Co-op Mission Update – February 14th, 2020

Not fully. Only in supply cost. Overall, it’s more expensive assuming each supply from Overlord has a 12.5 min cost, but only 25 more in mins going by that “conversion”.

Someone already pointed out that this returns us to the glory days when you can get as many Bunkerlisks when they were only 4 supply. Another is it frees up your Infested CC charges for less need of Overlords in the early game when you tend to run your charges down to nothing.

Still things to fix
Han Horner: galleons needs to Heal themselves like other combat units
Zagara: needs Regenerative Acid and Better corruptors
Zerg Heroes Coccoon would be nice queens can spawn them faster with auto Transfusion (they are able to but has no effect).
Kerrigan: Improve Chain Reaction and Mastery 3.2 (I am standing by this change), Also can Broodlord Inherit Rapid regeneration
Tychus: Medivac Regeneration must stay even the crews are hit
Mengsk: Increased Nuke range for SoE
Dehaka: Fix Creeper to target Air to ground units such as Banshee and Broodlords (they mostly ignore the over other units), Also have them damage Friendly Units (they just don’t).
Stukov: change mech attack speed mastery into Mech Regen

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Blockquote Han Horner : galleons needs to Heal themselves like other combat units

Blockquote

I’ve always thought Swann’s regenerating steel upgrade was redundant given his Science Vessels. What makes the most sense to me, Mira being the innovative thinker that she is, is that she has Matt invite Swann over for dinner; and then she gets him SUPER drunk and garrulous; and she steals the plans for regenerating mech. But see she’s also kind and generous deep down, so she gives Swann some kind of fun, explody thing in exchange.

There, now it’s canon.

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A little redundancy isn’t such a bad thing. I actually don’t bother with his SV some of the time, unless I really need the detection. They’re 100/200/2, and at the end of his tech tree.

?
I don’t get it.
So you are FOR Galleons getting regeneration after battle?

Thank you for continuing to support Co-op mode. I love the changes to Stukov and will now start to invest more time into playing SC2. Infested Terran FTW!

I really appreciate that you continously work on Co-op. But could we set back to previous ways of announcing new changes, please? Back in time you listed the planned changes, people were able to react and give advices about them and some of those ideas were counted in and the patch was released according to that. Before the christmas holidays there was an announced patch for the next day clearly written what was going to be changed. You did not ask the players if they were good. This time is even worse, we did not have a chance to react and knowledge on which to react, because minimal ammount of the planned changes were announced. I think Karax’s Solar upgrade levels should have been made cheaper similarly to the infestation levels.

Please, in the future tell us what you plan and give people a week to react and count them in as well! That’s the best way to keep the community part of the Starcraft family. Let them have a word or two.

Thank you!

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Of course. And I have to believe Mira would find it useful too

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I have mixed feelings about this patch.
I loved the widow mines, the creep and idbs for Stukov, Swann and Karax changes seem ok.

I don’t like the ravager buff for a commander that beat brutations with one base and the ibunkers change, more netflix while playing again?

I don’t like braindead styles. But, let’s see what happens in a future patch because I know you will release more patches, right? :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:

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Interesting patch, I might actually install Starcraft 2 again and give the changes a spin.

I stopped playing after the Stetmann infestors were nerfed again and again and Stukov was nerfed as well. Was no point in playing a disposable swarmy build, plus I knew that any new commander would be nerfed soon, so I did not bother buying Mengsk. I was right.

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Played Karax with Swann ally and it was good, enough gas to make a strong army.

Than I played without Swann and it was quite different. Still can work, but maps take longer.

For example lock and load i can finish in 11-13 min with any other commander, took 18 min with Karax, it was smooth and easy but longer. Have to wait for those full cost units to come out.

I believe the problem is low DPS. 2-3 units is enough to clear locks 1,2,3 which are closest to the base. The other two locks are on large bases which are defended and include hybrids. A few units with high HP just don’t cut it when need to kill wave, defences and high HP hybrids.

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At this point I’m worried rather than excited when I see a new patch popping up.

Karax is still really slow, and since there’s no unit cost mastery anymore, having the ability researches be cheaper makes no real difference compared to before. Of course it’s less likely that you will lose units to attrition, but if you were capable of keeping most of your units alive before it’s a straight out nerf IMO.

That aside, I’m happy to see what they did with Stukov and H&H, especially bunkers, and mine gas cost.
It just boggles the mind that they didn’t go any further with Karax. As I’ve said before I would much rather see the unit tax removed and a smaller unit HP increase like Swann. On its own having a few researches 50/50 cheaper doesn’t amount to much.
If it were researches across the board it would be a different thing, I’m thinking Spear of Adun, and, hell, all the Forge upgrades including 1/1 etc., at that point you would start noticing the difference and Karax is the Master Phase-Smith after all :slight_smile:

I wouldn’t have minded if energizers got their reclamation range increased a tad, when I use them it feels a bit sluggish since they often need to move in range first to hit those high value targets like tempests, especially when assaulting bases. And their target priority is a bit too high, makes it easy to lose them, I would honestly prefer if they didn’t have a damage attack at all, but either a buff or debuff instead.

Just remove the unit tax that’s what Karax needs, or at least the gas part of it.
And no it won’t make him just like other commanders, units costing more isn’t exactly a positive way to differentiate a commander IMO when they get so little out of it (if it was a 25% dps and hp increase instead I wouldn’t mind paying extra for them, but HP increase alone is just bad), and he still have plenty of other things to make him feel somewhat unique (even if newer commanders do most of it better).

Still I’m happy that the 4 supply bunkers are back, even though they are now even more expensive, the cheaper infestation research makes for a slightly faster ramp up at least and the Shadow cannon buff is a good thing, means Immortals can oneshot Broodlords and tempests, and twoshot BCs. I wonder why specifically 320 damage, is there some breakpoint right there I’m missing?

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I would have liked to see a tad more done with Kerrigan such as decreasing omega network cost a bit, and to make her mutas less fragile compared to the other commanders’, or to bring back some of their previous damage so they felt like real glasscannons. Their cannons are a bit limp. Considering how vulnerable they are to AOE, they don’t quite feel worth the risk currently.

Maybe have Abathur’s nydus worms be free like Kerrigan’s, I don’t think I’ve ever seen an Abathur player build them.

Zagara could also use some work, corrupters are kinda useless in a 100 supply commander, I would have liked seeing them buffed a tad and especially for Zagara to have a late-game Hive research that increased her supply to 125 or something, which would help a lot if you wanted to go for a more sustainable comp rather than ling-bane scourge which is the only good option currently.
Giving Bile Launchers deep tunnel on creep might be OP, but it would be a lot of fun, and could perhaps be balanced by it requiring a ressource cost.
Mostly, please give us that old bile launcher smartcast back, like mentioned before in numerous threads with a separate command for bombard ground.

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I guess it’s most likely to help you take down either hybrids or high-life objectives, like void slivers, or suppression towers. But same as you, I can’t figure why precisely 320 dmg, since a nicely-rounded 300 would’ve required pretty much the same amount of immos in order to take down a target.

I agree with nearly everything beside Mist Opportunities. It is nice to have together with Temple Defense to have two maps that are freed from Rush.
(okay two and a half because CoA is a big rush at the start but if you manage to get over first two hybrid waves there is nearly all the time in the world for getting army and everything done because when third and fourth waves hit long last, you need either mutations or getting carried while carrier is AFK to butcher it.

If a zerg enemy has 300 hp then 300 damage will not kill it, as it regenerates 1hp while the cannon barrage finishes.

And 320 is great as it can two shot battlecruisers and one shot a lot of pesky units.

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300 can also two-shot BCs, the only breakpoint at 300 I can think of is that a spinecrawler might not die then, but still no idea why 320.

That does work since Nemesis (900 total) and Destroyer (600 total) both regenerate like Zerg.

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The question is still why exactly 320, maybe they thought 305 or 310 looked off somehow. :slight_smile:
But then why not 325, would actually be more common, a lot of stuff, particularly costs are in steps of 25. You could of course then argue, why not 350, seems more even and tidier, though it might hit some extra breakpoints, but the only one I can think of is mothership that could then be twoshot And that’s not one that matters much in coop.

On another note, it wouldn’t be a bad idea to lower the robo bay cost to 150/150 for all the protoss commanders like on ladder, to make it a bit more accessible earlier on.

And this is why I say they should be instead given to Zagara and her endless swarm because she have with Corrupters already their prevolution

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