Please Take a look at Imperius

General Discussion
1

I normally don’t make threads about nerfing and buffing heroes, but hear me out.

Imperius is one of the most unfun heroes to play against IMO not because of his mechanics, but because of the number behind then, he has tons of sustain damage and CC meaning his only weakness is waveclear (and mobility but Q can go over walls so…) dont get me wrong he is very fun to play and he does feel impactful but maybe a but too impactful

According to heroes profile at the time of posting this he has a 50.83% winrate, which doesn’t directly translate to balance and that’s the issue people are seeing, Players think because his winrate is average that he is balanced.

A good example of this is Medivh, look at his abilites, insane mobility for his whole team, untouchable mount, ally cant die for 2 seconds, insane spammable damage. Medivh has such an amazing broken kit, but since no one has enough skill to play him correctly, he is balanced, people look way too much into winrates for balance just cause bronze- gold players can’t play a hero correctly doesn’t mean they are balanced

so now on to my final point of comparing him to other bruisers. let me ask everyone a question , how many bruiser in this game would you pick over imperius? and out of the 15 bruisers in the entire game i think only Deathwing, Artanis and Imperius are viable for ranked, Imperius being the most broken of the 3 since Deathwing you can dodge fairly easily and Artanis is actually a little broken but not as much as imperius, because at least with his damage doesn’t kick off until around 13-20

In conclusion, i don’t think no waveclear is enough to compensate for his Damage CC and sustain, my suggested nerf would either be his level 1 % damage or his stun duration, because why do you need waveclear when you win 99% of duels.

Thank you for reading everyone, i hope you can understand my point of view

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You lost me at 50% win rate.

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3

Yes it does.

Winrate is literally the measurement of objective balance.

Everything else is a matter of opinion.

People like you thinking your personal opinions determine what “balance” is are the reason heroes like Genji get nerfed into the lower mantle and then left there.

I would be just as willing to play Artanis, Thrall, Leoric, Dehaka, Varian, and Ragnaros as I am Imperius if I hadn’t already played a them a bunch and gotten somewhat tired of them.
I would be willing to play Xul just as much as Imperius, but I don’t tend to play heroes that are notably under- or over-performing.
I do not know how to play Sonya, Rexxar, Chen, or Yrel.
Malthael, D.Va, and Deathwing’s current kits and playstyles do not appeal to me.

Artanis is underperforming. If you’re looking for heroes who are “viable”/improve your chances of victory, I’d recommend picking up Sonya, Rexxar, or Xul alongside your Deathwing pick.

Because this game is often won or lost based on who can push the hardest, of which waveclear is a major part. You could win every duel in a game and still lose because you couldn’t shove your minions into enemy structures or prevent enemies from shoving their minions into your structures.

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If i want to focus macro play the list is pretty long i also can pick arthas and falstad for that purpose.

Same thing if i want defensive utility but imperius can provide some with 6 sword 20 upgrade i guess.

Now as a bruiser with more focus on engage and single target damage i agree he is at the top but it is more of a testament of all direct damage bruisers suck or have been neutered.

Artanis is a meme, varian is a meme and nerfed, sonya is in a better spot but one stun in W and she is gone plus her spear got neutered, deathwing has been nerfed a lot and has to be picked wisely.

I don’t disagree on imperius getting nerfed but can we stop having meme direct damage bruisers?

Also there is a long list of range heroes who are dominant in years begging to get nerfed : valla, greymane, jimmy , cassia, tassadar, the overlord of all hanzo and also sylvanas.
I would sure love to have the game graduate from those too.

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No it doesnt, Yrell Ming and Ana have a average winrate on masters but they are overpowered as heck there. It doesnt mean balance when there is a huge inbalance

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Yes, it literally does. Winrate is a measure of a heroes consistent performance over a wide range of situations.

If Yrel, Li Ming, and Ana have average winrates, it literally means they are not “OP.”
There might be specific situations where they are extremely strong, but there that means there are also specific situations where they are weak, and it balances out.

As I’ve told you probably a dozen times by now, your personal anecdote does not overrule statistical evidence.

It is fine if you think those heroes are annoying or frustrating to play against, that’s your opinion (and one I happen to share for Li Ming and Yrel). But that does not make them “OP.”
Otherwise, we could apply your logic to any hero and declare them OP because someone finds them annoying.

3 Likes
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Every time a hero starts showing up a lot at higher level. This happens. (Including the time when it happened with Diablo who was the worse tank)

Nothing about Imperius has been changed. Why, after all this time, is he suddenly a problem now?

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Imperius is a joke if he fails Q. I think he’s like Alarak and people needs to learn how to play against the hero.

This needs to be a forum rule to avoid thousands of “pls nerf” threads.

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Careful. You make comparisons like that and these clowns will bring back the “nerf Alarak!” threads.

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yeah so are a lot of heroes, if they miss X ability. that doesn’t excuse Q’s insane damage. It needs a nerf.

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11

Last time they overnerfed E build so I hope the devs stop listen salty complains.

Artanis can do as much dmg if he lands everything he has, Imperius is just a better hero thanks to the way his self-healing works.
I don’t want another hero to be overnerfed like many before him.

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This is why im glad devs dont balance around community requests. My own ideas included.

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Some ideas are decent, or at least are good for inspiration.

Most of these threads aren’t anything like that. There are no ideas here, it’s just vague demanding or begging for nerfs.

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This is actually a bit nuanced. While winrate is the measure of balance, there is no one winrate that determines balance.

48-52% is the ideal winrate for a jack-of-all-trades, but that’s not the ideal winrate for a specialist who can only be drafted in a specific situation effectively.

This is where popularity comes in, as balance is really a mixture of popularity + winrate.

In Imperius’s case he likely has too high popularity. This does not mean he needs a vast blanket nerf. (His winrate averages about 52%).

A slight nerf to Impaled Light is all you need, and maybe nerf the AoE damage on Flash of Anger.

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He got some Q buffs. Flash of anger got a little more damage, the level one Q got buffed in damage I think and his 13 pathetic mortals also got buffed. On their own none of these is too strong and even together don’t amount to his win rate being busted.

I would start with buffing up the other level 7 talents. Holy fervor has fallen off a lot since his mini rework. Blaze of glory is nice but it lacks the upside flash of anger has. I would then look at lowering the damage on flash of anger just a bit. That should help reign in the build by providing better build competition. Still might not do much since people like the all in play style of Q build though.

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No maximus. Its you thinking stats says everything without you having experience in it.
Someone who is forced to heal and plays ana has also impact on that winrate, but a master dedicated player who dominates with her on a 5 man team is really overpowered.

You look at overal winrates and thats a huge mistake based on stuff you have no clue about but “because a site tells it must be 100% correct.”

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Its no use Blizzard and the majority of the playerbase is absolute braindead.

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I go with statistics over feels, but in a recent post, the devs said they’re reworking uther even if his stats are fine because the public THINKS he’s weak and can’t solo heal. They can’t straight buff him because the stats already say he’s balanced so he’d be op with his current kit buffed. Something along those lines

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Neat, but we don’t balance the heroes in this game solely around a single highly skilled player, nor a small handful of them.

Your logic is the exact same logic that so many people used to justify nerfing Genji and Diablo. “Because this one guy is really good at this particular hero, we should nerf they hero they’re really good at!”
And you can apply this logic to any hero in the game to justify nerfs. It applies regardless of whether a hero is balanced or not.

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Then what they’re trying to fix is not a balance problem, it’s a design problem, which is a different matter entirely.

Then we’re mostly talking about playstyle preference, which is mostly opinion. I and Ephraim hated Lucio’s rework, but apparently quite a few people liked it.
Aside from High Five turning out to be even less desirable than Reverse Amp was, there isn’t any statistical reason the rework was bad. Both were balanced, they just had different playstyles. Some people didn’t like the old one and do like the new one, and others are vice versa.

2 Likes