He is just making things up. They wont have your mmr exactly not even close. If you are 8k you can get in lobbys with 16k players. And if you are 7k you will still get lobbys with players who are 1k+ higher.
I dont know the average mmr spread (difference between highest and lowest rating in a lobby) in lobbys above 7k but i would guess its at least 1k average and probably more
They’ve already said as much. MMR is the only match factor.
The players on the line between the two are most certainly matched together frequently because of how close their MMR is.
He doesn’t get it, but then talks down to everyone else.
It isn’t even the same across the whole top 10%.
Yep.
Do you have a mirror anywhere handy, because this reads like you’re looking in one.
I would be shocked if there weren’t stacks of players with identical MMR across most of the ladder. Only at the extremes would the values start to have tails which behave how Altair thinks the whole ladder does, where rank is equal to MMR.
The evidence for this is the statement that they normalize (fit it to a bell curve to start the month) the distribution at the end of each month.
It’s really common now, actually.
I suspect it’s so that player don’t figure out the formula and then somehow exploit the system, but that’s just a guess.
You understand that you are not matched by rank in BG either and that playing longer or more frequently is why the ranking climbs, but the MMR pool can be identical?
If blizzard put down some number on the screen then claimed your opponent was the same, would you believe it?
If I thought there’s something more nefarious going on with the matchmaking that needs constant checking of yours and your opponent MMR, I wouldn’t believe anything Blizzard said about it.
That’s a valid point.
All we as players know is there’s a number or score that exists that is the basis for all of the matchmaking in ranked.
A little more information about how a players MMR is determined would go a long way.
I think transparency about this system would help build trust with anyone who might think there is something else going on.
I’m not part of any conspiracy theory group.
My question was why it has to remain hidden.
I did research prior to asking and the majority opinion was that it was hidden because of how it would effect a players feelings about their own personal performance.
You asked if I would believe any number or score if they provided one and I just wanted to know why it had to remain hidden since it is now the only factor in the matchmaking process.
I guess we’ll never know the answer.
We do have more information. We know it’s based on chess elo system, and you can read more about it here:
https://www.chess.com/terms/elo-rating-chess
They have rules of thumb, such as if a player has 100 elo more than another he’s expected to win around 5/8 times (64%), or if he has 200 elo more he’s expected to win 3/4 times (75%)
In legend, at least, your rank can be a good approximation of MMR, so you can predict certain things before they happen. If you win 10 games in a row and get matched to someone with like 1k ranks more than you, you can be sure your MMR is now higher than your rank shows, but you still need to win against better players to improve that rank. If you don’t, your MMR will quickly stabilize around the rank where you are.
You can also see how dense your ranks are based on the difference in ranks of players you are matched with. If you get matched with players of similar rank (like +/- 50 ranks), it’s not very dense - this means that there’s a considerable gap in MMR between you and a player ranked 100+ better than you, so you can expect to improve ranks slowly.
If you get matched with someone 500 ranks better than you, that rank is dense, which means 1 win will get you more ranks and you can expect to improve ranks faster.
In lower ranks where you only have ranks 1 to 5 and stars, you are matched based on your previous season’s MMR placement, which is lumped in categories/baskets, meaning you can’t even get matched against people who were a lot better than you finished last season (which automatically means whole Neon’s conspiracy theory which prevents him from hitting Legend is catastrophically wrong).
If your legend climb is harder than it used to be, it’s because your expected rank once you hit legend is higher than it used to be - because your MMR is higher. Noone conspired to keep you stuck in platinum. With enough games, you’ll hit legend and get a rank close to the one you finished the last season in. If you give up, you’ll just get less stars next season, have an easier grind, but lose 3 to 10k ranks once you hit Legend and then you’ll just have to win the harder games you gave up from last season if you want to return to where you once was.
It’s all very transparent to anyone playing long enough to notice the patterns and logical enough to not allow emotions to get the better of them.
You keep saying this, but not a single word of it is true.
WHat is your source for your basket assertion? I assure it does not work like this.
MMR is a continuous variable, not discreet baskets that you believe you have.
Guess you haven’t played long enough.
You mean it’s dense and they don’t have to move far to find a match… it’s sparse if they have bigger gaps.
But rank and MMR aren’t the same for 95% or more of the player base. You want to talk about ten cases as the norm, and that’s just laughable.
You know absolutely nothing about how math works.
This is accurate. Your MMR does NOT reset when your rank resets.
All I asked was a simple question about why our MMR has to remain hidden. The devs have never stated anything about MMR and the game of chess.
All I know is that there is some kind of metric that is hidden information that represents your “real” ability in HS. Why they choose to keep this “under the hood “ is a mystery. It would be nice for an “advanced option” that allows players who choose to be able to see what their actual MMR score is.
I have come to the conclusion that I will NEVER know what that is. Displayed ranks mean nothing in my opinion and I agree with the statement that they are nothing more than participation rewards. Only for the few percentage of players who achieve high level of legend rank do they have any real interest.
There’s too much conjecture in this thread; the Devs have clearly covered a lot of the confusion; granted you might need some experience in computer science subjects but it’s relatively clear.
The Devs have already “admitted” they often won’t give you the exact same MMR opponent; it’s one of the reasons the search sometimes delays; it can expand the search to other MMRs.
What is interesting to me as an unknown is whether they combine the MMR of the last opponent for your new MMR (they probably do) but I wonder exactly how if they do that.
When I had 10 stars, I’ve played against completely different people than when I got 11 stars for the first time and afterwards
When you play 100 games per day, you start noticing you’re playing against same people over and over again and then suddenly, new names start repeating, and you only play against the previously repeating names when you lose a lot of games in a row. Not once did I get matched against Thijs, or NoHandsGamer or even MakiahTime when I had 10 stars, but as soon as I got 11, I started getting them both in the placement matches and afterwards.
I don’t need anyone to confirm this. That’s how it works. Good luck proving it’s not, since it’s literally how it works.
Correct.
Correct.
Now that they are not included in the matching process, also correct.
While I don’t know exactly how they do it, they have given enough information to understand the process they use to figure it out.
Because your MMR was higher, but the people in the boundaries absolutely play each other because the variable isn’t discreet. Your stars aren’t used in the process of matching you.
Only when your MMR is high or low enough to be in a sparsely populated matching area.
They have told us directly that MMR is normed to a bell curve to start each season. Do you even have a clue what that means? If you are in one of the tails, your experience is not typical and you’re in one of the tails.
Everything you know about MMR for you doesn’t apply to the rest of the group because there are thousands of players at the average MMR instead of dozens at yours.
No, you’re the supreme authority on all things and data will never be required for beliefs based on anecdote and faith.
The hilarious thing is you don’t understand statistics enough to even begin to understand why you’re wrong despite me explaining it to you repeatedly.
On a side note, I honestly feel bad for you that you play 100 games a day. I have so many better things to do with my life than spend that much time on any video game.
One day they will be able to have the technology to implement ranked mode having ranks that people can see…it’s incredible they haven’t figured this out yet.
Scr0tie laid this out pretty well above. It’s not a mystery. They do it for psychological manipulation purposes because it is profitable
Oh I get it, subterfuge just to sell packs.
I just wanted to make sure it wasn’t because someone’s feelings would be hurt.
When someone denies you access to information, it is always for their gain, at your expense.
I think that this is true if the message has exactly 1 recipient. But most messages do not have exactly 1 recipient, so your statement is mostly false.
For example, if I was only communicating with a malicious hacker, not providing my network information would be good for me and bad for the hacker. But I’m not talking just to them, I’m talking to them and everyone on the forums, simultaneously, and the vast majority do not participate in this particular information dynamic.
Wow, people are so obedient to Blizzard around here. I have to admit that they are kinda successful in making a small group of people so loyal to it that they would help defending it from anyone’s question.
Congratulations Blizzard. Bravo.
In almost every popular online competitive games, they usually show a player’s rank. Why can Hearthstone not do that ? It is a valid question to ask.
I believe that Blizzard has a reason behind this decision, but I highly doubt that the reason would exist for the player’s sake or not.
They show your rank in this one, too xD
It doesn’t show your MMR, but none of the popular online competitive games do
My bad, I mean in other popular competitive games, they show your MMR.
LOL, Dota 2
No, they don’t.
You have 3rd party websites approximating it, but that’s not them showing it, at least not in LoL. Dunno about Dota