Thats fair, but realize that my experience is a testament to the way Mercy players are treated across the board. That is a serious problem and no one but Mercy players are talking about it, and no one, Blizzard included even really cares.
We’re approaching the ‘going in circles/agree to disagree time.’ As I previously stated:
I can only imagine it sucks to have your favorite hero (i.e. Mercy mains) in a place that is not enjoyable, I really do.
However, when I’m at a buffet with 26 food options (soon to be 27) I’ve got to expect my favorite dish to not always be perfect and that expanding my tastes is a strong way to avoid disappointment moving forward and increasing my chances of enjoying my time when I visit the buffet.
There Mercy players are asking for the hero to be fun, not to be treated like crap or disparaged simply for the hero they like playing, and to not be a sacrifice to satisfy a group of players who want nothing but that hero to suck.
There is no agree to disagree and there is no accepting what it is and moving on. Those desires are not unreasonable but appear to be too much to ask. While the outright malicious hatred has died down to roughly a daily slur and random prejudice against our existence, its still toxic to be a Mercy player. Other heros do need to be addressed but that does not excuse anything that happened and playing it down or just flatly accepting how it went down is not right. You should see the problem in that and the precident that this whole thing has set. If you don’t then I can only conclude you are here to troll and nothing else.
5 Likes
‘Fun’ and ‘balance’ do not always go hand-in-hand. The oft-quoted reply to this is that there exists more mechanically demanding supports if players find Mercy dull.
Yes there is. This discussion isn’t ‘agree with Reverendpaqo or Cookie = wrong.’ We’re respectfully discussing our opinions and not reaching an agreement is okay.
…not really the words of someone who:
Using ‘our’ suggests you identify as a Mercy player not someone who plays a large hero pool.
…and as I mentioned now for the third time:
I respect your opinions, but I disagree. This discussion has run its course, from me, it’s ‘agree to disagree’ time. I’m out, thanks for the chat. 
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The reason people get hate towards them is time played in their profile. In games I’m playing Rein, Zarya, Moira, Reaper, or 76, I still get hate for having high play time on Mercy.
Your conclusion that just because I play more than one hero that it must mean no one checks the players profiles for who they main and you assume that who you picks stops people who are prejudiced against what they see in a profile. You would be wrong, and it demonstrates you are disregarding the real issue and strawmanning anything you don’t want to admit is a problem.
The reason there is no agreeing is because I am saying the way this played out for Mercy players and the lack of Mercys issues being fully addressed and it being done in a way that hurt the people that play that hero the most is not ok to just let go and ignore.
You are effectively saying to learn to play someone else and to stop being selfish by wanting a fair and successful rework before calling it good enough and leaving it as it is on the mere hope that it will get addressed some day despite repeated events that instill a complete lack of confidence. Even if the devs openly stated they will revisit it, that would be enough to satiate a lot of the anger, but instead we effectively got “shes where we want her”. If it where another hero’s mains, those mains would equally side on my point that its not ok to just write it off and to gladly accept getting pissed on in the same fashion Mercy players have been.
8 Likes
Another option no one explores is the ability to stop Rez from completing once it starts. Aka, a rebuild time as it rebuilds the hero being revived and if they take enough damage or they are hacked, or what ever, it negates the Rez. Think of it like stopping a Protoss buildings from finishing building in Starcraft 2 by destroying it before it can finish and provide any benefits.
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I’ve only suggested it a couple dozen times already, but they could reduce the duration of Valkyrie to allow it to have more power in a smaller time frame. One of the biggest issues with the two instant rezzes during Valk was that Valk lasted way too long to be able to use both of the rezzes.
I think reducing the duration to like 8-10 seconds and removing the chain healing/boosting, and making the healing beam like 70-80 hps, it could work — adjust numbers where needed, of course.
People have suggested a cast time, which is virtually the same thing.
Wow. This is so accurate. Great analogy.
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Its really not though. A cast time lets you kill Mercy before she casts the Rez. A buildup time that you can stop lets you negate specific targets and also doesn’t make countering Rez purely about killing Mercy. They are 2 different solutions but have similar effect with different nuances to the options available.
If you make the counter to rez purely kill/interupt Mercy first, its like interupting/killing Hog while he’s loading scrap but once its loaded imagine you have no ability to stop or interrupt it. This is where interrupting the Rez from completing comes into play. Even if Rez was instant cast, if you could stop it from completing you can still negate the Rez without having to kill Mercy first. It gives you multiple chances and choices of how to negate the Rez. Kind of like a D.Va ult and blocking with a shield, absorbing with Lucio ult, hiding from, or mitigating it (hog+breather).
I also find it interesting that people were so bent out of shape over the lack of counterplay to Rez but not to EMP considering both are instant cast and both you have no way to outright counter the effects of.
If it’s anything like it is now on live, you can interrupt Mercy without killing her before the cast is complete. I’m honestly not seeing a difference at all.
For example, if she is hacked, flash banged, or hooked before the cast is complete, the rez fails. That could apply to her ult easily, although I would make the cast time much, much shorter.
I still think something like what I posted earlier in the thread could work. It give her a small cast time for the resurrect, but also has a buildup similar to what you mentioned except that they cannot negate the entire ultimate by killing her unless they do it during, or before, the cast time. But, they can still minimize its effects by denying specific heroes from reviving.
Mass Rez. Cast time of 1 second. No invincibility.
Mercy yells “Heroes Never Die!”. A visual indicator then appears to enemies and allies causing the radius of Mercy’s ultimate to radiate or glow. Any allied corpses within that radius will be revived, but not instantly. Over a 3-4 second period, their health begins to rapidly climb from 0 to their max. If they take a minimal threshold of damage during that time, they are resurrected with whatever their health was at when that damage threshold was met. Mercy may individually target an ally to increase the speed of their heath regeneration before their revive. She does not have chain beaming, only the single-target beam, allowing her to prioritize one person to survive the resurrection.
This keeps Mercy’s kit fluid and removes the detrimental slows and cast times that were put into place. It allows her to have a chance at a Mass Rez, but allows enemies to either reduce its impact, or totally negate it. If Mercy uses it poorly, she can stagger her team by a couple of seconds, depending on the enemys’ reactions, etc.
Well that’s weird, why was Mercy changed again?
Because she was so unfun to play against. Scatter is being changed because it’s so unfun to play against, not because it’s OP, but because it isn’t fun to get scattered in the shins. If it was truly OP Hanzo would have crazy pickrates.
Fun has plenty to do with balance in OW.
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Then they should remove sleep dart too. It isn’t fun to be hit by one during ultimate, just like it was not fun to be instantly killed as tank by Hanzo’s scatter.
Continue on, game has lots of unfun things, and shields is one of them.
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But these were blatantly unfun, and things people could complain about. Mercy’s rez was easy to pull of, and so is scatter, so they immediately have arguments for why they should be changed.
And I didn’t say that everything is changed because it is unfun, but to say that balance changes are always made without the fun of the enemy in mind is just wrong.
Furthermore, even OWL players want rez as a whole removed because it’s unfun for some super cool widow pick to be removed. And then the whole, “Rez has no place in a competitive FPS”. I could totally see rez as a whole being removed on those grounds, I wouldn’t be surprised a bit.
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They wanted mass rez removed too. Almost no one argues, however, that resurrect as ability can’t be balanced, being either too powerful or worthless.
Enemies aren’t supposed to be fun to play against, in fact, and especially their ultimates. What’s the point of ultimate? To make that specific hero
overpowered for a short time, to make impact on the way game goes.
Won’t be surprised, if Mei will be removed completely: she is walking definition of “unfun to fight against”.
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If there’s gonna be a cast time, don’t also slow her with the force of the event horizon of a black hole at the same time. Taking away my ability to move as a mobile hero is backwards AF and counter-intuitive.
Is this still an argument against my point? Because you partially proved it.
Either way, that’s why they are trying to be so careful with Mei, so she isn’t too “oppresive”, which is just another way of saying unfun to play against.
This. The fact that they used a brain-dead slowed cast time on Mercy has been a backwards decision from the start. She has 0 flow with it.
I wouldn’t add the slow. I never even mentioned a slow.