Comparing zerg to other races!

General Discussion
46

locunts r free becuse u just need 2 click the make locunt 4 free button 2 make

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47

This is biggest load of crap. Lair costs 150 min 100 gas.

For Toss to get detection we need Gateway (150 min), Cyber core (150), and then either robo (150/100) or stargate (150/150)

So even if you discount the gateway and core cost since you always have to get those, in the time it takes to build those and then also build the robo (or stargate), zerg can get a lair just fine. There is no arguing that you cant get detection up. And btw toss needs to build gate->core->twilight → DT shrine (which takes forever)-> actually warp in/move DTs to your side of the map. Plenty of time to get detection. Meanwhile, unless he does catastrophic damage he is probably dead because he doesn’t have a robo or stargate out if you already have detection.

Despite how greedy builds have gotten, no, you don’t need 3 bases and 45+ workers before you get a lair.

4 Likes
48

You’ve never played zerg then if you think rushing lair at 5 minutes is a good idea. And yes, you do need 3 bases and 45 drones to get lair because you can’t do anything with lair until then. lol You won’t have a good enough economy for mutas or hydras or infestors nothing. So it’s a wasted investment.

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49

Its 100 gas. A friggin hundred gas. The only reason why you see Zergs delay their lair so long is because they can. Who needs gas when ling, queen and maybe roach defends everything early game and then you can just pop down spores at 4 min to stop all stargate and DT harass.

What can you do with a lair before 5 minutes? You can get lair with your second 100 gas. Its called rush to nydus and queen ling flood his base and then laugh your butt off as he flails about uselessly while getting stomped.

3 Likes
50

Actually zergs have been getting lair lairs since WOL so it’s not a thing that only started because they could. It’s called efficiency. You don’t get something you can’t use. Yes it only costs so much, but you can’t do anything with it so It’s kind of waited at the moment. And it actually doesn’t stop all stargate or DT harass. You’re argument is malarky. If you think about terran and they miss a dt they have scan. Protoss opens one of two ways and can easily chrono out detection. But you’re saying that if zerg should be forced to take game ending damage if they didn’t start their lair at what 3 minutes. That stupid. It will lead to terrible games. You have to start your lair or risk losing. So you lose out on early game defense. You can’t take a third as fast. You can’t do anything with that lair but hey at least your safe from that banshee…only terran never went banshee. A game where you are forced to do something because there’s a 30% chance it could hit you is a terrible game.

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51

The fact is whether you get a lair or a spores, detection is available to zerg with almost no barriers. Frankly zerg has the easiest access to detection so I still don’t get your commend about Toss gets to open robo or stargate. Toss HAS to open those, or get a forge to get detection.

And your comments about banshees and other stuff… what are you trying to say? Is it tough to scout as zerg too? No, the game shouldn’t be where zergs can just macro opening and be safe against everything. Sorry.

3 Likes
52

Protoss can utilize both of those buildings. You get oracle for harass /scouting/detection. You can get void ray for defense. Same with robo you can get observer to scout/detect immortal for def or warp prism for harass. If you go lair as fast as that to get detection out…you can’t use it.

You can’t justify the investment as zerg, but you can as protoss because it’s going to give you something you need anyway in the right now. Zerg just threw everything into a lair with no benefit as you can’t use it.

You clearly have zero knowledge of the game and just want every race to behave the exact same way. It’s quite clear why zerg doesn’t need to have evo chamver to get spores as I pointed out.

As for the banshee. It’s the easiest argument to follow. In wings of liberty if you didn’t throw down an evo at the right time you were just toast if you missed a cloaked unit. Terran can drop a scan if they mess up and miss the cloak and protoss can chrono out detection fast. Zerg welp you you have to wait for the evo to finish and then the spore to finish and oh my the way you’re dead now because they proxied a DT shrine and you didn’t know. It’s quite an easy argument to follow.

Also, if you think zerg can just macro open and be safe from everything then you, truely, do not understand the game.

2 Likes
53

Did you pay for it?

No → it was free.
Yes → it was not free.

54

Again, I have no idea what you are talking about. If you don’t have detection by the time DTs are out that’s totally on you. It takes a looong time. You deserve to get punished.

And a build where you build both a robo and stargate simultaneously right after core and just start producing out of both? With what gas? Please show me this build because there is no pro player that uses it and it sounds awful. Robo + twilight sure. And I don’t understand how this game works?

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55

Are you acting dumb or is this real life? DT’s are not the only cloaked unit in the game. There is banshee, mines, Burrow etc. You’re argument is that zerg should have no safety net like the other unit if you misscout? That’s a bit absurd.

Also, what are you even talking about? I never said protoss opens both robo and stargate. I said they have detection on both. That’s why the oracle was given detection. So protoss wasn’t screwed if they opened stargate and their was cloak. You open one but have detectors at both. That’s also why they removed the evo that way ther are more flexibility in openings. You don’t always have to get an evo because you can grab a spore just like terran can grab a scan. I think you’re reading skills need some work.

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56

If you want me to response to you, better learn some basic english vocabulary/grammar.

57

This is an extremely biased post, though it isnt without elements of truth, it doesn’t tell the full story.

58

It consumes 2 HTs though isn’t that the same as paying for something?
While locust consumes nothing just a time restriction and a CD until you can unleash them again.

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59

does it cost something, when a marine shoots?

60

Friend please come to your senses, a marine,a stalker or a roach has to put themselfs at risk to “shoot”. Other sieging units have to be sieged or become immobile when they shoot, SH unload their locust and then can run to a nydus or just retreat and have effective siege range 26(effective means that the locust can land and have enough time to do dmg)

I mean come on unless you use this forum as a practice for your debate club you can easily understand why people call locust free units.

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61

so with other words - if you manage to kill that nydus, while swarmhosts are out… you can kill the swarmhosts?

62

Sure assuming that they are not close to creep since they have 5.37 speed while they are on it.

Correction actually the liquipedia number is wrong they have 4.09 speed on creep in the unit tester.

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63

What on earth does that have to do with Shield batteries?

64

LOL you moron. The standard timing for a lair after a three hatch macro opening is at 3:50. Forum zergs never want to admit how easy zerg is compared to the other races.

3 Likes
65

Swarmhosts are freakishly fast, even off creep.

2 Likes