rein can just turtle really and make it challenging for pharah to bully him really, and rein’s value as a barrier tank outweighs how effectively pharah alone can counter rein, beyond that you go into the territory of team play
News flash. The game has always been about counters.
It is not like he is wrong but he is just 2 years late.
10 Likes
Designer here. Realistically you aren’t wrong. But if a developer really really knows what they’re doing, they don’t really need feedback. But if one is so incredibly inept that they can’t figure out why things like DF’s kit aren’t fun, they really need feedback.
4 Likes
He addressed this, mentioning that maybe the game has always been this way he’s just been hidden in a pro bubble or people evolved. It doesn’t change the fact that it’s something that’s wearing out the community.
2 Likes
Welp, i just ask because he was like “If it force you to swich or need help then its bad hard counter” So phara and reinhardt was first that come to my mind to be honest.
You can use teamplay agains most hereos that bother him, so… whats is wrong realy?
there is a difference between counter play and counter heroes, as he mentioned there was much more room for people to outplay one another before certain hero abilities were added, for example meteor strike which is a get-out-of-jail-free card and when you hit a target with it it yields shielding making it difficult to punish greedy ults
6 Likes
the problem is people do not want to switch to counter and adapt… this season i have so many people instalocking 5dps in ranked and dont bother about a healer or tank… it was never that bad for me. it just seems the community doesnt enjoy switching roles as much as the devs want them.
3 Likes
You are absolutely right, player perception of skill cannot be changed when there is a system in the game steering them in the wrong direction.
Been on a McCree binge recently and don’t always get gold medals, in fast its not very common at all. Why? because looking into his kit he’s supposed to be a reactionary type of hero that punishes preemptive attacks that aren’t properly thought out. I treat him more as a bouncer than a duelist. Granted the game itself doesn’t acknowledge that.
1 Like
Actually that’s not really true, as Brig’s skill ceiling is quite low. Making her so easy to play made her an effective hard counter pretty much across the board. This was one of Seagull’s main points… a hard counter like Brig is just too easy. He wants more skill based soft counters, not a right click I counter you types of ones.
He implied that at lower ranks people toss out their ultimates far too much rather than just use what needed, so the swing back and forth on Q’s alone is just far too great.
Especially at lower ranks, giving people more information on a scoreboard doesn’t mean they are going to draw any correct conclusions from it. Overwatch is a team, objective based game. Providing a scoreboard would probably just result in people scrutinizing kills/damage when the dude pushing the payload is all that matters.
3 Likes
jayne surefour and seagull are having an amazing discussion rn:
There’s not many tanks that fit my playstyle, I’ll happily stick to that but as it is, there really isn’t much tanks that I like so far.
I agree. This is why I even suggested that the game needs complete overhaul at few times. The whole hero swapping thing just to be efficient isn’t a good thing.
2 Likes
I would add more but you have stated all my gripes with game ever since competitive seasons were put into OW. And seagull covered the rest.
anyway, I’ve asked what I wanted to ask so I’ll let you guys run away with this now
I understand that Seagull was extremely outspoken about Mercy and I heavily disagreed with him at the time, but it’s not his fault that Blizzard’s rework was done so poorly. And the Mercy stuff is really irrelevant to his points now, he has good points about Brigitte/Doomfist and the game feeling frustrating.
3 Likes
they’re currently talking about possibly adding a startup animation to brig’s bash on jayne’s stream, seeing as both doom and rein have a start animation to their charges this seems like a good suggestion, especially seeing as they all interact together in the same way
1 Like
I actually found it interesting how Seagull was talking about how Offensive Ultimates are now too powerful across the board and how Support Ults need to be powerful just to keep up and “If one team have a lot of ults and the other doesn’t you’re screwed”.
– Looks at Mass Ressurect, which prevented this very thing from happening, and how Seagull was one of those vouching to have it removed –
Be careful what you wish for, seabird… 
~Sincerely Yours xoxo,
a Lover of True, Fair, and Fun Balance.
xavvypls 
15 Likes
This video basically encapsulates why I’m looking for another game to play right now. I will still play Overwatch, but not nearly as much.
3 Likes
Except it’s not every single person as you so hyperbolically stated, it is Seagull, the single most prevalent OW streamer, probably one of the most famous OW players in general, and widely considered the poster boy of this game. And for the people making the game to not take advice or not listen to criticism from the people that push the game to it’s limits (pros) is foolish and I hope you’re never a lead in game development so that you can stuff your fingers in your ears when valid complaints arise.
1 Like