Can we do something about Butcher, please?

General Discussion
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I don’t normally make threads like this but, i see others have, so why not. Yeah, can we do something about Butch, please? He’s basically the HOTS equivalent of Marvel’s Juggernaut. A True S-tier BEAST!

So many other characters i have counter-strategies in mind and how to deal with them. Against a GOOD Butch, however? I’ve got NOTHING. It’s just game over. All i can hope for is he makes a mistake, or his team mates are idiots and their mediocrity drags him down. Otherwise, a Good Butch with a half-decent team? There is no hope. It’s just an imminent beat-down.

Can we rebalance this SOB, please?

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Have you tried lili? Or perhaps cassia? Maybe Ana? What about Jaina? And those are just the particularity hard counters. The real problem is probably that you’re talking quick match and a good but her against a team without a tank would be quite insanely powerful.

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Well speak of the Devil…i got matched with a Decent/Good Butch…and it was disgusting! We utterly annihilated the other team! My Azmo backing a good Butch? They had no chance. I don’t think we made it to level 15 before winning. The other team’s salt must’ve been off the charts.

Butcher is just so dominant! He hits like a Truck, great health, there’s no escaping him when he’s committed to getting you, and when he does? Your moves are all temporarily disabled while he’s wailing on you. The only way he could be more broken is, if they gave him a Good projectile attack too.

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Butcher is trash tier and almost as bad as nova in her own tier. Any good meta team comp will beat butcher

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If your tank/healer aren’t helping you, they are doing it wrong. I had a match earlier tonight as Dehaka against a Butcher, and he didn’t do so well. If he charged a team mate, he got licked and dragged away to his death. If he charged me, I would burrow. He is very telegraphed, so most teams can deal with him fairly well.

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Eh, he’s pretty easy to deal with.

Today I had a game vs a good Butcher as Naz…saved my allies every time he charged by timing my zombie wall well, so he’d charge into the center as it completed.

He never got his full meat stacks and literally started cancelling his charges anytime I threw up a Zombie Wall lol.

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Tell that to the team we just destroyed. Of course we made sure to back our Butch up. However, there were several occasions where we weren’t necessarily backing him up, so much as standing guard to keep the other team at bay. So Butch could have his way with whomever he was going after, uninterrupted. I was happy to take the win but, it was still disgusting.

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Then that team’s tank was an idiot.

If it was a QM with no tanks, well, sure. A lot of bad heroes can do whatever they want when there are no tanks.

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I think you’re probably playing in QM most of the time.
In such case, yeah, it can be difficult to beat a good butcher, mainly because of the matchmaking.
The main problem is that Butcher is a hero who is easily countered by other heroes (mainly LiLi, Cassia, Mei and really any form of blind). He can also be picked through displacement abilities (KTZ chains, Stitches Grab, Ming Repulsion), which makes him solo and easy to kill. Lastly, any form of stun will end him because it will allow your team to deprive him of his self sustain (the hero he’s attacking will just back for a bit).

So, these are the counters to the Butcher.

In terms of playing well, or strategies against him, one may be to simply kill him as soon as possible during the early game, in order to not allow him to stack any meat. And if, as any good butcher should, he then goes to solo lane to get stacks on minions, a 4-man or a 3-man should come to his lane to deny him the ability to do so.

Now, why is that a problem? Because without any counter to the butcher (so, displacement, some blinds, stuns, and playing as a team) can be denied and will be denied when playing QM.
When against a Butcher, you’re heavily reliant on the one who counters him in the team; if he doesn’t counter him in the least, it’s the end. In the same way, if the enemy team is good enough to force his “counter ability” out of him, then the Butcher gets a free pass to your squishies.
The main problem though, is that more often than not, the matchmaking system of QM won’t give you any form of counter to the Butcher, which will allow a good Butcher to have an easy win if he doesn’t throw the game all the time. Because the only way left to get him is to wait until he isolates himself to get a pick on him.
This gives the Butcher a 53.6% winrate in QM… vs a 50% winrate in SL.

So yeah, Butcher is one of those heroes. Counter or get butchered. In QM, you often won’t get the possibility of countering, which only leaves one way… get butchered.

Apart from that, if you just pick any hero who counters him, you won’t have a problem when you’re matched against him. In SL in particular, he’s considered bad because his baseline quest will be especially hard to stack, which will deny a “real hero” to the enemy team for more than half the game.

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You must be master tier to pull off those plays consistently

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Annnnnnnd… i’m done with your post right there. Forget it! I’m NOT playing Ranked/Unranked. Those modes are for noobs that can’t handle the all-out WAR, that is QM, and desire a more “controlled” setting.

And i’ve pretty much got strategies on how to deal with every other character. Butcher is the one character that i just have NOTHING with. Again, my only hope is he screws up one time too many, or his team mates suck.

Otherwise, a Good Butch with a decent team is a nightmare. And even if we win? It’ll be an extreme up-hill battle from the get-go.

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You know, I play mostly QM too…
First of all, it’s not much of an “all out war”.
Second, the point I made was exactly what you were looking for: I explained that Butcher was overachieving in QM and why.

I’ll never understand those people who stop reading because they have a slight misconception of what the post will be. I guess it’s a mental health problem that would explain not finding any solution to the Butcher.

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Frankly, depends on how drunk I am lol.

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Well, since QM is pretty much pure luck in terms of team compositions, you mostly depend of it. Both being against or having a decent/good Butch will need the help of their team, and if they cannot support or help it when the opposing team is thrashing with it, there isn’t much that can be done. I’ve heard some rumors about a patch work for Butch soon…

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Cassia. Armor and blinds and range.

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Butcher is actually terrible, he’s arguably the worst melee damage dealer. Blind him and he is useless, or play one of the like 10 champs that can dodge or jump away. Or get help from any tank in the game, he is trash

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butcher is very ez to counter, heck a NAZEEBO can counter him by placing a Z wall at the right time so when he goes through with his charge there is a Z wall between him and his target

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Low MMR Quick Match is not a good place to balance the game around.

Plenty of heroes that are practically unviable can win in new player QM games, low MMR QM games or Brawls. Doesn’t say much of their state of balance.

Butcher is in great need of a rework or buffs just as Nova.
He is also completely useless even in Quick Match if facing people who know how to use blinds (and the system put a blinding hero on the enemy team).

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I’m fine with some heroes being much stronger in low elo and garbage in high elo

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Me too. But OP was basing his assumption of Butcher being OP on his experiences from low MMR QM.

He is the last hero who needs nerfs right now.

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