Stop making Mirror ARAM Posts you concerns are likely heard

General Discussion
1

First of all this is a Forum it exists to discuss things if you only want X removed and are not willing to take other views/opinions into account than there can be no meaningful discussion as you will just divide the users into those you agree with and those who you don’t agree with. Secondly if a Dev reads this Forum semi reguarly he will have noticed the complaints by now. Thank you for your Understanding

Here are few suggestions to solve the Issue that I think are worth discussing (note some of these are from Mirror Aram Threads I will not do the work to Cite you as the first to suggest sorry)

  1. Add some sort of Voting system to the Mirrors the Hero is shown where if 6 or more Players Click “NO” the game will change to a Normal ARAM
  2. Add a Tick Box to the ARAM similiar to the Looking for Players Tickbox that need to be clicked to not be Put into Mirros
  3. All players Pick out of 3 Heroes that are the same for everyone
  4. A Player who just played an Mirror without leaving will not be Put into a Mirror lobby the next Game
  5. Leaver Que will from now on be only Mirror ARAM teach em respect (this is a Joke obviously)

1 Not sure how hard this is to implement
2 seems to me to be the simplest solution but again 1
3 Kinda defeats the purpose as Mirror Aram so maybe have this type have another 2 % or so chance or put it in if Complaints get so strong that mirror gets removed
4 most Humans are bad at gauging randomness this fix could make it feel more Random while actualy being less random

Regarding non Mirror ARAMs a Suggestion

  1. Group Heroes by their ARAM quality (by Winrate and other Stats) each team will get Heroes offered based on their “Tier” so If team A has Azmo on Offer Team B will get a Hero that is in the Same Tier as Azmo (note that it doens’t have to be a DD for DD)

TLDR: Read the first paragraph on the Top you can skip the rest

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2

Finally someone who want a mature discussion. Pretty good ideas.

People that only comes here to call everyone for ‘‘Knights’’ provide nothing to the forum other than meaningless back and forth off-topic posts that solve nothing.

If the complainers really wanted a discussion then they would bring up ideas. Not call everyone who challange his self believed stories for Knights.

Properly also a reason why most people have left this forum. Trolls have been good at making most of them leave cause they cant have fun on this forum without getting his topics removed or have to waste time argue with someone who only believe what he do is the only solution or his arguments is the only truth.

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At least the person who demanded Blackheart’s Bay be removed from the game for about 7 years straight 1-2 times weekly finally gave up this year. That’s a start :sweat_smile:

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if it was done on any other forum he would have been suspended long time ago for spam so just that he lived this long just proves he was given a very long line to hold on.

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If anything having multiple posts featuring the same topic (in this case mirror mode for ARAM) can be a better indicator of how liked or disliked a particular feature is.
Of course that is assuming the posts are made by unique individuals.

While game forums are a place to discuss games, they are also a place for players to voice their grievances with the game.

The best thing you as a forum goer can do when these topics pop up, is to try and see if the person making the post is just voicing a complaint or if they are here to acutally discuss ways in which to fix their perceived slight with the game.

If it is simply a complaining thread, just step away and leave it be.
Only engage if they are interested in sharing ideas and potential solutions.

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I agree with this 100%.

I think the problem is a lot of these just tend to be very throw away threads, they do not contribute for what is being discussed and it tends with the OP being dense or venting.

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Three things here:

  1. Many of the MM complaint posts are from people who don’t visit the forums or post regularly and we can’t expect them to scroll back and read through hundreds of post on the topic. These are passion players who just have a breaking point and finally come here to post about it. It is really a telltale sign of how significant the issue is.
  2. You offer suggestions on how to fix this. If you read through a vast majority of the posts, many offer constructive feedback on how to fix the issue. In short, it would be very easy to fix the issue and there are many solutions. It’s not a hard problem to fix.
  3. It is hard to believe that there is anyone left at Blizz who even cares about the game, let alone anyone who would come here to browse the forums for any reason at all. The problem is the game was already on mothball status and the recent layoffs only pour salt in the wound of having any glimmer of hope that anyone would take 20 minutes of coding to enact a change that could fix the issue.

Sadly, these MM games have contributed greatly to the decline of the player base. Speaking for myself, my dedicated 5 stack who has been playing since Beta has finally disbanded our nightly hots group and moved on. A couple of us have done some pick-up games here and there, but when a MM pops, it just cements the reason why we left.

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Care to link a few? I read these forums quite regularly, and this is the first Aram topic that talks about solutions in the ops that are not “removal” or “just make separate queues”. Those are not real options, thus useless suggestions. Since removing something that has supporting evidance only for its widely likedness would be weird. And sadly the community is too small to divide further. Despite it being a good solution in a vacuum.

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I know I have mentioned this in another thread, but an easy fix that would be relatively simple for the non-existent development team to implement would be to simply limit the pool of heroes who could potentially show up in a full mirror to those that people actually enjoy playing in that mode. I assume Blizzard has the stats on which mirrors get played (Thrall tends to always have everyone participate, in my experience) and which are most often left (Genji, ew). They could also do polls in Reddit to see what people tend to have fun with. I know I would vote Thrall, Kerrigan (waaaaaay too much fun!), Nazeebo, and Ming (aka, Dodgeball on steroids).

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From my view I dont think any of the complainers want it to stay no matter if the hero pool was limited. They all want it removed again.

But that wont stop them from leaving normal ARAMS aswell if anything is not going to be like he want.

So far they can either accept it as it is or keep leaving or dont que up. Making 10+ threads about it wont change how it is and calling people with different opions for Knights wont do anything either.

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The problem is that I dont think kids can tell the difference between a forum and a complaint booth.

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Iirc, the only two that fit your critera (not removing it, no opt option) is changing the same-hero to just one of the three choices so that it’s still a “choice”

A variation on that could be 3 options of similar mirrored heroes so the “choice” is still there.

There’s also purists that think “aram” should be “truely” random and all choices are removed so it’s whatever hero (potentially all the same) and talents are also randomized — though this version wouldn’t agree with many wanting aram mirrors removed or made into “choices”

As Hoku mentioned, and other forumers, have suggested limiting the pool to select heroes.

However, only 1-2 topics I recall are actually about change/compromise the with ‘majority’ of topics made to remove it by several posters that also want to remove other aspects of aram.

Removing mirrors is an option as other moderls prevent it and aram went years without it. The gimmick remains that more repetative posters leave games as is anyway, but they have been a few select players that made a forum debut to ask changes to mirror.

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Does not really matter if mirrors was gone tomorrow. They will be back leaving normal ARAM again just like they have always done even when I was playing or go back to good old remove X hero cause broken.

Problem is some people always need something to complain about in thier life instead of just accepting it or move on.

If they really value thier time then they would just move on and play QM or ranked instead of making 20 copy paste topics about much they hate mirrors when there are other game modes they can play. Its not like ARAM is the only mode they can play.

But to the complainers it properly is. And trolls can call people nicknames all they want. Wont change anything btw.

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It’s an option in a literal sense, but removing features and options (like maps, Heroes etc) shouldn’t be a [considered] option, because how onesided that is, while leaving many players sad.
(Obviously there are exaptions, like HM is too buggy, unique Brawls were too hard to maintain. HL and TL couldn’t be maintained at the same time wuth our low playerbase.
But HM is still in Custom, Brawls should be added to Custom, HL till exists within TL in a way, but should be readded the moment we have enough players).

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At this point, I would just be happy to be judged on what I have written in my post, rather than people assuming my position based on my post count.

On topic, I thought 5% was far too frequent for mirror games.

2% seems fine, but I only play ARAM a few times a week, for other players ARAM is the only mode they play, so it might “feel” like mirror games occur too frequently.

Some heroes are more fun to play in mirrors than others. This is putting aside personal tastes. My observation is it’s rare for players to go AFK with heroes that are easy to play like Nazeebo or Thrall, or heroes which have good siege potential and self sustain. Players seem to dislike heroes such as Maiev or Genji (almost any melee) as they usually have a higher skill floor and skill ceiling, and have limited siege capabilities compared to, say, an Azmodan.

Probius is a good example of a hero that can cause issues in ARAM, due to the ability of Null Gate to stall and extend the duration of a match to an unreasonable degree. Perhaps adjusting which heroes can be in the mirror pool might help ease some complaints.

I think this is the most pertinent point, many of those who complain about the frequency of mirror games (exaggerating aside), don’t understand basic probability. So your suggestions, while making it actually less random, might help those with perception issues.

A checkbox would be ideal, but I’m not sure if that would create two separate queues and if there are enough players to support this.

At this point, I’d rather mirror games be removed, so I no longer have to read the constant complaints. Personally, I don’t really like mirrors all that much, some heroes work well in MM, some don’t and then there is personal preference which is impossible to cater to.

That’s the rub, often it’s the same people making duplicate threads. I’m not talking potential alt accounts, there are multiple duplicate ARAM threads made by the same users.

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It is an issue which creates more problems than needed for everyone involved whether you like playing it or not. The quickest and simplest solution is turning it off entirely until you can figure out how to keep players in the game. Obviously the reporting system doesn’t work and if players on your team leave, you yourself are just as likely to catch a suspension because the opposing players will report all five on your team regardless of who is the most obvious absentee.

The most common thing everyone in aram agrees over is that matches without healers end up being very unenjoyable for both sides. Guess what, full mirrors very often or probably never feature a healer.

We can’t expect the players to police themselves and there’s no restrictions of any kind to this game mode for new accounts. Just last night I was playing wow and I have reported at least 15 different characters for things like zone disruption, inappropriate names, botting or spam. Can I tell you who fell on the sword? It was random guy during the world event whos addon had misfired in chat over missing group buffs. I reported him myself only to clear my chatbox and momentarily he went offline. Less than a minute later half of the group started laughing how they had received Blizzard mail thanking them for keeping the game safe.

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No healer games happens in QM too. Yet they still play them.

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QM doesn’t feature 10 heroes crammed within a single narrow tunnel so stop acting dumb. The game mode dynamic is entirely different and you can’t compare the two.

Minky says 5% is too high which I agree but it doesn’t make mirror games any more enjoyable at 2%. All this does is allow you to abandon the match each time without the system noticing a pattern in your behavior.

As I said in the previous thread, remove it entirely or explore the possibility of significantly increasing the reward for finishing the match - a modifier to base earned XP which would encourage and help maintain individual participation and bonus full hero level + loot chest for everyone. This is something which would prevent me from leaving and possibly even from throwing if the reward would outweigh anything I could earn in another 2-3 hours.

Rather than feeling like you’ve been picked to participate in the hunger games, players would start to interpret this rare event as a paid dinner with Jennifer (or that other guy if you happen to be gay). You will all agree that the threat of a stick never worked. If they are unwilling to try the carrot, better stop wasting everyone’s time.

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Any % would be too high at this point if you follow what the complainers says. You could lower it to 0,1% and you would still have people leave when it does pop up.

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So how are you not seeing this problem for what it truly is? You have a comment for everything but you still can’t accept that the current situation isn’t beneficial to anyone.

You have a very unique name so I looked you up quickly, not to judge what kind of a player you are but to see what your gaming habit looks like. I don’t expect every single match to be recorded but 21 TOTAL in aram category indicates you never played it passionately to begin with, let alone had the opportunity to end up in a mirror match first hand.

Other than that your last recorded match was in October of '22. When someone called you out in another thread saying you don’t even play the game I thought they were only joking and taking a cheap jab at you. Meanwhile, you could experience the joy in seeing at least 30 screenshots in the Salt thread from me alone on how terrible these games really are.
:roll_eyes:

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