Supports should talk about impact instead of survivability

Again, this is not about reading mate, its about reality and stats vs “feelings”.
Its nota lot of feedback” you are just saying it for the sake of pushing a narrative that doesnt exist.

The answer is : Any company would verify said feedback is rooted on reality and then act on it. Otherwise, they will dismiss it.

You can say whatever you want but you are not giving anyone lessons here bud.

You clearly dont have a clue about this and throwing claims without evidence won’t change that fact :man_shrugging:

The problem is you are comparing different roles, who all take different risks. You aren’t comparing things that actually matter, such as Average deaths per 10 minutes between supports in Overwatch 1 and supports in Overwatch 2, or average time alive by supports between ow1 and 2.

It is clear that supports in this game feel more vulnerable (Aside from the obvious big 3 of Mercy, Moira and Kiriko, all of whom have burst survival tools) and less protected and valued by their teams since their teams no longer have the tools or motivation to peel. How they compare against the highezt risk heroes in the game is not really relevant.

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Basically what I’m seeing in this thread is supports don’t like having to run away when a dps is on them. Some would rather be able to stand their ground and go toe to toe with them. I’m all for this actually. But I think that would mean basically turning some supports into semi dps. I’m not sure how much supports would like that?

I’m actually open to the idea of a global out of combat regen passive. Then nerf some support healing and give them damage buffs. Basically support healing should be aimed at critical teammates in key spots otherwise they are also fighting/engaging the enemy. I think that could give supports the impact they feel they lack.

Here’s what I feel about support and it won’t show up in the data I think

It can feel that way, but even if you don’t get the kill, I think there’s value in forcing one support to spend resources on keeping the other one alive instead of on the Orisa or Hog.

I can’t say my kill counts as Bap against Mercys are going to impress anyone, but I do think I force them to play a bit more cautiously. Hopefully that’s not just wishful thinking on my part…

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You don’t understand that if your players are feeling like the game isn’t fun because of something. And you are like “well I can see this thing isn’t happening”

That doesn’t stop what they are feeling, OR that you have a problem on your hands.

I can’t teach someone who doesn’t want to learn or doesn’t have the capacity to do so.

No.
No one sacrifices the majority of players for the “feelings” of a minority. That just doesnt happen. Not in this universe. Sorry if that triggers you but reality is not changing :man_shrugging:

Im way above your level mate. You have no firm grasp of reality and base your claims on “feelings”. You can’t teach anything, denial is not a subject people should learn.

This ends here :wave:

I honestly think the problem is that the DPS get to the supports too easily. So it happens too often.

Not that it shouldn’t happen at all, but there is a balance where it feels good, and it isn’t at that point now.

You were not getting the same level of complaints, and it isn’t that supports are worse at fighting off DPS, they are better now.

The problem is that there isn’t enough time between fights with the DPS.

You do know that Overbuff numbers have been mostly useless since private profiles and completely useless since OW2 started?

Play the role, gives you a better idea.

That’s because supports have become adept at this over the years; it doesn’t really prove it doesn’t happen.

But it most certainly is about impact, I agree. One mistake as Kiriko and you can lose the entire game, for example, and it’s more or less the same with all other supports except for Ana, in my experience; she gets to constantly output so much pressure for free that mistakes feel almost forgiven the majority of the time, for me.

Also Overbuff numbers aren’t accurate atm; it’s struggling to update anything for the past couple of weeks.

I’m not talking about the average ranked DPS player. I was comparing the average death rate of all dps to the average death rate of Brig who dies more than any other support.

Oh, clearly you haven’t had a game yet where your tank has just logged in for the first time.

Last days of OW1

The tank problem is a lack of Popularity.

And pretty much anything that would make them more popular, be it better healthpool, regen/lifesteal, movement speed, movement, firepower, and damage abilities. Would make them survive more.

Anything that bottomlines to intentionally not making the tank Role more popular is basically telling Blizzard they should intentionally lose millions of players.

I don’t think the Finance Teams at ActivisionBlizzard Corporate would like that.

Conclusion

We need OW3 with 4v4

The DBD thing comes from the fact that supports are more often than not the first priority targets to die, since they make killing the other 3 enemies much harder. You pressure the Zen to ult before you engage with ur own teamwipe, you bait Beatdrop, you cancel Coalescence etc.

This means alot of DPS and Tanks prioritize the supports alot which can make you feel like ur constantly under fire.

The difference being that in 5v5, they can buff Tanks and Supports to their needed levels of popularity, without making compositions become too durable.

If I was taking about pickrate or win rate I agree. But I’m literally just talking about stats that shouldn’t be that affected by private profiles.

Pretty sure the whole supports are playing dead by daylight line was started by the people who don’t think supports have issues in OW2. They use it deride anyone bringing up issues with support play. Can we drop it, please?

As for the support survivability concerns, they were quite valid during beta and season 1. But here’s the crazy part, Blizzard recognized the issue and attacked it by removing the various dps speed boosts which were the root of the problem. Combine this with nerfs to key flanker characters, and suddenly the pressure on supports is noticeably less. Season 2 has been much better in that regard.

There are still issues, mind you. Some supports still need adjustments to work better in 5v5. Supports need some QoL and better in game feedback. Some dps and tanks need some adjustments, looking at you Sojourn and Orisa.

The situation for supports as a whole has improved since beta. But there’s still work to be done to bring people back to the role and attract new players.

I think it’s gotten far worse. I’m still shocked no one saw it coming that nerfing flankers and buffing widow/sojourn would make support feel even worse. Now not only do supports have to stare at walls all game or get headshot to spawn. But now you can’t even heal/support your team when they get instakilled.

Mercy is the most popular hero in the game support need more heros yes but guess what they are already fixxing that it just takes time

80% of the work should only take 20% of the effort.

They should start with big changes, you get Supports into the “right ballpark”, then fine tune from there.