Why I quit HS many years ago

[Robert-24922]

This is just my personal experience, and idk what people think about HS now, but from what I heard, the game has a decreasing population. I came to claim my WOW gifts and had a couple of games in HS.

I played HS since July 2014 up until 2018. Mostly I played casually, the highest rating I have ever got was 8 (that was the way in the past, idk how it works now). What made me love the game? The idea of two people having decks that interact and fight each other. What made me quit? The gameplay of two people having decks and having 0 interaction and fight the entire game.

I loved how I put a minion, and you put a minion, and then I have to decide which of my minions fight yours, should I hit face or try to kill your minions. It was a deck vs deck moment. I had my deck and my idea, you had yours.

So

1. Problem 1, no deck interaction.
I would put my deck, and the enemy would just go face hunter or face shaman. Their deck would not interact with mine, just face face face face. Felt like I was playing solo. I didn’t understand, what’s the point of having two people having custom decks, if the enemy is just going to be allowed to completely ignore your deck and win. Like how rogue would just give all your cards back to you and kill with fatigue. Or oneshot mage, just being afk the entire game, having 0 deck interaction, and then killing you in a round. I understand that there were ways to fight these, guides, or playing meta decks, but I am talking from more casual perspective. It was just not fun (for me, personally).

2. Complete removal of the standard attack/hp balance.
The way HS was designed at first was that each card had a bit balance. For example, 7 mana would give you a minion with HP and attack near 7, something like 6 attack and 7 defense. But later, this was completely removed, like I saw videos of DH putting 2 12/12 cards in the fourth move, which is 24 attack, and the player has 30 hp only. I loved how minions would have less HP and attack if they had a battlecry or something.

3. Trying to cater to elitists.
In my opinion, games like HS would be mostly enjoyed by casuals, and I didn’t like how there were clearly unhealthy and OP decks existing and they would never be nerfed because it was the established meta, and people liked to sweat on it.

4. Making hearthstone into FIFAstone.
The last nail in the coffin was losing all your cards and progression by the time. I know this is a very personal issue, and I get that standard mod was the correct choice. It’s just wasn’t for me.

If you enjoy HS or you love or loved playing face decks, it’s your choice. I don’t want to diminish your sense of fun. Everyone is entitled to have fun the way that does not break the game rules. It’s just I didn’t like how aggressive the gameplay was. I loved thinking during my turns, and seeing how my opponent thinks, there was sort of mind games going. But it was all removed, probably because people like me were the minority, or just quit silently.

[Kassadin-21130]

You quit during the aggro meta and came back during the aggro meta

Unlucky bro xD

[Robert-24922]

Does it mean the aggro meta was never over then?

[Kassadin-21130]

No. We just exited a control meta 12 days ago. Before that, I don’t know cuz I also returned to the game lately, after 4-5 years

There are still decent control decks on the ladder, like Boomboss/Brann Warrior and Sif Mage (combo)

More than decent, actually

[Mallenroh-11647]

I agree with practically every word.
Only difference is that I am still here…

[Vankrys-2732]

When is it not an aggro meta?

[Wildstorm-22474]

The game is the most fun its been in ages right now.

[Blueprints-1287]

Same here, i quit for about 6 years and recently came back playing. I play wild and it’s mainly Reno decks. Lone Ranger Reno is so overpowered, when it’s played i know the game is lost. But minion based play seems a thing of the past. All gimicky decks or one turn kill, and of course Reno decks. Still fun, but as a paladin player i miss minion play.

[Kamikaze-1242]

@Robert-24922

I would put my deck, and the enemy would just go face hunter or face shaman. Their deck would not interact with mine, just face face face face. Felt like I was playing solo. I didn’t understand, what’s the point of having two people having custom decks, if the enemy is just going to be allowed to completely ignore your deck and win.

Going face is just another win con, the game’s tutorial even reinforces this by saying that sometimes, if u cant win on the board u should focus your resources going face.

@Robert-24922

Like how rogue would just give all your cards back to you and kill with fatigue. Or oneshot mage, just being afk the entire game, having 0 deck interaction, and then killing you in a round.

U seems like you dont understand other forms of archetypes rather than midrange.

The magic of a competitive card game is that…variety.

@Robert-24922

The way HS was designed at first was that each card had a bit balance. For example, 7 mana would give you a minion with HP and attack near 7, something like 6 attack and 7 defense. But later, this was completely removed, like I saw videos of DH putting 2 12/12 cards in the fourth move, which is 24 attack, and the player has 30 hp only. I loved how minions would have less HP and attack if they had a battlecry or something.

Yeah, I kinda miss old HS design, but That’s the problem with any old CCG everything is corrupted by powercreep in order for new cards to see play.

But if everything is broken then nothing is broken, yes, with the right conditions u can do some big power plays, but at the same time u can counter those power plays, removals are cheaper and each expansion more powerful too to deal with things like that.

@Robert-24922

In my opinion, games like HS would be mostly enjoyed by casuals, and I didn’t like how there were clearly unhealthy and OP decks existing and they would never be nerfed because it was the established meta, and people liked to sweat on it.

This was ben brode’s era concept of design, and I hated that.

Today it doesnt takes long for nerfs, and we even have buffs and they really change the meta.

@Robert-24922

The last nail in the coffin was losing all your cards and progression by the time. I know this is a very personal issue, and I get that standard mod was the correct choice. It’s just wasn’t for me.

That’s what wild is for.

[CheezusCrust-1567]

this post is funny, you can literally just make your own rules for deck building and just vs friends all day

[Boreas-1179]

@Blueprints-1287

when it’s played i know the game is lost

that only happens if the opponent has enough damage for lethal on the board …or the last turn of wheel of death

[Shuyin-1330]

1. Hitting your face with minions is interacting with you. That is not a good example of no interaction. A good example would be something like Miracle Rogue that does nothing but draw until they get their infinite draw engine drawing the rest of their deck in 1 turn before busting out an OTK wombo combo and even then you can interact with them by hitting them in the face to force them to play defensively and slowing them down. Game isn’t bumping Yeti’s anymore it evolved.

2. I’ll give you this one. They went too far with power creep. Sometime after Brode left they went nuts with the power creep and instead of a slow increase over time they went for an exponential increase per expansion.

3. Games been out for 10 years. People that played since the begging have cards. Your 2014 basic starters don’t cut it anymore.

4. You don’t lose cards unless you disenchant them. There is this mode called Wild that is the game without rotations.

So basically you want a meta with 2014 Basic Cards and nothing else not even the Classic set.

Blizzard can do that and it will be the new Bot mode.

[SparkyElf-2852]

@Robert-24922

but from what I heard, the game has a decreasing population

Sure about that?

I don’t think we’ve had the official player numbers, but it’s been complicated. Here are some quick references with indirect indications of HS’s popularity that I’ve dug up:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7K7DFWplNfQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUpsudGHiRU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArcA_j-Cu7s

@Robert-24922

the highest rating I have ever got was 8 (that was the way in the past, idk how it works now)

https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Ranked

See also the historic article for the old system.

@Robert-24922

I loved how I put a minion, and you put a minion, and then I have to decide which of my minions fight yours, should I hit face or try to kill your minions. It was a deck vs deck moment. I had my deck and my idea, you had yours.

Believe me, I understand you, and that’s how I’d felt about the game, too (played since open beta, quit at Un’Goro’s launch, btw).

However, what’d happen if we’d take this to the absolute? You’d have a bunch of ‘creative’ Priest players, sitting there and thinking their ‘bright’ ideas: ‘Okay, I’ve got 2x Mind Control, 2x Thoughtsteal (the ultimate skill-testing card, by the way), a bunch of powerful Legengaries and removals. My DeCk HaS mOrE vAlUe ThAn YoUrS, yOu CaNnOt PoSsIbLy WiN!’

The solution? To just kill those greedy guys before they even get a chance to play their ‘wonderful’ cards.

@Robert-24922

just face face face face

That’s how this game was in the very beginning — trust me, I’m a Classic connoiseur (probably one of the top ones when the mode was a thing; not so much in 2014, when I was still building up a collection, playing ‘beginner’ decks and so on). If I were to pick one card as the epitome of the original ‘meta’, that’d be Leeroy Jenkins — making a return for the 10-year anniversary, by the way.

‘Everybody knows that the face is the place’. Take a look at this one, you might like it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jenlSf2E8o

The point is: HS had been like this since the beginning.

@Robert-24922

Trying to cater to elitists.
In my opinion, games like HS would be mostly enjoyed by casuals

In my opinion, on the contrary, the game has been catering too much to casuals, making the impact of strategy and skill insignificant, as opposed to wild ‘RNG’ and so on.

[SlingBox-11907]

If you dont want to get hit in the face so much then duck … actually rather taunt

what you’re trying to say is that you want a time machine to play the 2018 version

OK, I’m a genie and I will grant you your one wish… actually BLZ is planning to come out with an updated version called HS versions where you can select between which year or version you want to play in. Soooooo

[Smokescreen-1847]

There’s only so much you can take of a game decided the majority of the time by a random number generator, before you have to take a couple years off and come back when there’s literally nothing else to play at the moment or you’re on your phone.

[Robert-24922]

@Mallenroh-11647

I agree with practically every word.
Only difference is that I am still here…

I played a couple of matches, there were mostly bots at first, then after a bit of ranking up, it started again, Vietnam flashbacks. Every second enemy had a deck that was all about ignoring you completely. The decks won’t interact. No sense of “my deck is unique or fun.” It’s all about “my deck is meta.” For me personally, it’s just boring. I don’t want magic the gathering esports.

@Kamikaze-1242

Going face is just another win con, the game’s tutorial even reinforces this by saying that sometimes, if u cant win on the board u should focus your resources going face.

Yeah, don’t get me wrong, I am not saying it should not be allowed to have aggressive play. It’s just there are two decks with 30 cards on each, and 0 of them interact during the entire game, and you lose in 3 rounds. It’s not a fun gameplay for me, personally.

@Kamikaze-1242

U seems like you dont understand other forms of archetypes rather than midrange.

The magic of a competitive card game is that…variety.

I understand it, it’s just I don’t like it.

@Kamikaze-1242

Yeah, I kinda miss old HS design, but That’s the problem with any old CCG everything is corrupted by powercreep in order for new cards to see play.

But if everything is broken then nothing is broken, yes, with the right conditions u can do some big power plays, but at the same time u can counter those power plays, removals are cheaper and each expansion more powerful too to deal with things like that.

I know, trust me. I had friends who were legends, they taught and explained me, I ranked up from 13 to 8, but I quit because I wasn’t having fun anymore. Because for me, I liked the idea of “I want to play what I want.” But the more you play, eventually you rank up, and now you are forced to play the things that your enemy wants you to play. Boring for me.

@CheezusCrust-1567

this post is funny, you can literally just make your own rules for deck building and just vs friends all day

I am 10000% sure you didn’t read more than 2 sentences. What you wrote here is a proof.

@Shuyin-1330

Hitting your face with minions is interacting with you

Not with your deck, right?

@Shuyin-1330

That is not a good example of no interaction

What I said is that decks don’t interact. I am not a deck.

@Shuyin-1330

Game isn’t bumping Yeti’s anymore it evolved.

Backwards.

@Shuyin-1330

I’ll give you this one. They went too far with power creep.

For me, it became too fast. I didn’t like that games would be over in the third/fourth move.

@Shuyin-1330

Games been out for 10 years. People that played since the begging have cards. Your 2014 basic starters don’t cut it anymore.

That’s a fair point.

@Shuyin-1330

You don’t lose cards unless you disenchant them. There is this mode called Wild that is the game without rotations.

Yeah, but because the HP/attack balance was completely removed, wild became unplayable for me.

@Shuyin-1330

So basically you want a meta with 2014 Basic Cards and nothing else not even the Classic set.

I for sure wanted to keep the attack/hp balance and have a slower pace of the game. If people don’t like it, they enjoy the game now, fair enough. But let’s not pretend and close eyes on how many millions of players left HS purely for gameplay reasons.

@Shuyin-1330

Blizzard can do that and it will be the new Bot mode.

Fair point. Cuz people who would have enjoyed it already left.

@SparkyElf-2852

However, what’d happen if we’d take this to the absolute? You’d have a bunch of ‘creative’ Priest players, sitting there and thinking their ‘bright’ ideas: ‘Okay, I’ve got 2x Mind Control, 2x Thoughtsteal (the ultimate skill-testing card, by the way), a bunch of powerful Legengaries and removals. My DeCk HaS mOrE vAlUe ThAn YoUrS, yOu CaNnOt PoSsIbLy WiN!’

That’s a fair point.

@SparkyElf-2852

The solution? To just kill those greedy guys before they even get a chance to play their ‘wonderful’ cards.

Not saying aggressive play should be removed or banned. It just was way too much.

@SparkyElf-2852

That’s how this game was in the very beginning — trust me, I’m a Classic connoiseur (probably one of the top ones when the mode was a thing; not so much in 2014, when I was still building up a collection, playing ‘beginner’ decks and so on). If I were to pick one card as the epitome of the original ‘meta’, that’d be Leeroy Jenkins — making a return for the 10-year anniversary, by the way.

‘Everybody knows that the face is the place’. Take a look at this one, you might like it:

Sure, just not for me, personally.

@SparkyElf-2852

In my opinion, on the contrary, the game has been catering too much to casuals, making the impact of strategy and skill insignificant, as opposed to wild ‘RNG’ and so on.

The time I was playing, they were aware of boring and unfun meta decks that were too powerful, and they nerfed the rogue, the only class that was the lowest in the ladder and even arena. Their changes were absurd, they would even buff face hunters. It could be that it was not a powerful deck, but it was annoying for sure. They were buffing annoyances.

[Dracoliche-1924]

@Robert-24922

I played HS since July 2014 up until 2018. Mostly I played casually, the highest rating I have ever got was 8 (that was the way in the past, idk how it works now).

Same here. I could never make it far on the ladder. Always stalled-out in the mids.

@Robert-24922

I loved how I put a minion, and you put a minion, and then I have to decide which of my minions fight yours, should I hit face or try to kill your minions. It was a deck vs deck moment. I had my deck and my idea, you had yours.

Yeah, that was nice. Back then it felt like a game. That I had a chance at winning. And that my decisions mattered.

@Robert-24922

1. Problem 1, no deck interaction.

Absolutely. It’s only gotten worse since you left. These days mages, warlocks and druids will fill their decks with spells. Have total control of the board. And then OTK when they put enough cards together.

There’s nothing to play against. You drop a minion on your turn, and they kill it on their’s. That’s the entire game. It’s anti-fun.

@Robert-24922

2. Complete removal of the standard attack/hp balance.
The way HS was designed at first was that each card had a bit balance. For example, 7 mana would give you a minion with HP and attack near 7, something like 6 attack and 7 defense. But later, this was completely removed, like I saw videos of DH putting 2 12/12 cards in the fourth move, which is 24 attack, and the player has 30 hp only. I loved how minions would have less HP and attack if they had a battlecry or something.

Balance is terrible. “Checkmate” scenarios shouldn’t be happening on turn 4.

@Robert-24922

3. Trying to cater to elitists.
In my opinion, games like HS would be mostly enjoyed by casuals, and I didn’t like how there were clearly unhealthy and OP decks existing

It hasn’t stopped. OP decks don’t get nerfed. But hunters get nerfs because a lot of people are using some of the new cards. Meanwhile, handbuff paladin and handbuff warrior are untouched. Even though their decks are unbeatable.

@Robert-24922

4. Making hearthstone into FIFAstone.
The last nail in the coffin was losing all your cards and progression by the time.

Making some of my cards available to everyone, then taking them away? Why spend money on a game if the cards I get aren’t going to be available months from now? (And there’s no way of knowing which cards they’ll decide to take from me.)

[SparkyElf-2852]

@Robert-24922

Sure, just not for me, personally.

That one was actually a big parody of the face huntard, mocking this particular playing style, which also vexed you, sorry you didn’t get it.

@Robert-24922

they nerfed the rogue, the only class that was the lowest in the ladder

Eh? In what game? Goblen rogue, oil rogue, caverns rogue (which is when I quit) and so on were the bane of the ladder back in the day and probably the reason the term ‘Roguestone’ was coined (dunno when it actually became popular).

[Smokescreen-1847]

@Dracoliche-1924

Same here. I could never make it far on the ladder. Always stalled-out in the mids.

It isn’t really up to you. I reached Legend rank last season and the game is almost entirely RNG. Many games are decided before the 1st card is even drawn. No matter how good your deck, if your opponent draws perfect cards at perfect time, and you don’t, you lose. Period. I’ve had 30% of my deck ready with easy counters to someone’s deck and drew NONE of them. Arena is worse. Someone gets a DK, you get a Priest, you auto lose. Someone gets 4 legendaries in their deck build draws, you get 1 useless one and a deck with no synergy, you lose. On one hand, you might think the game caters to elitists, but it actually allows people who couldn’t win a the game of strategy on their best day to collect welfare wins via RNG.

[DeoGalante-2222]

Far too many people use the “You attacked me wrong” philosophy.