You can even put a different skin on it, but still remain a Nerazim ability/tech.

No, that would be dumb, since nearly all commanders have their own skin

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If it is an ability; then yes, Immortals could still use it. The Templar are now connected to the Void as well if you remember. It’s not like they are Purifiers.

As for the Monolith; it is technology Karax could reverse-engineer. Which he likely did. (If I recall correctly) Karax reverse-engineered Purifier technology to make the equipment for the Auir variant of the Adept.

emh… no. If that was the case, the Archons would not even exist. So, Immortals cannot absolutly learn to use Shadow Cannon.

Khaydarin Monlith have nothing to do with Purifiers.

Perhaps a good compromise would be for Karax’s Immortals to become Annihilators when they unlock Shadow Cannon, but the plating is gold instead of silver. Sort of like how the Corsair is a Nerazim ship, but still uses gold plating. It would match the rest of his army aesthetically, while also enabling use of the portrait and campaign quotes.

This is one area where a divergence from the campaign appearance would be justified for aesthetic reasons. The model itself though would be exactly the same; only the textures would be changed from the campaign Annihilator.

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or can be an Annihilator with Glacius plate, maybe to represent the fact that Karax upgraded them with Glacius tech, in this way will match even better with the rest of the units

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I guess I should have phrased it “can connect to the Void” not “are connected to the Void”. My bad. At any rate; yes. Auir Immortals could use Shadow Cannon. All they need to do is be kept near death (tech) and tap into the Void (ability). Both of these the Auir Protoss are capable of.

As for using the Purifier Tech example; My point was that Karax is capable of reverse-engineering technology. Including Nerazim technology.

no, they can’t, they have completly different abilities.

And Karax’s Immortals are gameplay-wise Annihilators, is dumb they are called Immortals.
Is like if I put an Hydralisk in-game, but I give to it the name and the skin of an Ultralisk, IS STILL AN HYDRALISK!