(mutation) A person can solo normal but die in 10 min in hard?

So it’s either have almost no fun with the cake-walk that is normal (with a specific character), or have almost no fun getting wiped in 10 minutes in hard.

Or generally: to have almost no fun with the cake-walk of the level you’re on, or have no fun getting wiped in 10 minutes at the next harder level.

Can you guys consider implementing more happy mediums so you can actually enjoy the game with a challenge instead of the only two options being “cake-walk” or “wipe in 10 minutes”?

It’s trivial to create shades of difficulty in between (enemy unit stats for example, minor buffs each level). Why wouldn’t you?!

Yes, of course you can get someone to play down. That doesn’t address the issue: 2 players who find one difficulty way too easy should not suddenly find the very next higher difficulty impossible. That makes both options boring and defeats the purpose of a game: to have fun.

And how you play the game will only determine how far up in the difficulty ladder you can eventually get - it doesn’t address the idea that one difficulty is a cake-walk (boring) while the very next difficulty level becomes about impossible (boring).

Isn’t that Brutal+ in a nutshell? Bunch of players was used to Brutal and wanted harder difficulties, we got random mutations added to keep coop a bit fresh, but on release it was a big jump of difficulty compared to standard Brutal.

So, actually talking about the post, it’s better for you to adapt the ways to survive Hard mode than really having to commit to even more extra difficulties, what hurts a player in normal mode to get used to the hard mode is more on the game speed than the enemies, the time to macro is different.

What Ryner said. The biggest difference between normal and hard is that hard doesn’t give you 10m to mess around with your base, setting things up. Once you have an established army both difficulties will play pretty similarly (usually - some enemy comps get bothersome casters on hard), but hard asks a lot more of you in the first few minutes.

I strongly recommend you look at some guides and get build orders for your favored commander. It will help you immensely to set up a strong econ in time to handle waves.

Also, learn hotkeys, especially for basic buildings - the stuff you’ll be building very quickly in the opening minutes.


As Mortis said above!

Metaphorically you’ve moved from being a big fish in a small pond to a tiny fish in a big pond. Try growing a little and things will be much better.

Try: https://starcraft2coop.com/

Thank you for the replies everyone.
My thought was: a level more difficult than normal? Of course. But the gap in difficulty seems too big.

There are easy ways to make levels of difficulty in between so you have challenging matches on your way to get as good as you need to be to win against what is currently labeled “hard”. That way you can still have fun while getting better, verses just getting wiped in 10 minutes until the day ever comes you figure it out, verses being somewhat bored on normal, all because the gap in difficulty between the two levels is too big.

So even if, between toon level and skill level I one day can deal with “hard”, it doesn’t change the point I’m bringing up that perhaps the gap between the two is a bit much.

Hopefully the devs consider that.

In any event, thanks for the replies!

I think the main reason for that is the increase in enemy difficulty combined with the speed increase. It’s a tricky balance when trying to please so many different players, but overall more were pleased with the speed increase on hard than those who didnt like it.

This is most likely another case of make 10 gateways on one base with +3/3 before making units.

The OP needs to learn to make workers one at a time non stop and make units from 1-2 buildings non stop. This will take one all the way to Brutal.

Asking to change the game to fit ones play style instead of changing the style to fit the game makes no sense.

Well to be fair the gap between normal and hard ain’t thát big, the difference between “hard” and “brutal” is way bigger.

I was stuck on hard for quit some time, till I massively increased my macro capabilities by commander ánd hotkey guides.

The main difference between normal and hard is the speed and the fact enemy used stealth.
So get used to building detection and read some build order guides for your commanders. The gap won’t feel as big then, and you might even make it to brutal :wink::+1:t3:

Hello. Good points.

So then, for example, have a new medium difficulty be “speed increase” only over normal, then hard has both speed and unit increase. That would be an example of increased difficulty in smaller increments.

Hello. One of the earliest things I do is make sure I get second base up and saturate both. I’m always making drones until both are full. Only then do I make more combat unit buildings (using floating resources) so that I don’t have a stockpile of unspent resources either.

But again: regardless just wish the gap was not so big between levels so that your only 2 choices are:
(1) Too easy
(2) Too hard

Both of which are not as fun.

Just throwing that out there, but again thank you for all the feedback everyone.

Could you upload a replay of playing on hard and getting wiped in 10 min? It might be more productive to reflect on a specific example. Than you just don’t make the same mistake again and keep winning.

Good point! Sometimes there’s a key mistake early on that when fixed makes the whole mission easier.

Is there a way to upload one here?

While it’s always nice to get feedback on personal playing tips, please note that I’m seeking for smaller differences between difficulty levels (mutation only - I’ve only just tried non-mutation missions yesterday so cannot comment yet on them) so that you can go from a cake-walk to one that’s actually challenging that you sometimes might lose, instead of to something so difficulty I need to get special training to be able to deal with it.

And to be fair, since it’s a team game, it does rely heavily on how good your ally is as well, since a really good ally could carry you, maybe an ally the same skill level as you and you’d win as well, but now it’d be more of a challenge, etc

This site was recommended in another thread for uploads:

There are two factors to success in coop:
Production and Decision making. We can see from the replay which one is the bottleneck.

I remember my 1st game, I made half a dozen units and was very proud of it while the other guy already maxed out on capital ships. One can’t always judge own play objectively.

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I wouldnt say so. Speed on hard was increased from Fast to Faster so it’s now same as in Brutal and that is a big factor for many players I think.
Also enemy compositions include one more “ultimate” unit (like Lurkers, Arbiters …) for hard+ that is not present on normal-.
And some Mutations are more limited on normal (like fewer void rifts, propagators or solar beams) but are the same on Hard and Brutal.

So basically Brutal is ~hard with “just” more enemy units and 1 less mineral patch in your expansion, while normal has also lower game speed and more reductions in difficulty/complexity than just numbers.

The speed difference doesn’t help anybody. I don’t understand why Blizzard continues to use it.

The sooner that new players get familiar with the fastest (standard) speed the better. Having players have to adjust to different speeds is counter-productive to their own progress. Shouldn’t have to learn the game at different speeds, should only have one speed and everyone learns the rest of the game at that speed.

That’s assuming players want to “progress” and that is the role of difficulty levels.
The role of difficulty levels is to allow playets of different skill leves to have fun.

After all there is Brutal+ now, maybe coop should just all be at faster speed (instead of fastest) so it’s easy for people to progress to Brutal+6.

“But I don’t like mutations as a way to add difficulty” you say, and so you stick to Brutal
Some people don’t like the fastest game speed so they stick to normal… there were enough people upset over speeding up hard, no reason to speed up normal as well.

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I have never understand how people are struggle on Brutal. I have never played the game under “Brutal” to understand the difficulty they faced. Brutal feel like “Casual Baby mode” currently (Tbh, the entire Co-op section is baby mode). How are you guy struggle with “Under Brutal” difficulty? This mode is literally massing one button to victory.

Well there are plenty of people who are lacking in certain basic skills and understanding. Some because they’re new or just want to play casually, and others because of hubris. For example I had an ally on a B+ who said how awesome he was because he’s high on ladder so he ignored my advice on playing Nova. I challenged him to take one enemy wave without my help and it wiped his entire army - one nuke or airstrike would have taken it down, but no, he’s too amazing for that.

Nova losing all army is a big oof

I never understood why people would mock people having struggles by saying that it’s too easy / “baby mode” like you did here and also in the mutation topic. If brutations are too easy for you, then do something harder. Solo or speedrun them, or just do Brutal +6, or become pro player, or play some other game if SC2 is too easy.
Or provide some suggestions or tips to other players. Or brag about something that you did that was actually hard for you.