〽 Sym 3.0: worse pickrate than 2.0, winrate DOWN 7%

General Discussion
669

Regardless of Blizzards odd lack of response to many things as of late, especially the current Zarya/Hanzo meta while everyone yells at Brigitte still, new Symmetra is definitely better than old Symmetra. Her LMB needs adjustments but the rest of her kit is down right better now. If you don’t like, well, get ready to feel how many Mercy mains felt after Valkyrie. They get told it’s better and soooo viable but they hate the new playstyle so it doesn’t matter in the grand scheme of things.

Not much else to say but stay tuned for hopefully good news from blizzcon this year.

670

But unlike Mercy,Sym isnt more viable. Shes LESS viable, and i didnt even think that was possible

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671

I said with widows though sometimes you can catch an unsespecting soldier or mecree with it. Charging alt fire then taking tele is key. I usually get about half charge then take tele, line up, blast and instantly go to primary.

672

In my experience there aren’t enough places to adequately sightline place a tele where people would be caught unawares by you; and there are fewer and fewer as people learn where she can and can’t place her TP. It’s honestly quite limited because you need to be able to reliably pop out of it without getting insta-kill shot in the head. Just the other day a pro Sym streamer uploaded a video of him playing new Sym and it was just a deathtrap anytime he used his TP.

673

Yeah its all well and good saying how u can flank w it, but if u get headshot the moment u step thru, not great is it?

674

Exactly! Like - Sure, great, you can teleport to a giant glowing oval and get… Instantly killed… Whee? Fun?

675

Then don’t step through it, and you’ve got yourself a distraction :smiley:

676

So basically - she has an ability that you can’t use because it invites death, and so you should use it purely as a distraction rather than… Wanting an … ability… for the… hero…

Balance? ?/

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677

at least shes better than reaper

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678

I gotta give you that, because he sucks.

679

It’s like crying wolf. You bait them enough with it, they’ll start to ignore it, then you can utilize it. /shrug

Honestly, it all depends on the team you’re playing against. You might get a potato team, you might not. Potato team isn’t going to pay attention to the TP, and pay for it. The team that does pay attention to the TP might get lucky a couple of times, but once you’ve set the hook with your previous two deaths bait, they’ll be baited again when you throw one down.

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680

That’s not a good enough reason to say that her current rework is better than her old kit, though - just because you can use some parts of her kit to bait things out or even do some cool plays, that doesn’t mean she’s ‘fixed’.

  • Is she able to reliably win duels? No
  • Is she able to survive on her own? No
  • Is she able to reliably output damage like a DPS character is expected to? No
  • Can she be used in some way that makes an extreme advantage for her team, similar to Mercy? No
  • Can her ultimate be used to wipe the enemy team in a way that negates her lack of kills otherwise similar to Sombra or other weak DPS characters? No
  • Does she fit in with characters to create a style of play like Dive or Pirate ship? No

These are all reasons why she’s not a strong character, beyond the basics of how much I dislike her new kit vs. her old. She doesn’t fit in well, she creates little additional strategy situations and they will be quickly discovered and countered almost purely due to her line of sight teleporter gimmick, which will only be a surprise for so long, and her lack of survivability means she’s a backline character with not much to do.

4 Likes
681

Look, I’m not arguing with you. I’d love to see some QoL changes to bring her up to where she needs to be. You act like she’s a dumpster fire the way she is currently, which isn’t the case.

She needs some tweaks on her abilities. She needs some timers adjusted. She needs her primary weapon buffed in such a way that it doesn’t feel like you’re slapping things with a wet noodle.

As she stands in her current state, I can reliably pull down gold medals for damage. That to me says that she’s not completely broken. The key word here is “completely” because there are parts of her kit that need some love.

We all know what they are, so I’ll refrain from posting it for the umpteenth time in this thread. If you want to know what I’m talking about, feel free to search out my name in the thread and see my previous responses.

2 Likes
682

Do you have the link to that stream?

683

I’d give her favored odds if she gets the jump on people or has turrets. And if she doesn’t, then it depends on the character. However, no character should just always win duels. There’s supposed to be a skill back and forth, and Symmetra definitely can do will in most duels, and the PTR changes help in several of her worse matchups now.

Not in melee range, but her survivability is fine for orbs. This is the one area where I really do think she needs help.

In my experience, yes, she totally can.

Once again, yes, she totally can do this. The teleporter can be insanely powerful when used well.

Actually, I’d put its power level at the exactly same level as EMP. It’s incredibly easy to waste and get essentially zero value out of it, but when it’s used well, it can be amazing.

Bouncing immobile characters around with teleporter is totally a unique style of play that cannot be done without Symmetra. Plus, I’ve found teleporter can work well in many types of comps, from keeping up with divey comps to allowing immobile comps mobility they’ve never had before.

All in all, I think she can do all these things, but doing them is way harder than doing what Symmetra used to do. Everything in her kit is incredibly easy to flub with, but is also incredibly powerful when she goes off. I do think she needs some help around her close range survivability and/or primary damage so that her primary weapon is in a better place (the increase in range is really only important in specific duels against range-limited characters like Reinhardt).

I don’t think she’s a horrible character or that she needs massive buffs. Especially because she still has a very high winrate overall and there’s no “she’s situational, which skews the data” excuse to point to anymore.

684
685

I guess the main problem is that the character she is now isn’t entirely unviable, but I find it difficult to see it as an improvement when she simply felt so much more self sufficient before. Frankly, when I play against a Symmetra and she ‘goes off’, it feels like an unfairly sharp win that hits you out of nowhere, and that’s not fun to play against. I literally just got done demolishing on Hanamura with her on attack, but it felt so fast and easy that frankly the win didn’t feel very deserved. There wasn’t much that the enemy team could do once I was able to establish a foothold, and it’s kind of one of those things that’s both too weak and too strong all at once - I feel the same with Doomfist.

To me, this game should have an exchange. Person A does X, person B counters with Y. Person A manages to win the ultimate FIGHT because they were more skilled, or got the drop on the other person, totally fine. But if person A can simply delete person B without person B able to do anything about it, or is able to sort of unfairly bumrush them with some ability, it just feels cheesy.

And to that end, to me, she is weaker - she’s weaker because she’s not as strong on her own as she once was, and while when she does ‘pop off’ it IS very strong, it’s frankly too strong and too unreliable to make her viable? Like, I would NEVER play her in comp unless I’d had a well rehearsed team strategy, which is kinda… Eh? Not great, to me. Before, I felt confident that I could win with most teams even if they didn’t want me playing Sym, now it’s difficult to not rely on your team to prop you up and if they don’t want to, they’re not going to.

EDIT: I also just wanted to add that I don’t think Symmetra winning a duel as a DPS character should be reliant on her having her turrets up. For instance, when I was playing hanamura against a Sym she flanked and managed to cast all three of her turrets in the main doorframe. This made it incredibly easy for them to capture the point because she had an almost instant and extreme advantage over us, and we lost the point almost immediately simply because the turrets caught a lot of people in the battle and when you’re in a team fight no one is prioritizing the turrets. Contrarily, if you’re playing Symmetra and you get caught out without having your turrets down where they will get someone already, you’re likely going to lose that fight. It takes out the back and forth of the characters having an actual fight, whereas Sym 2.0 had a lockon beam but a COUNTDOWN of killing you. It wasn’t instant- hitting all three of her new turrets along with her spamming orbs is an instakill, and it feels not great. Additionally, you are both weak and overpowered because it’s all so conditional - and I find that difficult to applaud because it means that a large part of her being able to actually do damage is entirely reliant on those turrets which it didn’t feel like it was before. Turrets should always be an addition to damage, never half the bag IMO.

686

people loved playing her when all they had to do to kill someone was hold down the fire button now they actually have to put their back into it so they lay off her.

1 Like
687

Is this some sort of joke? Reaper has triple the pickrate of Sym. He is BALANCED. Sym is trash.

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688

Not against you or anything but should it be the opposite?
I mean in the past skilled player dont want play her because she is autoaim, there is even a meme that symm mains are only 12 people,but now they should be able to play her specially dps mains becasue she requires aim and all. But why does her pickrate plummeth from her previous iteration? Is it because symm mains cant aim and abandoned her?

the real catch is that players who have “skill” good at aiming and tracking felt that her weapon feels lacklustre so why chose her over everyother dps. The rework should have drawn in more players if they are saying that she takes skill now and aim. But where are those players who can aim? Is it because its still stigmatize symm as a troll pick?
You need to consider allot of things about symm before coming to a conclusion that symm main left her becasue we need to aim.

Try playing her in comp and let see if you dont get reported for sabotage or trolling.

2 Likes