Class Identification PALADIN, Libram

Some time ago some people released Class identification.
here link https://playhearthstone.com/en-us/news/23014810
Today let’s review Paladin. Tomorrow maybe another super balanced class.

Paladin: Paladins are great champions who support their minions with buffs, healing, and divine shields; however, they are not afraid to get their hands dirty when the time comes. They are methodical, controlling the battlefield through debuffs and focused attacks instead of destructive spells. Strength and persistence are the keys to a Paladin’s victory.

  • Strengths: Minion swarms, minion buffs and debuffs, healing, Divine Shield, Secrets
    *** Limitations: Cost reduction**
    *** Weaknesses : Direct damage spells, destroying big minions**

Well as you can see Paladin was not good enough so why not remove their limitation by giving them Libram and when we are at it let’s remove their weakness by giving them card to Obliterate Big minions and clear board.

NOW you have it, you know why Paladin is SUPER balanced, some people did it again.
[sarcasm on] They care about their class identification so much! [sarcasm off]

NEXT time on the show Tickatus and Warlock.

Some people Use Libroom why are they not banned?


Edited for Language by the Moderation Team.
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the only cost reduction available are Librams, so it is true: it’s a limitation.

what card is it?
Lord barow? libram of justice?

Weakness means “bad at doing somethig”, not “impossible to do in an circumstance”.
The weakness is still present, and that’s why paladin usually rely on having minion on boards, unlike warrior.
A paladin with an empty board can’t deal with a board of 8/8 for multiple turns; maybe for 1-2 turns, but not in an efficient and consistent way.

Can’t wait to see it :slight_smile: (for real, I like this post, I found it very instructive)

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You’re right but the main issue or at least from OP’s pov is that every paladins are playing the libram package meaning that the whole cost reduction and removal weakness is some next level BS, at least in this current meta.

Granted I don’t think anyone should be taking that article seriously, it’s clearly outdated in many ways

I think the biggest restriction that holds Paladin back is lack of card draw.

Not having anywhere close to the same level of card draw as many other classes is a big check on Paladin.

While here, I might mention that many other classes have deviated from ‘class identity’ for some time now.

Imagine you would give Priest a 4-6 taunt minion draw 2 cards.
As Said previously, since the Basic set changes, Priest has as good as no card draw.

Cost reduction should not be so overwhelming in the Paladin set.

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Pure Paladin has the best curve I’ve seen in a deck in awhile. Granted I’m a filthy casual but I rarely play against a paladin and they don’t have at least a 2/4 on the board by turn 2 or lowering the cost of librams along with getting a 1/3 on turn 1. Or sometimes having a 4/6 by turn 3 along with drawing a card and giving a +1/+1 card back to their hand with deathrattle. I haven’t seen a paladin with a “bad” mulligan since this expansion started.

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Then why does Druid not have any means to destroy big minions anymore? Literally no such spells in Standard, no poisonous minions for the class, nothing.

And why does the class not receive board clears, also listed as its weakness?

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Warlock used be weakness used be healing no they can gain back health like priest with all soul card they have. So paladin not the only one.

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Paladins weakness is that its tier 1 decks are the dullest thing I’ve ever encountered in Hearthstone.

I took pure Paladin to Legend in scholomance and I still refuse to play the deck anymore cause it is just so boring.

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The class identification thing is entirely pointless. You can’t maintain such strict design rules for each class. Especially when the classic/basic cards already counter those rules.

Paladin can’t deal with big threats? That’s not true. Aldor Peacekeeper is a thing. So is Equality and Consecration.

Even without Librams/Barov they have Subdue.

They really should just remove the whole “this class can’t do this thing well” part. Because I was killed by a Priest who is “weak with draw” on turn 7 with C’thun.

I am OK with using Neutral card to try to overcome your limitations. There is no need to make an expansion based on card that overcome your limitation. Let them use neutral cards.
Or why do you think Libram is so good on pure paladin.

probably because it’s a weakness, so it isn’t supposed to have ever green board clears at any time.
The same is true for paladin: I am not playing librams and I have 0 mana cost reductions, 0 board clears (only consacration because I don’t have barov), and I kill big minions only by debuffing them or by buffing my minions.

“weakness” means (imo): you won’t be able to build your deck around this mechanic, but sometimes we may release some cards that can do it in a very specific way.

So in the future, we may see a board clear for druid, but this doesn’t mean control druid will be an archetype (maybe yes, maybe no).
Druid already has swipe and the 5 mana spell, which confirms “weakness” doesn’t mean “0 cards”

Point is devs don’t release new cards for Druid to fit your definition of “weakness”. Nor do they give the Mage class healing tools, which is also their weakness.

But Paladin got insane tools that cover up its supposed weaknesses. Ability to destroy giant minions and cost reductions on cards.

Imagine if Druid got spells that one-tap your huge minions and clears that actually nuked the board? Or if Mage’s class Reno was again the full healing one? Or they got damage spells with lifesteal? Lmao.

I mean:
Look at Shaman: Weakness card draw.
They introduce cagematch custodian, that give card draw and draw the win condition of your deck.

Then they wonder, it is out of control. I mean really? what do you expect?

I am not asking for nerf, I just wish the DEV would pay more attention to what they are doing. Better release few cards that are balanced than releasing 20000 cards, that are not even well thought and that Fix class weaknesses and limitation to an aberrant degree.

Well, if you want to stretch it, you could randomly get poisonous beast from partner assignment ;p

Well, it’s not like pallies received a lot either. Libram of justice is basically it, and it usually replaces equality, so they not really a net gain.

That’s why pallies have the libroom variant if they need the extra clears (druids should know broom since they are probably the 2nd class after pallies being able to use broom well). And that’s another thing: rush. Druids did get some rush support in guardian and runic carvings that can serve a similar function as AoE.

If you don’t want to touch rush, a less conventional thing to do is beef up your existing clears (yea, swipe and starfall basically) with solar eclipse. Pairing eclipse with single target spells may also give you enough to take out a big minion as well.

My gut feeling is that spell druid is getting really close to do something interesting, depending on how much support they get next expansion. If they can generate cheap spells/do spell spam better, pyromancer could become an option.

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Paladin got Libram of Justice (too cheap even for 5 mana, gee and its cost goes down, how neat) and Barov, back to back, as if the devs forgot what they did to Equality and why.

Druid’s most recent, roundabout, version of “board clear” was GA and devs promptly butchered it into unplayability.

Why is Paladin untouched despite having several extremely powerful archetypes?

What’s up with that? How many patches can the class dodge?

I know Spell/Treant Druid is decent. That’s good, Druid finally doing Druid things. I’m saying Paladin should be nerfed. Should’ve been ages ago actually. I’m saying this as a person who’s played all Paladin archetypes since Librams were introduced. Pure, Broom, now the cheesy Ramp. Paladin needs adjustments lmao.

Laughs in 3 mana Libram of Hope

Class identity in a flavour sense is what is healthy for the game. Hearthstone is not the Counter Strike of card games. Blizzard has always had a MAJOR focus on visual and audio quality, more like the Disney of video games.

The Hearthstone team(s) has done an OUTSTANDING job at that, across so many expansions with different themes. Still managing to create a dozen cards for 9-10 classes that ALSO identify with the theme of the class as well as the current expansion.

The problem you are pointing out is unsolvable. When classes have a weakness, half the camp complains. When the weakness is solved, the other half complains.

Druid has access to multiple poisonous beasts in the neutral pool, so, the tech is there if they want to address their weakness… On the other hand, paladin would simply not be competitive without cost reduction in this meta. Their other deck styles like Duel or Dude just can’t cut it in standard.

The hardest part for the team is ALSO making the card text thematic, along with the class identity AND the expansion identity all at the same time, AND have memorable and fun voice lines, and maybe an animation! You dorks simply don’t give them enough credit for what they are doing right.

Those decks could cut it in Standard if devs printed more “dude” or murloc support for Paladin, for example, instead of giving them ways to delete giant minions and reduce the cost of their cards. Clearly Paladin with their Divine Shield package and minion buffs does not deserve tools that let them downright ignore the enemy board.

By the way, due to the class getting more rigged card draw (similar to Shaman’s Custodian), Ramp MURLOC Paladin is now a thing. And that deck doesn’t need cheap ways to nuke your giant minions or cost reductions to cheese you down.

All I imagine when I see these types of posts is OP (not specifically this OP) raging after having a full board of 8/8 clowns removed or some other similar win condition that didn’t work out. Ya, it’s frustrating when you think you are on top only to be obliterated. Yet, I’ve never seen a post with someone complaining when they themselves pulled off a similar move and come out on top. Everybody wants to count the misses, never the hits and it just comes across as poor sportsmanship. As someone that until recently has played almost exclusively Paladin, I can tell you that bad mulligans definitely happen regularly. More times than I can care to count, I’ve been stuck with Librams in hand and no Libram reductions and just get beat. So no, they aren’t OP or Super Balanced and just like every Tier 1 or 2 deck over time they even out to about a 55% -60%, of which there are a ton of decks sitting in that range at this time.

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