Games Like Apex Shows Overwatch Is Too Team Dependent


#43

“theyre different games you cant compare them”
girl, theyre still games though. they are both team games, in the fps genre, with heroes, who have unique abilities.

i can compare apples and oranges if i want, i can talk about how sweet or sour they are, how round, about their color.
theyre different fruits but they have things in common that i can compare.

i think what OP means is that in AL it doesnt matter which hero you pick, you are a free agent in your team that has the same carry potential as anybody else.
you can pick tank, healer, assassin or scout, but you have the same carry potential. you have to play as a team, yes, but if a single teammate screws up, theres plenty of ways for a skilled player to recover from it.

in overwatch, it is very different and more frustrating in a lot of cases. you have bigger teams, but at the same time the errors of a single teammate have much bigger influence on the whole match. having a widow who has low accuracy or gets killed a lot? big disadvantage.
having a moira who cant handle her resource? a genji who gets no picks? a rein who is too aggressive?
its very hard for a single player to cover for their teammates errors. thats not a balance problem,
but it IS a game experience problem. people get bored or tilted by it, and will leave.


#45

But a br too. Ow is not br


#46

Why not? there is a huge crossover in the player base, and overwatch could learn a thing or two from Apex.

Apex will take players from Overwatch, that much is a given.


#47

We are comparing a TEAM based shooter to a battle royale about team dependance?


#48

I think a big part of the reason that we get so much complaining about this game (and yes I know there are plenty of other valid reasons to complain about it) is that a lot of players don’t really want to play a team game. They have this idea in their head that they will pick soldier and hard carry a team to victory by themselves. THAT ISNT HOW OVERWATCH WORKS! They don’t even realize that the game they’ve always wanted to play is call of duty or a game like Apex legends.


#49

it feels more like a shooter than a BR game and how they designed the map makes it play more like a bunch of smaller maps in one big map with choke points, etc.

They did a very good job with the map design and the feel of the game.


#50

Oh I’ve thought this many times…”so basically you want it to be like every other shooter you’ve ever played”…that’s not what the game is supposed to be…and the devs sure as heck don’t view it that way either


#51

I have faith that this is true as well. Surely the people who made the game understand the vision they have for it, and will stick to it. If this game became anything like those other games I’d quit.

I love this game for what it is; a class-based, objective team shooter. I love that teamwork triumphs over skill. I love that there are roles on a team other than “hey go kill the enemy”. I love that no matter your gaming background there is something for you to do.

THAT is the spirit of Overwatch, and ApEx: LeGeNdS will never take that away.


#52

Well you cant exactly go solo vs a 3 man team in Apex…


#53

Well, you shouldn’t… but on the Apex reddit, they have a ton of videos of people 1v5ing at the last stage, managing to outshoot/play others. Not the way I like to play but I mean, it happens.

My thoughts on Apex vs Overwatch:

  • I have the super human ability to enjoy them both.
  • Sometimes I bounce between Apex and Overwatch.
  • They are completely different games and I wouldn’t want either to change into the other.
  • There are things that they both can learn, however. The heroes in Apex need more soul because for now they seem a bit forgettable and Overwatch could use way more team systems like voiced pinging/possibly a map to mark routes we should take/Chevrons marking where the team leader says to go/more interact-able paths within the map/etc
  • Yes, people playing Apex = fewer people playing Overwatch. That’s okay, there will always be things taking the attention away from others. Gamers have a tendency to look at everything in a Min/Max way when in reality, people should be able to just enjoy other games at times without the toxicity (and enjoying other games shouldn’t mean this one is bad)
  • I still love Overwatch more. The gameplay in Apex feels more fluid and it certainly engages me but I bought into Overwatch for their world. I want to see Blizzard add more to its characters/lore/gameplay modes. This is pretty much the only game I’d consider buying merch for haha
  • These days, I still end up playing Apex more. It is difficult to find a team to work and laugh with in Overwatch so I end up just chilling in there but in Apex with the pinging system, I feel like there are a ton of “micro-love” you can give to your allies. As long as they don’t insta-drop you into merk-town where we die in minutes, I find that traveling the digital wilderness and looting stuff with two other people for an extended time kind of makes you feel like family.

With all politics, people tend to get caught up in “My side’s views vs Your side’s views” but I wanted to list out all of my thoughts to show that there are some less-toxic, gray opinions in this Apex vs Overwatch thing.


#54

Yea but one person can run in and kill 3 people in under 2 seconds. Just because you can olay as a team doesn’t mean its required. Its far more skill based than team based.


#55

I feel like Lifeline is too valuable to not have due to her air drops and heals. Everyone else are balanced and are pretty good vs different scenarios and situations. Gilbrator owns in open spaces, Caustic in doors, Chappie can get you to nice vantage points, Wraith can flank and help you travel far distances, Bloodhound can provide nice recon, etc.


#56

My thoughts exactly

They’ve dumbed the game down enough so that only certain heroes can perform individually

Rip old Roadhog


#57

You’re right it’s not.

But is does have unique hero’s, mobility hero’s, abilitys, ults, classes for different hero’s and is a team game.


#58

Also, with the way the maps designed and speed the circle closes + the increased mobility options (zip lines / air sky diving zipline thingy/ rifts/ etc) it feels less like a giant Team Deathmatch and more like the center of the map is the payload. The squads of 3 are nice and with classes you can run 1 tank/1dps/1support aka a typical overwatch comp cut in half, or just try to wing it and pick whatever. I usually don’t bother with BRs ( I have h1z1 / pubg / fortnite / and did play Black Ops when they did the free trial a few weeks back, but even with it being free I only played like 3 matches) however, this one is an absolute blast. The ammo and looting system are very well streamlined, you’re not sitting there swapping out attachments and digging through your inventory for meds, energy drinks, bandages, etc and theres only like 4 ammo types in total (Light / Heavy / Energy / Shotgun) so it’s not hard to figure out what you need to pick up. And if you’re low on ammo, you can ping it and itll let your teammates know you need that type of ammo. Or if you find cool gear that you don’t need you can set a ping that shows where the item is, what it is, the rarity, etc for a teammate to pick up


#59

I’m a bit confused why on earth this is remotely a bad thing? For one, BR games are an entirely different genre. And two? OW is literally designed as a TEAM BASED game. So yes, it should be heavily teamwork reliant. There are tons of games which aren’t team reliant and the individuals ‘shining’ is just a nice way of saying an individual can carry their team to victory without needing the team to begin with.


#60

Dev team in OW need stop sucking for once and get better balance heroes and faster content to keep us playing instead of making a dumb phone game. This layoff should be a wake up call for them. Peronally I am glad they are suffering with business.


#61

I think it’s wrong to compare the games like this.

While they are both competing each other, they are not comparable.

OW is has MOBA elements in it and the heroes themselves are the core of the game (which is why team comps matter so much) while Apex is a battle royale with heroes, every hero has great defining traits but they are not the core of the game, loot still decides fights (just not as much as it would do in PUBG) and it’s also the core part of the game while hero abilities are mostly supportive and due to the nature of the game you can’t play the same way every time because loot and ring placement change your strategy completely.


#62

So many people whinning about Overwatch’s team focused game play, Blizzard said this was a team based arena hero shooter, team based it is in the discription, if you dont like it then dont play but like others are saying stop trying to make OW into sonething it is not, OW team fights are way to fast paced for pings, they would be going off none stop as all 6 people try to pin enemies that it would end up as just noise


#63

No one is debating that OW is not a team based shooter. What is being proposed is that the team based part of it has been taken too far to the extreme. That is why I made the analogy to Heroes of the Storm. League of legends and DOTA2 also team based MOBAs but they don’t have the extreme team dependence to succeed that HOTS has and might have ultimately lead to HOTS failure. Anything taken to the extreme can be detrimental.