It wasn’t directed at me so no, I wasn’t insulted. We can pretend you meant it kindly if you like.
That might be your interpretation its not what i said, theres therapy for beeing delusional. A fool you cant help…especially when its like worlds #1 fool
That’s not true, you can educate a fool.
Yeah seems to work perfectly. Sigh what i did there.
Not really… look I’m not here to bully you so I’ll leave it there.
I dont feel bullied at all, friend. Peace out.
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Then the discussion is ended, because you will never ever get the data you claim necessary as Blizzard will never publish them.
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What’s up with you people and not understanding statistics?
The statistics example shown in this post is over simplified, and does not represent the evaluating of “rigging” well enough.
I do not know about the level of rigging others talk about, but, for me, match making is rigging with such a small margin that is barely noticable. Match making algorithm tries to force you 50% win rate unnaturally, or perhaps 49.8%. By “naturally”, I mean and I know that in the uncontrolled sampling space, players fighting with the same skill level will eventually have the 50% win rate in the long term, but the match making system is trying to make you have 50% win rate in the short term.
I do not have data to support this. It is a belief, but trust me, I do understand statistics and algorithm. Blizzard could also be more helpful by being more transparent, starting with the display of opponent’s level.
Do you think why they would not do that ? Any good reason ?
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It’s doing a mighty terrible job at it, these wins free af 
Which then there’s no point implementing over any other MMR system that already sorts players to 50% by itself.
And also would be wholly unfruitful unless the player in question played literally hundreds of games per month.
Either the matchmaker is statistically significant, and then useful, or statistically irrelevant, and then a waste of money that will affect the smallest fraction of players possible for dubious rewards.
If you really did, you would not imply we needed Blizzard’z data to prove dubious effects, lmao. We didn’t need matchmaking data to prove natpagle was working wrong, and we have data aggregators with hundreds of thousands of game matches.
What do they stand to gain? There’s no inherent gain to getting everyone at exactly 50% all the time, there’s no inherent gain at implementing a matchmaker that sorts through data and match players to move fractions of a percentage point, other than slowing down matching time, and an MMR SYSTEM ALREADY DOES THAT! without the magic code that sorts my enemies, deck, and somehow decides which cards would be better or worse to guide me to 50% winrate! It’s literally pointless!
Did you miss the whole rest of the thread?
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I mean why they would not be more transparent by showing the level of opponent.
With the amount of data you have, which one represent that the match making is not rigging at all ? Show me please. Except win rate and the card frequency, which data do you have ? How do you transform them into such conclusion ? Which data model and analysis tools do you use ?
Why no point ? How long do you players play Hearthstone per session in average ? You are good with statistics then you should know. The play time is short. That is why Blizzard are motivated to urge players to feel the necessity of improving their decks during that time, which results in buying more packs.
No rigging in RNG games LUL … Have you ever been to casinos ?
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Rigged in what way? We know Decks face the average distribution of decks at their ranks, so any preferencial matchup for classes is out of the water.
There’s no point in making a matchmaker that alter the Winrate in tiny amounts because most players don’t play a hundred or more games per session. And even if they did, they don’t care if they lose 2-3 games more because of it. Any player interested in tracking such stats would attribute it to variance, and change nothing
The vast majority of players will not spend anyway, since they are F2P. The spending players, though, most likely have no way of improving their decks because they already have the cards that they need.
But most importantly, in your made up world, people play more by losing constantly. That’s only in your made up world. Most people in a situation of frequent or unfair losses quit.
Argue with what I said.
Ok. I will explain what I think one last time.
Match making system is supposed to find an opponent with the same skill level as the current player regardless of win/lose history, right ?
If I am currently on Diamond 5, match making should find me someone randomly from Diamond 5 to match me. If there is none, then it looks up in the closest rank which is Diamond 4 or 6, and repeats, because all players are on rank system, not MMR score like DOTA 2. If the match making system does exactly like this, I would call it fair.
However, match making system does look up on the current player win/lose history and use this information into calculation. This is rigging. For examples (no evidence), if you have won streak against player A, B, C, the system will likely to match you with someone who has beaten A, B, C in the past too as it deems that both might have the same level of skill. This is not random, and when it is not random from the same rank, it is called rigging.
Have you ever wondered why match making take so long time sometimes ?
The number of concurrent active Hearthstone players is approximately 60,000 persons. Compared to financial transactions in banking, this number is very small. Servers nowsaday can handle much more concurrent executions in one second. In addition, 60,000 players are divided into so many modes. In standard mode, the number should be even lower. Finding an opponent based on rank should take only few seconds. Actually, it may even take less than one second.
I still dounbt if the distribution is fully unbiased. In a large pool of matches, difference in 0.1% might matter, but when you skim by eyes, you might think it is indifferent. As I mentioned earlier, the rigging is not harsh, and maybe hard to notice.
I have no evidence on my claim as I deem the data provide is not enough. If only Blizzard display the rank of opponent on the screen, which now has plenty of space beside, below, above, the username, it would be more transparent. The debate about this issue might be over. I may be wrong.
However, for years, Blizzard chooses not to show such information. Why is that ?
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That’s not how it works. Matchmaking only matches you by ranking when you have bonus stars or are in legend. Everywhere elde is by MMR
Um, that’s backwards. It’s by rank UNLESS you’re in Legend or on a winstreak.
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By stars I thought, and MMR when you’re out of stars or at legend. Someone’s going to have to dig up the quote again!
Logically, a player would be matched by rank only if they have not accumulated any star bonus or if they have reached a rank at which their star bonus has dissipated, because in these instances, they are playing at their true rank. I believe this is how it works. As soon as a player reaches a rank at which they are awarded 1 star per win, they are matched with opponents of the same rank (this is unaffected by win streak bonus as far as I know, which is different to star bonus). If a player is awarded any more than one star per win, or is in the Legend ranks, they are matched by MMR.
For example, right now I have x11 star bonus and I haven’t played a ranked game this season. When I start playing, I am far more likely to be matched with players in Diamond/X000 Legend than other players in Bronze, because there are unlikely to be many players left in Bronze-Platinum in my MMR bracket.
If I had 0 star bonus, I would be matched against other Bronze players until hitting Silver, then I would be matched against Silver players etc.
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I was confusing the concepts of winstreak and star bonus. MoonUnit’s post is on point.
Because people with star bonuses are matched by MMR and not rank, and at the start of the month you could be at Bronze 10 not having played any games and get queued up against the exact same Diamond player you played the day before the reset, except they stayed up all night getting their rank back.
Without the fake monthly “progression” they could display ranks.