if we could see the source code we would know it … a manipulation is definitely possible … Zephyrs shows there are methods for it … from the game design it is also conceivable … these methods would then be viewed as flavoring …
Zephiris shows it would be incredibly hard.
He only give basic and classic cards and yet there are some situation he doesn’t give the good card
Did not say rigged, as that would imply favoritism which isn’t true. I just don’t believe it’s random
Why wouldn’t it be ?
Randomness is really easy to implement in a game. (far easier than any other system).
Why would they use a non-random system if they are not favoring a part of the players ?
Just because you had bad luck, it means, game is rigged.
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Of course the RNG is manipulated, but I don’t recall Blizzard every stating that it was totally random to start with. It’s their game. They can rig whatever they deem to increase profits. What’s the problem? Anyone supporting the game by buying pack obviously condones the behavior. Those who don’t haven’t got a stake so what’s the gripe again?
It is more than sufficiently random. Yours truly, a computer programmer.
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You wouldn’t be able to (and shouldn’t!) trust blizzards stats anyway if they gave it to you.
The data from third party stats that we have is sufficient to prove it and it has worked for the community before in proving bugs (which can have the same outcome as something intentional) that blizzard acknowledged afterwards.
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The fact that a computer can be “sufficiently” random seems to dominate the discussion… I’m saying that computers can be programmed to do whatever we want. People here seem to believe that there are some magic physical cards inside a little machine and that machine then randomly throws them at you as the game is played.
Let’s not argue the semantics of the word “random” anymore and just focus on the fact that there are other people on here who may believe that weighting, in otherwords “rigging” to those that don’t differentiate them, isn’t the random card play they had in mind.
Personally, I’m okay with it.
Sure they can. The issue is whether or not we have enough evidence that suggests the matchmaking/card draw/random effects of the game are in fact random/pseudo-random or not. And we don’t have any reliable evidence to suggest the system is rigged in any way. That something is possible doesn’t mean it’s probable, and bringing up possibilities unsupported by evidence seems, at best, disingenuous.
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While I understand what you are saying and I agree that a lack of evidence in any direction is an issue, I still don’t believe that people shouldn’t be able to have conversations regarding what they’ve experienced. If those conversations are truthful and hopefully meaningful then who knows what can be discovered.
The issue I’ve taken in this entire thread is that there are some who come in with an open mind while others seem to feel it is there duty to shut down the convo. The easiest way to get rid of a thread you don’t like is to not participate in it, right? Any press is good press and all that hype.
I’m good with the results of whatever decision making process the game chooses to use. I just know that it’s not as simple as a roll of the dice.
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No poster on these forums has the power to stop people from talking about their experiences. Challenging people’s interpretation of those experiences is not the same as preventing them from sharing them.
Sounds like you’re letting your own biases color the way you perceive the situation. Which, you know, it’s what people do, so whatever. But your “issue” could very well be interpreted by less charitable readers as a parade of vague assertions that allow you to question the validity of the game’s RNG systems without providing sufficient detail for someone to actually attempt to debunk your argument. Case in point:
You’re suggesting there’s something besides RNG at play here. What is that something? How does it operate? What is its purpose? Where is the evidence for it? Your statement is vague enough that it cannot be practically deconstructed, but nevertheless suggests that there is something potentially unfair (or at least, non-random) about the way the game’s card draw system works.
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I try to keep my posts short. Mostly because giant walls of text are boring to read and most people don’t go past the first paragraph. So if stuff is missing that you want to know then please feel free to ask. But we agree that there is no real info to share beyond what everyone experiences.
As for my theory on how things are weighted. Beyond the examples I mentioned already I haven’t given it much thought.
Challenging an interpretation doesn’t include anything that a previous poster decided to contribute. Honestly I played along with them for too long and it derailed a joke thread into some kind of debate on the meaning of words and whether or not anyone needs proof of manipulation in the game to discuss it.
If I came across as arrogant, I apologize as it wasn’t intentional.
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You are the only one believing in magic here my guy. Just because you were around when the first computer was invented, doesn’t make you an expert on them.
No one is doubting rigging is possible, they are more than likely arguing how improbable it is instead. Lets use Zephyrs as an example of this. Since its apparently some "gotcha’ card for you tin-foil people.
Zephyrs has been consistently getting updates since its release and is arguably performing worse since the release he was first designed in. Watch some streamers play him and you’ll start to see they cant manipulate him to get the card they want, or that its a very low chance to get certain cards. I would feel confident betting that the developers regret making him and can’t wait until he rotates out of standard.
THATS ONE CARD. Look at all the patch notes just concerning zephyrs’ algorithm, imagine how wonky the game would be if it all ran on something like that. Imagine all the time , money, and energy it would take to upkeep this “rigging” algorithm. This isnt even taking into account the blowback if this was discovered, and that it provides little or no benefit to them… Hmmm
Literally a small amount of hours setting up a variably complex randomization system for your game.
OR
Implement a complex & expensive algorithmn that requires constant developer attention, that provides no real benefit and would be a PR nightmare if discovered.
Yes it is rigged, I think they do it to keep the games competitive. As a warlock I’ve just had 5 games in a row where my soulfire has discarded my other soulfire with a full hand on a kill turn. It’s extremely frustrating, and I’m going to start recording soon.
It can also swing in your favour to be fair, as I’ve had an opponent with a full board of high value minions only for me to receive Veranus (reduce all enemies to 1 hp) and Dragonmaw Scorcher (do 1 damage to all minions) from Red Alex to finish them.
So you keep playing a game you think is rigged for years? That is the definition of insanity.
i didn’t say it was rigged. I believe it is impartial to players. But I do not believe it’s random. Think what you like regarding my lucidity,
IF RNG is impartial to players that is the definition of rigged. What the eff are you talking about?
You dove way too far down a philosophical and ephemeral trail you are obviously not equipped well enough to travel alone.
Battling logic by calling it illogical and then posting your skewed perspective of a non-logical concept founded on a premise that can only be understood from a given perspective at a given time?
Then you add a ridiculous scenario to further illustrate your point (you seem intelligent enough to understand what a logical fallacy is), as though that gained you traction in an already traction-less situation…
As an ironically inconsequential character to this entire topic once said… “Incontheivable!” -some Sicilian
And you continued to drag this conversation out? As an FYI, the card shufflers can read every card. The act of random is only by trust, as with any asked for random generation of a value by a program given a virtual fence to operate within.
It’s a fixed random generation. Mankind has not evolved to a point to create something smarter than mankind; and mankind cannot create outside of the boundaries of limitations man has put themselves in: Therefore it is safe to assume that even in a game as simple as HS, the RNG factor can only be assumed to be, at the very best, partially Random with a fixed set of variables happening more frequently than others.
How about you spend time doing research and posting data instead of opinions?
Honestly, it’s terrible how you ended it; essentially rendering your entire previous set of comments as a collective waste of time. Perhaps you were just trolling - and congrats if you were 
A random anything generator can only create a random number based on a fixed range of variables to choose from. We don’t have the computer power today, nor do most people have the brain power to imagine something they do not understand.
All this being said, I don’t care if the game is purely random within its fixed limits or not, but I can say with 100% accuracy is there is no program that I’m aware of that can create random; I can also say most people are ignorant on such amazing levels (to assume they are not, for starters) that they believe there is a such thing as random.
Even a more modern approach to science can only explain random as ‘unexpected outcome’ because of our limitations of understanding of what we do have.
At any rate, I truly digress - that amount of ridiculousness in your posts simply inspired me to compose this. You’re welcome for these 6 minutes of my life. Thanks!
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I’ve always believed they weight the pull rate of popular meta cards downward forcing most to craft them.