HoF baku and genn solves nothing


#29

Go play wild and tell me how many genn or baku decks are dominating it. Because I don’t find it dominated by those decks at all. They’re strong sure but not the most insane thing out there. Even shaman see’s some play there and I see a very strong version of odd paladin there but really that’s about it. odd mage is kinda just a weaker reno mage or secret tempo mage deck in wild. Genn and baku aren’t going to take over wild without some extremely good cards accidentally bumping up existing synergies getting printed.


#30

What?

The top 4 decks in wild, per VS:

Odd Rogue
Even Shaman
Odd Paladin
Even Warlock

This was before the nerfs but still…they are clearly relevant and are still doing very strong.


#31

I don’t know what to tell you but I find that hard to believe I have a much harder time with various demon cube, reno, pirate rogue, secret tempo mage etc. the odd paladin deck I think is solid but I really don’t find even shaman in wild to be that hard to fight off since the nerfs. Odd rogue to me kinda sucks in either format anyway. I have not run into and an even lock in wild that wasn’t just mecha’thun and there’s plenty of strong aggro decks in wild to offset that.


#32

Ehh… some were nerfed into oblivion in a similar fashion, to get rid of them. Small-Time Buccaneer was probably the last card nuked for pure power and done so to the point of no return… potentially Giggling Inventor but I think that was less about power and more about how common it was.


#33

That was before the nerfs though…

1/2 were nerfed (Even Shaman, Baku Rogue).
Odd Paladin is a REALLY rare sight in Wild and I leveled all the way to r3 last month from r15 and saw maybe 3, heh.

I think you’ll see the tier 1 in Wild now be:
Kingsbane Aggro Rogue
Even Warlock
Cubelock
Even Shaman
Control Priest

That is my guess based on HSR and what I am seeing.


(August Dean Ayala) #34

Wild hasn’t recently been dominated by those cards, at least post nerfs. Even Shaman and Odd Rogue were two of the most consistent Wild decks and both were taken down a bit by the changes to Flametongue and Cold Blood.

For now, we want to check out what perception and data looks like post expansion launch and see where the Wild meta lands.


#35

Thats fine, I’m happy to play the “wait and see” game for Baku & Genn, but what about Barnes? Any update you could provide in that regard?

I understand your reasoning for Big Priest to exist, but as per your recent interview on Value Town, you are also aware the deck can function just fine w/o Barnes in the mix, so why so much resistance to change one of the most complained about cards in the format?

Remove the high/low roll factor from BP and its a much more tolerable deck to face. Especially when the highroll happens so early in the game.


#38

Problem with baku and genn is that they only get stronger as new cards get released. We had 3 expansions with them and they were found problematic while T5 was carefull about the cards that got released and while T5 even made nerfs to mana cost having in thought of these 2 cards.

Now that T5 wont care about them anymore imagine what sort of decks will be created in wild mode. I give the baku and genn bomb almost 1 to 1.5 year time to explode. But i guess its wild so who cares? I mean Barnes (which is even worst design) has escaped all the nerfs.
Another lazy solution from our favourite designers thinking of the ‘‘now’’ and not of the ‘‘tomorrow’’.


#39

Except Genn and Baku do literally nothing in the Wild format. In fact they are really bad cards to play in that format.


#40

Bowser is the police.

I click the Blizz tracker and it jumps to him.

He’s undercover so hide your stuff.


#41

That isn’t necessarily true. While Genn/Baku get access to more card they might also have a higher (or similar to now) opportunity cost with foregoing synergy cards.

As long as the cost remains roughly equal to what it is now they’ll be part of the meta but not the dominant part of it. My hope is they can be part of the meta of Wild as I think when they’re ‘uncommon’ they are not detrimental to gameplay but they are another option.

Genn has two strong decks in Even Shaman (still) and Even Warlock. Baku has a few good options in Baku Warrior and Baku Rogue (still) but, interestingly enough, Genn has been the overall bigger issue in Wild and Baku in Standard.


#42

Time will tell but i wouldnt bet my money on this…


#43

I wouldn’t either in all honesty. Eventually the dev team will either forget about Genn/Baku, not foresee the possibility, or not care and Wild will (hopefully) force another revisit of Genn/Baku.


#44

You guys are doing great job with the last couple of patches and nerfs! I hope this trend continues and we see some “new blood” in the HS modes too, like having constantly changeable meta with weekly buffs/bans to certain cards or ultra fast time modes where I don’t have to do something else besides playing HS because my opponent is a new player or is just feeding his cat in between. Anyway, keep up the good work, we are looking forward!


#45

Must be why the guy that decimated the field in the wild tournament never played Genn.


#46

I have personally found Genn to be the stronger card in standard as well, with paladin, shaman and warlock typically out performing paladin, rogue and warrior, at least in my experience.

Baku has a much flashier effect, which explains why people would rate it very highly, but Genn has access to stronger mana costs and generally allows you to play complete decks while making them more consistent.


#47

Yeah right… Even Warlock, Odd Paladin, Even Shaman are very weak decks for a while now… Come on…


#48

There are a lot of good decks in Wild and I never said Genn decks were the best, did I?

The only class where I feel Genn (or Baku) is the top choice by far is Shaman because Even Shaman is still very strong. Because of HS’ format in tournaments I wouldn’t necessarily look only at the winning player but also at the frequency in the top-8. The biggest surprise to me is the frequency of Odd Paladin because in Wild ladder I feel Odd Paladin is fairly rare compared to, honestly, even ACH Paladin.

Also really surprised at how few Aggro Kingsbane Rogues there were o.O


#49

_

Oh, please spare me. Odd Paladin is a shadow of it’s old self ever since Level Up was nerfed, and basically it’s a free win if you’re playing Warlock, because Defile and Hellfire make those decks a non issue. Just for the hell of it, I put in a Corrupting Mist and a Demonflame for the hell of it. People seem to forget that Odd Paladin has almost no card draw and has to rely too much on Divine Favor.

Evenlock is strong because it’s basically a well rounded Midrange-Control deck with multiple survival tactics, although some deck ideas are pathetic. (Seriously, why the hell are you guys playing Wrathguard? I don’t give a damn if he’s a Spellstone activator, I don’t want to lose the damn game off of a Shield Slam, and I REALLY don’t want Gul’dan bringing him back. Ever since he was made in the Grand Tournament, I have always thought he was one of the worst cards ever made.)

Even Shaman has the same problems as Odd Paladin - it’s atrocious card draw, and it’s lack of board clears. (More than likely intentional.) It runs out of steam against a deck that can match it’s tempo and stall the game out, and it’s super easy to Defile one of their boards when they roll a Searing Totem.

You just have to figure out the weaknesses of each deck, that’s how you climb in Wild.


#50

In Standard I’d agree with you on Even Shaman’s issue with Defile but in Wild… it isn’t nearly the same issue. By the time Hellfire is ‘online’ and Defile is deadly I should be dropping minions that are outside of Hellfire range and not easy for Defile to climb with whether I am using the Jade package (Totem Carver) or the OL package (FGD) [both tend to run FwF].

Even Shaman is still VERY strong so I wouldn’t write it off/treat it as a deck to dismiss. It isn’t it’s former self in Wild (and Standard) but it is still a very good deck that increases it’s threats rapidly turns 1-6. Even Shaman i probably the top of tier-2/bottom of tier-1 in power right now.

I fully agree on your assessment of Even Warlock. I don’t understand Wrathguards at all and the deck is very strong because a string of 4/8+ and 8/8s + 7/7s are tough for any deck to deal with that needs board (basically all but Secret Burn Mage).