not saying Guff will do nothing, but with still too much boardclear and tutoring to get it asap Druid will remain as they are, as nothign else gained much here.
Edwin is just a plain case of not understanding the card/deck at all - ofc if only one rogue deck is played and he is 1 out of 2 cards to win the game for the Rogue in the deck he is the winningest card.
Now check his stats in any Tier 4-5 Rogue decks and i´d be surprised if it holds true. THis will not change much for miracle but make him barely playable at best in other Rogue decks.
Mage again, this won´t change a thing for dawngrasp without other powerful decks emerging out of thin air. the sweetspot when he starts completely taking over the game is 6dmg, that´s just one ping up on average, and since Brann did not get shown the door Brann+Reckless will still carry mage for the most part.
Location down will be noticable for some magedecks that already had been weaker/off meta, maybe some more mages will tech in polymorph now as additional defense, but it won´t stop the class from dominating all the leftovers, as a 2/2 bannerman will still not valuetrade a skeleton.
Nerf to Starfish had been quite unexpected and mostly uncalled for, also kinda silly to nerf the one counter to massfreeze whilst nerfing Mages freeze.
Nerf to Questhunter is appreciated, if not stricktly needed…also may lead to more mages then before despite the nerfs.
Why the devs don’t be afraid to do necessary nerfs for all classes but for some reason do irrelevant/soft nerfs in druid, the most powerful class in the format? Why druid always evade the must needed nerfs?
the problem for those classes isn´t starfish, it´s druid clearing the board turn 5 onwards, priest deleting the boards from the get go, and mage still freezing every threat for 10turns and onwards till they get removed by stacked up hero powers.
Paladin and Warrior ramp up too slow in threat to go under the removal, unlike implock and aggrodruid can, they are true midrange decks in that sense.
Also they don´t deal dmg from hand to finish the job (yea warri has charge, but that can be blocked with taunts), so unlike hunter or dh it´s not enough for them to just chip 30ish dmg in before the removal overwhelms you. Also Carddraw remains an issue for the classes that don´t overperform atm anyway.
I totally disagree. Mage is in real trouble I think, at least Spook mage is done and BSM does not run Dawngrasp for HP, so I think BSM will be what Standard plays exclusively. So now players can cry about that deck I guess.
What this does do is ruin Ping mage in Wild. It wasn’t OP before and now it’s dead I’m guessing.
i mean those aren´t changes with wild in mind, and i can´t be bothered to think about wild, i´m sorry.
But for Standard it´s still inevitability, and it´s still fast enough - as there´s no buffs here, so nothing will go faster, quite the opposite, Rogue has gotten an easier opponent, also no starfishing the skeletons (or frozen minions) much now.
You´ll still most likly loose to Brann+Denathrius Druid, that will still remain a major part of the meta.
But it´s still close to freewin vs the other classes, and if you really struggle i´d advice teching some mass polymorph in.
I misspoke before.
BSM does not run Dawngrasp just for HP, so it will be around still.
But the class is out of top tiers, trust. I predict tier 4 for both decks.
And yeah Team 5 killed everything in Wild that does not involve their stupid skeletons.
Maybe Secret mage can win once in awhile if the opponent is really bad.
Blizzard missed the mark by printing some powerful Secret synergy cards for Mage and simultaneously printing Vengeful Visage, which might be the worst Mage Secret ever made.
They always do. You wanna play Secrets? Play any secret class but mage.
Wanna’ play HP? Play hunter. it’s a million times better than mage.
Wanna play minions? Way better choices than mage.
How about Pure spells? Priest has that covered way better than mage.
Team 5 hates mage and it is high time they said so.
Mage does not get to be “the best” at anything.
Not draw, not mana, not burn , not disruption, not stall, not spells, etc.
And if it is by some fluke? It gets nerfed to destruction.
the main problem for mage is that their secrets are 3 mana and to benefit from the “synergy” the secret can´t be procced after it´s played, so you sink 3mana to hopefully do nothing as a prerequisit. And even then it´s iffy as mage has few secrets that are “hard” to procc for their opponents if they have anything on the board.
So the only good options to reliably get the synergy is reducing secret costs to 0 or playing paladin secrets most of the time, whjich is already a 3card setup for a mediocre payoff in a deck with really limited draw.
it´s just bad design all around, and to top it of a simple silence deletes the 4mana payoff legendary for the deck.
Meanwhile; other classes have cards that play their secrets for them,
or; play random secrets for free.
Mage doesn’t even get to have exclusive secrets anymore.
OMY is just as effective as CS and cheaper to boot. So is Ice Trap.
Guff will be quite slower, though. As 1 Mana difference can make or brake a card, getting empty crystals is quite a showstopper for him.
All in all, these ARE changes - o/c not enough for the pitchfork crowd, but meh. The devs pointed out that they want to see the results before going (potentially) further, so it’s no wonder they left the nerf hammer in the closet and swung a plexor instead.
the main problem playing against druid is not how fast they reach past 7mana, but how fastthey are on 6+ and start clearing boards. And the Guff nerfs donßt address that at all.
Sure, druid will struggle a tad more with just 2-3mana advantage over you, but ultimately if you can´t otk them they will otk you, as they did not get nerfed at all in their consistency nor defense.
And as the Kael´thas OTK is out of the game for all classes, with any luck Druid winrate will go up from here.
Kael´thas / Bran, you mean, yes? Apart from Druid and (sometimes) DH, was it ever tried with Rogue and his coin shenanigans, or would that make no sense whatsoever?
I disagree here – Edwin was a fine and playable card in many Rogue decks at 4 mana. I think Rogue was undeveloped and just barely found traction before the 3 mana buff happened, and as a result, I think Rogue is still fine with a 4 mana Edwin.
It’s important to note that Ramp Druids were running Starfish to curb the impact of freezes and token druid, so nerfing it DOES limit their counterplay on certain turns (like on curve against Token Druid); there is potential that Ramp Druid cuts 1 copy or cuts starfish entirely. Am I optimistic here? No – so yes, it’s still possible that the nerf isn’t particularly meaningful.
All in all, I think Blizzard went about the nerfs here in a manner that appears to have been “what are people complaining about? Make it cost 1 more mana.” The Magister nerf I’m unclear if it’s significant enough or not. 1 Wildfire still puts the hero power to 4 damage off the bat, so it still transitions to its endgame at the same point. It is possible though that slowing down the damage scaling by a turn is enough to buy time for some slower decks. We have to wait and see – I’m actually kind of okay with where Mage appears to be besides the fact that BSM is still a thing and it is the stupidest attempt at a minion-centric Mage deck I’ve ever seen.
wouldn´t fit in at all, too expensive and you don´t have many minions dying.
but i´ve seen it in all sorts of experimental decks for the struggling classes, or off meta decks for the successful classes as it had been a very easy to fit in 3card otk wincon for any deck that played some minions.
unfortunately also the only wincon for most classes with the amount of boardclear/stall the dominating classes have.
Something else about the patch, I noticed when logging in that Dawngrasp was highlighted in green (normally denoting a buff), while Nightcloak Sanctum didn’t have a color marker at all.
Hm, almost got TTK’d by a Maestra Rogue. He got an early Fireball in (from the tooth) and put up Azsharan Vessel, then Mr. Smite and 2 x Sunken Vessel.
Maybe, just maybe the meta will slow down enough with the Druid/Mage/QHunter nerfs to allow Rogue a bit more wiggle room outside of high Legend?
yes the nerfs are BS because mage haters but lets be honest the mage is far from dead.
also people could try and make custom mage decks in wild and blast people in an unexpected way and will prolly have no ways of countering it either.
