There are many broken cards and decks in this game, indeed. But this is another issue.
Your starting hand is not your decision, it’s given by the algorithm.
You can mulligan, but the replacement is also decided by the algorithm.
You have mostly no influence on what card you draw.
Opponent class and deck is given by the algorithm.
And you are dead on turn 4 without having made any decision in the game.
Skill issue? 
Well, you likely choose what order to use your cards. In modern HS, it’s usually super obvious because decks play themselves. There’s usually only 1 or 2 turns where your choices matter, and yeah, sometimes they never do. There’s a severe lack of skill in modern HS, but I wouldn’t say it’s 0.
This scenario is an outlier, not the average outcome. This is like judging a Texas Hold ‘em player on winning a big hand by rivering a one outer and ignoring every other hand they won.
So are they heavily reliant on RNG or are they cards that consistently offer great options? These arguments are at odds with one another so I need to understand which side you’re on.
You’ve got to understand that discovering a card isn’t generating something utterly random out of thin air. You put discover cards in your deck intentionally to give yourself access to more tools to win the game. Let’s say we’re facing down a huge Rogue Mech and we play a School Teacher as a DK. There are 24 options (btw this pool is close to the median size now we are post-rotation) and you get 3 rolls - 12.5% to hit any given card. Obliterate or Asphyxiate can deal with the problem immediately (23.4% to hit at least one of these, which is already pretty good). Icy Touch or Howling Blast save you/your board from damage for an extra turn (a further 2 chances to hit either of these). Already we are 41.34% to either kill outright or freeze the minion. If we have a board, finding Unholy Frenzy may also be enough to clear with the additional 5 damage from the Teacher+Nagaling. Add that to the mix and our shot of hitting an acceptable answer is 48.7%. Maybe our board is great and we just need to find a bit of extra damage if we trade some or all of our board in (Heart Strike, Plague Strike, Frost Strike, Down With the Ship, Dark Transformation, Anti-Magic Shell, Glacial Advance). If any of the above are also an acceptable answer, we are 79.9% to clear or freeze the minion. All this is to also assume we absolutely NEED to stop the minion this turn, which is not necessarily the case. We can also find Defrost or Northern Navigation to look for something to do next turn or Runes of Darkness to look for Might of Menethil or Corrupted Ashbringer to stall out for a counter lethal. There are so many more potential plays than “discover the best card or lose” in a lot of situations and understanding what to pick when you are offered marginal options is, of course, a skill.
Notice also how the better position we are in with regards to board state (which we can potentially achieve through a good mulligan and trading in the early game), the greater our chances to discover a card that will get the job done. There is so much nuance to Discover cards that make them much more complex than they appear. And I get it, sometimes the Priest just hits a discounted Whirpool off of Nerubian Vizier and you’re sad, but this is a fringe case, not the average outcome.
THat’s the problem.
You can just make up what you need out of thin air.
Keep telling yourself this and keep being wrong.
You aren’t making a distinction between adding a couple of class cards and making a deck that discovers two or three more decks.
knowing the “out” exists in game, and knowing you can possibly generate the perfect “out” IS the skill.
if you don’t know you what you need, you are just floundering. you can win that way, but you won’t understand why, and won’t be able to identify the skill involved.
I consider that basic game knowledge, though, not skill. There’s nothing big brained about it yet people consistently come here and act like thief or copy decks are the pinnacle of intellectual rigor.
It’s ridiculous.
fair, but some people don’t even bother to have that knowledge. then they yell on here in astonishment that the card even exists. some of this comes from the desire to “main” a class. if you don’t play the other classes some things seem to be unfair/lucky perpetually.
i see what you’re saying. i think it has more to do with your desire of how decks should play, than a debate about skill here. you obviously see the skill in decision making. you just don’t like the idea that you can do it for no drawback. unless i’m missing something. i’m not trying to put words in your mouth.
I mean, I don’t like that, but I don’t like the idea that it removes the thoughtfulness from deck choices, too. Planning a balance between draw, removal, tech options, attack, etc. is why you build decks.
If none of that matters because you can just swiss army knife the outs in the match up, you can overload other aspects of the deck. DK is a really good example of using the discover like multiple copies of Zephrys because the pool is so tight. It’s super rare to totally whiff with discover in DK.
ahhh, that is a fair viewpoint. i don’t build decks. i’ve tried and i’m not good at it. was my greatest weakness when i played MTG. i respect it as a skill. but since it isn’t one i’m good at, i’m blind to the effects these cards have in that arena.
i see the problem here, but time is the only fix. because DK still doesn’t have a full compliment of cards. the whiffs aren’t built in yet.
i don’t consider thought and skill the same thing. so making choices to me is different than for example hitting combos on a fighting game. that would require skill.
No ,it’s not rocket science but people have that glorified vision of skill when in reality even the basic daily stuff is in fact a skill.
And about discover i not even saying that you or anyone not understand the basics.
But that maybe there are people who just pick better.
Have you been out in society today? I’m convinced the vast majority of humans taking up space on the planet lack any of these two abilities.
In the same vein i watch players make fundamentally bad plays all the time in game and i am not even looking at their hand. However i am constantly hand tracking opponents.
It’s amazing how badly players mismanage their resources in todays game. I blame it mostly on the cheap efficient card draw we have now. Players just vomit their hand and reload. Sometimes this works but it’s not an effective way of playing the game.
sKiLL iZ mAsH bUtToN fAsT
(Kinda kidding, I’ve played fighting games, but the greats in that genre don’t win with execution alone)
If someone gave me a cent for each time I have won a game against a control player thanks to them playing Dirty Rat on 2 I’d be a millionnaire by now. Just today a warrior dropped my Eonar on turn 2 and allowed me to fill my hand on turn 3. They didn’t even have a removal prepared for the next turn so my Eonar just sat there. It’s crazy how much people missplay just this card alone.
In another thread I was talking about how counterintuitive skill makes veteran players feel really smart. The classic example: you have the mana to play a minion, but you realize that the correct play is to not play anything because you don’t want to be too vulnerable to a board clear. It’s a very rewarding decision to have decide a game… for the skilled player. If you don’t have any skill or discipline it feels bad to hold back and not play a minion when you could.
When I look at the almost bottomless well of value that aggro decks get these days, it feels as if Blizzard is deliberately designing to the lowest common denominator, as if “don’t think just vomit” is being deliberately promoted. I imagine that Blizzard is responding to feedback that playing around board clears feels bad, and I readily admit that it is counterintuitive. But if I’m going to be honest I think people who play bad SHOULD feel bad and Blizzard is 100% in the wrong for catering to them. If you want to have a successful “forever” game at least have the decency to design for veteran players who have been here “forever.”
Another example of a card that’ll probably be rotated out because it “feels bad.” By which I mean low skill pilot can’t play it properly but it’s in the netdeck so they include it anyway.
(Just to be clear, it’s not that I’m anti-netdecking, I’m just anti-bad-piloting. It’s in the netdeck for good reason.)
I just dont have the mental bandwidth nor vocabulary to adequately reply to this. But I will say that everyone is entitled to being very public with their unpopular opinion, once. It doesn’t mean that if its a wrong one that it should be forgiven. Just saying everyone is going to go thru this stage in their life.