Twin blades varian needs a rework


—> Point being.

----> You’re wrong and people prove that your wrong.

--------> Your inability to learn and grow as a hots player.


Nobody proved i’m wrong. I’m an above average HOTS player. I improve every day. You are speculating based on nothing but your view on me from the forums.


No. I’m judging you by the things you post and the things you say. Everyone here can see that you’re lacking in basic fundamentals.

You can tell who doesn’t understand the game and who does very easily. It’s the substance of their post.

And I given you multiple chances to come and face me in the game and prove it. You denied.


not everyone has a bachelors in game design, for example i think butcher needs to be reworked, but i haven’t the slightest clue how. i’ve had that solid opinion going on 4 years, butcher is literally a stupidly designed hero.

i disagree, i think hes almost always right. seems legit

apples and oranges, typical red herring that doesn’t work with us anymore

yea, yea… if you want a proper game, don’t play the game. as usual, i must argue that this statement proves the matchmaker is not functioning satisfactorily. the only ‘matchmaker’ there is in league games is based off mmr, and you are not always guaranteed that people will ban or draft properly. invalid argument as always.

lies and misinformation? who are the real trolls here?

his information reflects reality. his logic is sound. what lies do you speak of? show me.

L2P issue, varian can easily solo multiple heroes.

varian is broken but the enemy team is bad? fail. you just justified his entire post. entire team chasing varian unable to kill him for half the map is definitely broken as he has nothing that is supposed to function as escapes and this proves beyond any shadow of doubt that hailfall is correct. if you find it hard to believe the scenario, you have clearly not played against a decent varian.

another person openly admitting false reporting, i won’t even bother because blizzard actually condones this bull$#!%

it turns out you CAN just report someone when they say something you don’t like or don’t agree with.

i have facerolled entire teams with varian at 20 and single-handedly won boss fights with him with little to no support whatsoever.

this ‘report because can’t downvote’ is nothing short of 4 year old behavior.

you are clearly being hateful and if i said varian sucked you’d say that you 1v3’d repeatedly, i know your kind


Using the Q energy talent, you save 15 energy per Q. After using Q just three times in quick succession, you’ll have already saved 45 energy. Subtly only generates 40 energy total. Vigor takes a whopping 18s to generate an equivalent amount of energy. It also requires 2.4s to generate enough energy to use Q, whereas it only takes 1.5s to generate enough energy to use Q with the mana cost reduction (and without vigor).

Like I said, the hero does not even function properly without an energy cost reduction on Q. This is because her Q is such an important ability. It’s both a large part of her damage (including enabling her to stick to a target to continue applying damage) and her primary form of disengage and mobility. She needs to be able to use the ability as consistently as possible. Neither of her level 1 energy talents allow her to do this.

So you are free to consider yourself as knowledgeable as you like. I’ve played the hero enough to realize that she plays one way with relentless strikes, and a different way without it. Without the talent, she is simply much less effective.


Yet heroes like Butcher exist in every MOBA :thinking:

No. The game is about destroying the core. You can honestly win a game without getting a single kill on the enemy team. The fact you think a basic concept of a MOBA is a red herring… just proves you don’t understand anymore than Haifail.

Actually no. Blizzard sent out make a MOBA and screwed everyone over by including a mode that goes strictly against core foundations of building a MOBA. drafting

IF you think this is some how a r ed herring, you’re no better than hailfail. A MOBA is a DRAFTING genre. Quickmatch throws everything a moba is out the window and completely destroys any type of concept of balance.

Hailfail threads are spam and trolling.

You know why they are consider spam and trolling? Because he simply just argues with everyone constantly.


If you’re dying to a TW Varian, you’re doing it wrong.


Honestly, when you look at the threads created, the truth is that we have an incredible lack of flexibility.

The part that isn’t said is the fact that the changes are being taken from the standpoint of a player that doesn’t admit their own shortcomings. As a result, we aren’t getting a full picture, and the person involved is not growing or expanding as a player… as is evidenced by the fact that changes have to be made to ‘OP’ or ‘unfair’ things that they cannot deal with given their chosen preference for play.

Any player worth their salt is going to know what their main is, learn them backwards and forwards, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY OF ALL, know what that character CAN NOT DO. They can sit there and actively say that something on the other side of the battlefield is going to pose a problem, that they can do certain things to mitigate the problem, but the team is going to have to help out to compensate.

Being OP means that there is little to no counters to that OP item in the entire existing roster… A character that can mitigate or hard counter another specific handful of characters is NOT overpowered by any stretch of design principles, especially not when the character has their OWN hard counters.

Oh, but the infamous 1v5 scenario… Honestly, I’d have to see it, and I’m surprised I haven’t seen it on any of the replay videos on YouTube already, but I can honestly say that the chasing team did NOT know when to quit. The truth of that situation is that the players should have long ago cut their losses and moved onto something else. Simply put, it was a bad decision to keep throwing good effort after bad, and the entire time the team was out of lane was a chance that the enemy team was closing or expanding the gap by having ANY characters in lane.

A good player accepts that they made a bad call, and that there are situations a given character isn’t meant to overcome. A bad player blames the character they were fighting, the mechanics of the game, the bad teammates they were paired with, because the bad player knows it’s a universal law that ‘it’s not my fault.’

The thread’s getting heated. Everyone just jump ship, let HailFail get his last words, and walk away from the thread. You can lead a horse to water…



I mean, you’re both kinda right-ish.

I’m an incredibly average player, but Varian does come with some BS advantages the vast vast majority of the roster can’t deal with 1v1 at all. I mean, a charge, a slow + ranged attack, the parry garbage, strong AA, those buffing flags he can throw down (psure he has the potential to charge to them as well), auto attacks heal him etc etc. Dont get me started on the half baked-never-finished-or-revisited “multiclass” idiocy. Saying a 300 meat butcher could kill him isn’t exactly proof of anything either lol… And really, a TB Varian has a chance at actually surviving a Butcher attack like that FAR better than almost any non-tank hero.

On the other hand, Hail… When you cry wolf about heroes that DO have many hard counters (like Hammer, she’s so easy to counter), when you try to bring up something that may (in other player’s eyes) have merit… You’re generally gonna get a hard time because of your post history.

I made a similar post about Varian in the past, admitted I needed some tips and players on these forums weren’t toxic or anything at all. They actually helped me quite a bit (rule of thumb is to either blind/stun/cc + focus, use Arthas or run the F away lol… Which imo is not good enough and Varian needs a HP nerf or something but that’s another conversation) and I still appreciate all the tips players better than I am shared with me ^.^

I do think maybe you should try to turn over a new leaf, Hail, of asking for other player’s strats against certain heroes instead of definitively stating what you think is truth and I’m sure the forums would start cutting you more and more slack, and engage in a civil discourse with you about stuff you think that actually has merit to a lot of players?


n :o:


Mate… no.

Good try. It’s a fact

All I literally have to do is just quote every thread you start and every response to prove that.


Honestly, that can boomerang right back on ya…


See hailfail? Why do I even need an alt account?

I don’t even need one. You’re trying to get your buddy to gang up on me. xD But majority of this forum doesn’t even like your posts.



I honestly think Varian is one of the most balanced heroes in terms of design alone - not so much when you compare him to other heroes but it times of design he’s pretty spot on. So is Muradin and other heroes.

The problem with MOBAs is there will always be weaker designed heroes and stronger designs heroes. It’s just the nature of the best. It’s why Diablo and other heroes have CONSTANTLY been through reworks and balance changes but still remain at the top.

It’s time to move on to other heroes.

Varian just falls in the being designed well but it terms when it comes to other heroes.

I totally see your point where you feel like he just has too much going on - but from my point of view. Every newly designed heroes/reworks should be this good. (As well as being as good as Muradin and other heroes I could name)


Yea ill calling BS on the 1v5 forcewall story too.

If a varian is running he isnt attacking. If he isnt attacking he has LITERALLY 0 regen.


Is it safe to come out and say I also disagree with Hailfail without being called Striker’s alt if everyone is kinda doing it?




s :a: fe


Thank you. <3

I needed the comfort. I don’t want to be in Striker’s shadow. ;-;


Totally not true.
Or at best only for you and your troll kind.
There are a ton of funny threads and useful guides. Intellectual ppl doesn’t get bored just because there is no “drama”.