I’m at my wits end with this freaking card. They either need to take miniaturize away from it, or make it a legendary, because right now the consecutive 1/1 mageridon are ridiculous as can be.
5 Likes
https://hsreplay.net/decks/BP7DtbJLfHfmaNdWslhsGf/#gameType=RANKED_STANDARD
Just look at the card with the highest mulligan, drawn, and played win rates, and you’ll see the real problem.
DH at those ranks wins 84% of the time if umpire’s grasp is in their mulligan.
The weapon is also elevating the played and drawn win rates of window shopper, which is the 4th worst card to be in the mulligan.
Overpowered cards usually have inflated mulligan win rates as they are important to draw. Window shopper is only overpowered when drawn from Umpire’s grasp.
4 Likes
no the weapon is
people here keep underestimating how good tutor effects can be
and this weapon tutors and decreases cost !
for example i think a nerf for it could be
changing the weapon DR to " next demon you draw costs 2 less "
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I hate to be like Mall but let’s compare to the old arcane intellect for 3. It just draws 2 cards. No tutor. No discount. No immediate 3 damage with possible (more like almost guaranteed because it’s not a good viper target) 3 more next turn.
And unlike arcane intellect, a weapon can’t be stopped with counterspell (or okani/objection in wild if it was a minion), and the tutor+discount comes from a DR, which also cannot be silenced or prevented. So even weapon break won’t stop the DH from proceeding with his plan.
Comparing to a weapon, it’s a win axe for one more mana but has a much better effect, an effect which cheats back 2 mana. Not that DH doesn’t have other ways to fight tempo on turns 1 and 2. Being turn 3 also isn’t so bad when there’s the neutral 2 drop that tutors it.
There are lots of ways to nerf the weapon, because the weapon just does so much. They could nerf the draw/tutor part, or the damage on the weapon, or the mana cost so you can’t do turn 2 tutor turn 3 weapon as smoothly. etc
mag cant hurt you if you reno it
the weapon would probably cost 5 mana if its effect were a battlecry instead of a deathrattle
This is a great argument and one I should have made before you. It’s directly in the data that Shopper via Grasp is overpowered and that Shopper without Grasp is not. Great job.
4 Likes
Now replace a couple cards in the deck with other demons and watch what happens to Umpire’s Grasp’s stats.
Window Shopper is too good a target from Umpire’s Grasp, which isn’t the weapon’s fault.
But I don’t think this chasm is going to be bridged because appealing to statistics doesn’t work when there’s no popular list that runs Umpire’s Grasp and demons other than Window Shopper.
EDIT: Like, even Reno DH cut all demons except Window Shopper…in the set where we got Magtheridon and already had Mythical Terror. Because it’s too synergistic with Umpire’s Grasp.
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Sure, it drops off, but it’s still crazy strong. I was running other demons at set launch in Reno DH and it was still the strongest card in the deck.
Sure, but that can easily be true if other demons. Xhilag on 5 every game would have also been back breaking.
Umpire’s grasp limits how strong demons can be.
If you nerf shopper instead of umpire’s grasp, Reno DH just swaps shoppers out for Illidari inquisitors for lots of charge damage from hand.
The weapon is too strong across the board. Don’t penalize the best demon it pulls, because that’s just going to rotate to a new demon.
This is basically what Wheel Warlock and Rainbow DK already do but without the ability to follow up. It’s the win condition for slow DH. And it would be on turn 7+.
Yeah, it’s slower and weaker, it’s still stupidly strong and driven by a weapon that is overtuned in the extreme.
I don’t want demons to have 2 years of being too strong when drawn by grasp and bad otherwise.
Just kill the weapon. You don’t want demon synergies reliant on this.
I also like window shopper as a card, and I don’t want it killed because of umpire’s grasp making it happen like 50% of the time on turn 4. Window shopper isn’t OP at all unless drawn by Umpire’s grasp.
Umpire’s grasp is always OP, but maybe less OP with a different demon.
Nerf Nerf Nerf, I swear its the same tired response from this community. Its like most of you get all your enjoyment out of looking for the next nerf target instead of just playing the game.
Looks like we have a DH abuser here 
If we are talking about Demon Hunter my stance since day 1 is not to nerf the class.
I would much rather have it purged from the game, any remaining data files downloaded into an external drive and sent to my address so i could physically destroy it with my bare hands.
I dont hide behind any illusion of logic when addressing this class, no amount of class killing nerfs would ever be good enough for me.
I love it when people act like they can’t understand why a community would want something addressed. Chances are you are one of the ones abusing the class and you are upset because you know they will probably tamper the deck down which means you won’t be winning as much because you will actually have to relay on skill and not broken mechanics.
1 Like
Because the ‘community’ just complains about the next thing then the next thing without even trying to counter the meta and is never happy.
Countering DH is main decking Glacial Shard, that’s it. That’s because the deck relies on discover. Making it harder to build around and only able to counter straightforward effects like freezing the weapon.
You can give people as much time as they want and there won’t be a counter except stacking armor with warrior and doing what control does best. This is a hotfix moment and what should have been given time to find counter is Paladin.
Its always a must be done immediately with complainers they need to take their time and get it right this time.
yeah definetelly weapon is the problem.
it draws and than discount windows shop keeper at the same time. Shop Keeper alone is not a big deal but when shop keeper comes for 3 mana the demon it pulls also comes for 3 mana. so you get a 6/5 cheap demon with op effect for 3 mana plus miniature which can discover magtheridon, tough crowd, ganarg etc.
So run back this argument but replace Window Shopper with Illidari Inquisitor. Is it as ridiculous?