PTR Chen Lvl 1 Talents & AA-build

General Discussion
1

TL;DR: Eye of the Tiger and AA-build are mathematically superior to all other options. Draft blinds against PTR-Chen.

Conclusion

  1. Eye of the Tiger provides the highest and most consistent healing and has the best synergy with Chen’s other talents.
  2. Fresh Ingredients could potentially be good if you have access to a bunch of globes, but it doesn’t do burst healing. EoT is still overall better.
  3. Stormstout Secret Recipe still sucks and is worse than before. Statistically it is better, but Chen no longer benefits from Keg Toss or Another Round to increase Keg Smash range/radius. Furthermore, BoF can no longer be cast independently nor in rapid succession, effectively neutering this talent completely.

Acrynoyms:
BAS - Chen’s Basic Attacks per second (Basic Attack Speed) = 1.11
BAD - Chen’s Basic Attack Damage = 93.6 @ Lvl 1
Apparently, I can’t include links in my post, so please refer to BTrain’s Solo lane/Bruiser build (PTR/link on reddit) and Veria’s Donky Kong build (Live) on Psionic Storm if you need a reference to the builds mentioned below.

Here’s some maths (numbers not rounded):

Level 1

Eye of the Tiger [EoT] - (93.6 [BAD] x 1.5 [EoT Dmg boost]) x 0.5 [EoT Healing] = 70.2 heals/attack x 3 [BAS x Brew Soak duration (3 sec) rounded down] = 210.6 heals over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [fastest castings possible]

Fresh Ingredients [FI]

  • 1 Regen Globe: (231.57 [9% Chen’s Health] x 2 [FI]) = 463.14 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 46.314 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes: 463.14 x 2 = 926.28 [Heals over 20 seconds] = 46.314 heals/sec.

Stormstout Secret Recipe [SSR]

  • Flying Kick [Q] - 51.46 [SSR] every 5 seconds.
  • Keg Smash [W1/KS] - 51.46 [SSR] every 6.5 seconds [BoF cast ASAP]
  • Breath of Fire [W2/BoF] - 51.46 [SSR] every 6.5 seconds [BoF cast ASAP]

Totals:

  1. Formula: (#Heroes Hit by Q + #Heroes Hit by W1 + $Heroes hit by W2) x SSR healing = Health healed over 6.5 seconds (fastest possible casting speeds)
  • (1 [Q] + 1 [W1] + 1 [W2]) x 51.46 [SSR] = 154.38 heals within 6.5 seconds [3 Heroes hit]
  • (1 [Q] + 2 [W1] + 2 [W2]) x 51.46 [SSR] = 257.3 heals within 6.5 seconds [5 Heroes hit]
  • (1 [Q] + 3 [W1] + 3 [W2]) x 51.46 [SSR] = 360.22 heals within 6.5 seconds [7 Heroes hit]

Comments

  1. EoT beats SSR against a single target.
  2. FI can be good if you control globes.
  3. SSR hitting 4 Heroes is comparable to EoT’s hitting 3 Brew-soaked AAs (no other talents).

Level 4

Eye of the Tiger [EoT] - (105.3 [BAD] x 1.5 [EoT Dmg boost]) x 0.5 [EoT Healing] = 78.975 heals/attack x 3 [BAS x Brew Soak duration (3 sec) rounded down] = 236.925 hp over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [fastest castings possible]

Fresh Ingredients [FI]

  • 1 Regen Globe: (260.46 [9% Chen’s Health] x 2 [FI]) = 520.92 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 52.092 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes: 520.92 x 2 = 1041.84 [Heals over 20 seconds] = 52.092 heals/sec.

Stormstout Secret Recipe [SSR]

  • Flying Kick [Q] - 57.88 [SSR] every 5 seconds.
  • Keg Smash [W1/KS] - 57.88 [SSR] every 6.5 seconds [BoF cast ASAP]
  • Breath of Fire [W2/BoF] - 57.88 [SSR] every 6.5 seconds [BoF cast ASAP]

Totals:

  1. Formula: (#Heroes Hit by Q + #Heroes Hit by W1 + $Heroes hit by W2) x SSR healing = Health healed in 6.5 seconds (fastest possible casting speeds)
  • (1 [Q] + 1 [W1] + 1 [W2]) x 57.88 [SSR] = 173.64 heals within 6.5 seconds [3 Heroes hit]
  • (1 [Q] + 2 [W1] + 2 [W2]) x 57.88 [SSR] = 289.4 heals within 6.5 seconds [5 Heroes hit]
  • (1 [Q] + 3 [W1] + 3 [W2]) x 57.88 [SSR] = 405.16 heals within 6.5 seconds [7 Heroes hit]

Comments

  1. Same as Level 1
  2. Deadly Strike Talent can deal 280 dmg every 5 seconds. 56 dps.
  3. Accumulating Flames deals 340.25 dmg over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds without being extended; 52.34 dps. 1 AA and already more dps than Deadly Strike.

Level 7

Eye of the Tiger [EoT] = 266.625 heals over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Fresh Ingredients [FI]

  • 1 Regen Globe = 586.08 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 58.608 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes = 1172.16 [Heals over 20 seconds] = 58.608 heals/sec.

Stormstout Secret Recipe [SSR]

  • 3 Heroes Hit = 195.36 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 5 Heroes Hit = 325.6 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 7 Heroes Hit = 455.84 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Comments

  1. Same as Lvl 1
  2. Elusive Brawler gives instant move speed its cooldown can be reduced via AAs. This will be important for Lvl 13.

Level 13

Eye of the Tiger [EoT] = 337.275 hp over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Fresh Ingredients [FI]

  • Max Persistent Quest Shields: 450
  • 1 Regen Globe = 741.6 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 74.16 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes = 1483.2 [Heals over 20 seconds] = 74.16 heals/sec.

Stormstout Secret Recipe [SSR]

  • 3 Heroes Hit = 247.2 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 5 Heroes Hit = 412 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 7 Heroes Hit = 576.8 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Comments

  1. Same as Lvl 1
  2. FI provides the least team fight sustain of the level 1 talents (unless you have Alexstrasza with globe quest, are fighting in lane, or fight over an objective that gives occasional globes).
  3. AA-build Chen at this level can out-dps Chen’s Fortifying Brew (untalented) with 300+ dps and Enough to Share’s ally shield.

Level 16

Eye of the Tiger [EoT] = 379.575 hp over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
Eye of the Tiger [EoT] w/ 2 or 3 seconds of Combo Strikes - ((168.7 [BD] x 1.5 [EoT Dmg boost]) x 0.5 [EoT Healing] = 126.525 heals/attack x 3 [3 attacks over 3 seconds w/o Combo Strikes dmg bonus]) + (126.525 h/a x 1.75 [Combo Strikes dmg])[1 attack with Combo Strikes] = 600.99375 heals over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Fresh Ingredients [FI]

  • Max Persistent Quest Shields: 506
  • 1 Regen Globe = 834.3 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 83.43 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes = 1668.6 [Heals over 20 seconds] = 83.43 heals/sec.

Stormstout Secret Recipe [SSR]

  • 3 Heroes Hit = 278.1 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 5 Heroes Hit = 463.5 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 7 Heroes Hit = 648.9 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Comments

  1. Same as Lvl 13
  2. Combo Strikes will still only hit 4 attacks in a 3-second period whether you have the bonus for 2 or 3 seconds. DPS is obviously higher over time the longer the Combo Strikes bonus is active.
  3. AA-build Chen now heals more than hitting 6 Heroes with SSR. PTR-Chen no longer benefits from increased Keg radius, either.
  4. I haven’t done the math for Celerity defensive value, but in order to maximize the cd reduction talent, one must hit a Slowed, Rooted, or Stunned target for 7 seconds straight. During this time, you’d have 15 Armor and have Celerity dmg reduction active for 3/7 seconds.

Level 20

Eye of the Tiger [EoT] = 443.925 hp over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
Eye of the Tiger [EoT] w/ Energizing Brew [EB] = 503.115 hp over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
Eye of the Tiger w/ Combo Strikes & Energizing Brew = 744.8075 hp over 3 seconds every 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Fresh Ingredients [FI]

  • Max Persistent Quest Shields: 592
  • 1 Regen Globe = 976.14 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 97.614 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes = 1952.28 [Heals over 20 seconds] = 97.614 heals/sec.
  • 1 Regen Globe w/ Energizing Brew = 1171.368 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 117.1368 heals/sec.
  • 2 Regen Globes w/ Energizing Brew = 2342.736 [Heals over 10 seconds] = 117.1368 heals/sec.

Stormstout Secret Recipe [SSR]

  • 3 Heroes Hit = 325.38 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 5 Heroes Hit = 542.3 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 7 Heroes Hit = 759.22 heals within 6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Comments

  1. Same as Lvl 16
  2. FI benefits more heals/sec-wise than EoT, but relies on access to globes.
  3. SSR requires enemies to be grouped extremely tightly and practically immobile to get max value.

Stormstout Secret Recipe: Lvl 20 Live vs Lvl 1 PTR

Lvl 20 Live w/ No talents

  • 3 Heroes Hit = 244.035 heals within 5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 5 Heroes Hit = 406.725 heals within 5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 7 Heroes Hit = 569.415 heals within 5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Lvl 20 Live w/ Keg Build

  • 4 Heroes Hit = 325.38 heals within >6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • [KS x2] 5 Heroes Hit = 406.725 heals within >6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 6 Heroes Hit = 488.07.415 heals within >6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • [KS x2] 7 Heroes Hit = 569.415 heals within >6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • 8 Heroes Hit = 650.76 heals within >6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]
  • [KS x2] 9 Heroes Hit = 723.105 heals within >6.5 seconds [ASAP casting]

Comments

  1. Keg build minimum starts at 4 b/c of the extra cd reduction on BoF allows for 2 casts within 5 seconds.
  2. [KS x2] Indicates 2 charges of Keg Smash are used within that period instead of just 1.
  3. Calculation does not include the difference in Keg Smash radius; it’s easier to hit Keg Smash on Live because of the talents that support it. Nor does it account for the fact that you have more chances to hit your target in a shorter period of time.
  4. Does not include damage mitigation from Live-Accumulating Flame, which provides between 20-100 Armor for at maximum 9 seconds straight upon initial engagement. Afterwards, Armor (20-100) uptime can be about 3 seconds out of every 5-6 seconds.

Predictions

Unless there are changes to PTR-Chen:

  1. Eye of the Tiger will have a disproportionate pick rate to the other two talents.
  2. AA-build will be the only viable build and all other talents will suffer from low pick and win rates.
  3. Chen’s win rate will decrease despite gaining single-target damage and Stagger. Instead of his damage being primarily ability-based, it is now AA-dependent. In addition to becoming weaker to CC via this rework, he is now also weaker to blinds.

I intend to propose changes in another post. Please let me know if there are any mistakes in the maths.

2

These values are bad. Freshest Ingredients has it beat in every way in lane, not to mention the Eye of the Tiger. How can this talent possibly compete? Values need to be WAY increased or Breath of Fire DoT needs to also trigger it, because atm it seems like there’s just no way, period, that it could ever compete, in lane or in fights.