And the damage DOES greatly exceed healing. So yeah 9 dps is plenty.
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You make as if a teammate dependent ultimate is a bad thing. Nano boost and Amp Matrix is literally the same as Valkyrie where they are a teammate dependent ultimate.
I never said that or even implied it.
I was just debunking the argument that Mass Rez was as dependent.
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10 heals 9 damage. Pretty equal and he was down to 17 after his first nerf so they in fact buffed him back to his original allegedly op state that he clearly is not in
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The statement above fails to recognize that damage in a game like this necessarily must always greatly exceed healing.
10 points of healing that will always hit is not roughly equivalent to 9 points of damage that may not hit
Not remotely
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So for example a soldier 76 doing 95 damage to a single target with 50% accuracy and 0 crits and no cooldowns being 35 higher than 60 is not big enough? Boy must he hate moiras 85 hps then
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Do watch some videos of Animetic’s gameplay. She turns several fights around with the usage of Valkyrie. Or she doesn’t count since she is in GM?
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Even while it is bad thing to have your biggest moment rely on other people. Nanoboost’s most valuable parts are damage resistances and burst heal, that greatly enhance Ana’s ability to keep teammate going. Amp Matrix buffs healing for Baptiste’s healing grenades, so it’s not that team-reliant either - having your grenades heal 120 hp instead of 60 can be a big deal.
its almost like it is a team game where the entire team wins or the entire team loses
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This thread really doesn’t disappoint. It’s popping up like clockwork.
And being derailed by pointless non-sense questions by an android.
Never fails.
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…an android?
I know of only human participants
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Then I must be talking about nobody.
Anyway, this thread is good. Failure the greatest teacher is. Blizz can learn a lot from their own messes.
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{shrug}
just wondering who the android is
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Oh, it’s a bad thing? Then we should get rid of every defensive and enabling ultimate in the game right? After all they are a bad thing apparently.
Thank you for saying what you say. I just found out that EMP and Graviton Surge is bad since they rely on your team apparently. So does Trans, Sound Barrier, Earth Shatter, Photon Barrier, Supercharger and etc.
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Imagine being so disingenuous that you don’t consider that the extra 9 DPS was being added to a hero who already did 171 DPS and had numerous buffs to improve the consistency of said DPS, while the 10 HPS adds onto 50 HPS, resulting in a value that’s a third of the damage output.
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Because the ranks are different.
You have to design a hero to be useful at all levels of play but the maximum potential stat wise needs to reflect that of higher ranked players.
Mass Rez was extremely useful to worse players because you cannot rely on the quality of the players at lower levels to make E Rez and Valkyrie worth a damn.
At high ranks, Mass Rez often felt like not enough and yet E Rez makes a more significant impact there because they can actually expect their team mate to do something.
I cannot except some gold rank person I rez to get up and even get a kill. By the time they do, they could have already respawned and walked back.
Mass Rez didn’t work.
But neither does E Rez and Valk because it is not something that can be utilised by all players at all levels.
EG. Ana is very hard to play, but her sleep dart and grenade aren’t less valuable to lower ranked players and even the few major play they manage to hit is consistent to the kind of play environment they are a part of.
I play Ana and I am not perfect with her, in fact I am pretty bad with her. But I play her at a level enough to survive at my rank and still put in work and impact. I’d be better off if I could hit more sleep darts, but overall I can still expect to play that role at a suitable level for my team.
Mercy’s maximum potentials cap out very quickly and the rest of her skill cap comes down to game sense and how she works with a team. This is because so much player agency is taken away and at low ranks you cannot expect the best game sense nor can you expect your team to perform at a quality that can truly make mercy’s kit work.
I loved Mass Rez because I felt like I had a moment to actually keep control of a situation, I had a chance to say “wait, not this time”.
It’s what I love about saving someone with a nanoboost or nade or sleeping someone doing something big, or saving a few team mates with a Moira ult or even using the invincibility field from Baptiste. It’s my moment to say “not this time” and keep my team mate there and keeping them there actually keeps the flow of the fight going and perhaps is more likely to secure them a kill.
And sure, bringing a team mate back should be the same, but it really isn’t because that team already died because you couldn’t even save them enough time to get to cover or couldn’t keep them in a fight long enough to swing the outcome. If they died, they already lost momentum and their position is already potentially a failed one because the game state will have changed with their death.
Resurrect is problematic in all it’s forms at all ranks because it can’t be consistent in design for all ranks because of player variation.
Drop Rez for something else. Something she controls. Every player needs a moment they feel THEY controlled.
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Defensive ults rely solely on the player using them to SAVE PEOPLE.
It doesn’t require a team to use that ult and necessarily have it succeed, it was all of the player.
Set up ults can also set up a player for their own success at lower ranks, IE Earthshatter lets Rein absolutely swing and charge and make his own success at low ranks.
Usually Grav is used in a combo with another ult which makes it a very simple combination of power at low ranks.
And I say low ranks because they are more important in this regard because high ranks will always have the kind of communication and team work required to make a plan succeed and if not they switch up to their next plans. Low ranks do not have this kind of ease of switching, communication and team work.
All of these ults you mentioned, besides EMP stand a chance with small levels of team work and rely mostly on the player and generally force people to be in one place fairly still or require only the action of saving which is on a players reactions.
They don’t specifically rely on your team, the way using Valkyrie does.
Valkyrie’s greatest success comes from damage boost, right?
Your team needs to hit shots to make that work and you don’t damage boost yourself, unlike Orisa whose damage boost does boost herself which means she can still influence her own success.
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It’s almost as if we are a random bunch of people forced on to a team and unless you are in high ranks, experience with communication and team work differ and each person needs to have a character that has at least ONE ability where they can solo influence SOME aspect of a fight without having to beg their team to listen to them and watch as the team doesn’t. (whether that be the smaller brawls or a ult fight).
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Funny that. Back in either Megathread 8 or 9 one of the suggestions for Valkyrie was to combine beams, Damage Boost AND Healing.
A few months later Moria comes out, and what is her Ultimate? Combined Damaging (rather than Damage Boosting) AND Healing beam. I think it was one of Titanium’s ideas, but not positive since it has been a while. Not saying that ‘THEY’ decided to take an idea to help Mercy’s Ult and use it to create an Ult for a new Hero, but…
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It was easier to adjust, though. Resurrecting more players at once could compensate for overall lower quality of each player, and you had to do it yourself, depending on how powerful that specific team is, adding some mental puzzle for Mercy to solve. In worst case scenario you could abuse that invulnerability to make some kills yourself.
Single resurrect lacks that ability to gain power through other means.
Not everyone are speaking same language, speaks/uses mic with high quality, or can speak fast enough. Making whole “team game” argument very shaky in real world.
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