The mechanic is so inconsistent its absolute bonkers. Sometimes they’re spells sometimes they aren’t. Sometimes they get drawn but not cast. Sometimes one of them works one way but the other does not. Can the Hearthstone team finally DECIDE ONCE AND FOR ALL how these cards should work?! Are they spells or are they not spells?!
Examples of ridiculous interactions:
Hakkar’s corrupted is enhanced by spell damage, but bombs are not.
Storm Chaser draws a spell that costs 5 or more, this CAN draw bombs, so they are spells then?
Omega Mind says your spells have lifesteal, but it does not affect bombs. So they are not spells then?
For obvious reasons you never get cast when drawn cards when discovering spells or getting a random spell, so they shouldn’t be spells, right?
Certain interactions can cause a bomb or spider ambush or corrupted blood to simply get into your hand without casting its effect, at which point you can cast them like a spell provided you spend an insane amount of mana for something not at all beneficial? (btw why the F do they have a mana cost to begin with?!)
Far sight wastes its discount effect when drawing such a card. It really shouldn’t.
Mana wyrm, mana addict, gadgetzan auctioneer, etc… minions do not get buffed when such a card is “cast” so clearly they don’t count as spells, and shouldn’t be spells.
Corrupted Blood doesn’t benefit from spell damage. This was changed shortly after the RR release.
Yes.
Possibly? There’s a difference between Cast When Drawn and casting from hand, which might affect lifesteal.
That doesn’t follow. DK Rexxar couldn’t build a Zombeast using 6+ mana beasts, but that doesn’t mean there are no beasts that cost 6+ mana.
The only time I’ve seen that is if you copy a shuffled Cast When Drawn card from your deck (or your opponent’s). And why wouldn’t they have a mana cost? If they didn’t, Thief/Copy effects would be bonkers good against them (0 mana 4/4? Yes please!).
The whole point of cards like the shuffled bombs is to make card draw more risky. This seems like it’s working as intended.
They are spells. But they’re not being cast by you. They’re cast automatically. That’s different.
I support the idea Bombs couldn’t be spells! They should be a gadget, a technology!
Yes, a new type of card.
Thanks David for your post. We must talk about these things because last year they talked too much about consistency, however, are they doing their homework?
The homework isn’t 100%.
@Madmax
Oh, did they change the spell damage and Corrupted Blood interaction?
I couldn’t to know, they change the things and they keep them hidden… I can’t trust with this behaviour Activision I can’t trust is almost I can’t pay.
Keep things hidden… by putting them in the patch notes? Patch notes that are posted on the main game site? Like this one, for example: https://playhearthstone.com/en-us/blog/22882146
Omega Mind only applies to spells you cast, so just like it doesn’t apply to eg. Yogg or Archmage Vargoth spells it won’t apply to Bombs or Corrupted Blood since the player isn’t the one casting them. Under current rules, a player counts as casting a spell if (s)he drags the spell card unto the playing field from their hand.
If a player controls the source of a spell (or other effect) they don’t cast themselves, they’re considered the owner of that spell (or other effect) and they will benefit and suffer from all effects that don’t specify a target (such as Overload, summoning minions and generic card draw). This also is why a Yogg or Tess that swaps sides for any reason will suddenly apply these effects to the other player.
And yet none of your examples is actually inconsistent.
Was a bug, now fixed (as already stated by Madmax)
Yes, and consistent. The keyword “Casts When Drawn” is so far used for spells exclusively. (Bomb, Corrupted Blood, Darkness Candle, Felhound Portal, Scroll of Wonders, and Spider Ambush! in Standard; in Wild add Ancient Curse, Burrowing Mine, and Nerubian Ambush!).
They should have lifesteal if you manage to cast them yourself. (Which is tricky but can be done). Most of the time they are not cast by you. This is consistent with every other card that casts something, and with every other effect that happens when you cast something. E.g. Mana Wyrm does not get bonus attack when you play Yogg-Saron, Secretkeeper does not benefit from Masked Contender, etc etc)
Most Discover cards only allow you to discover “collectible” cards. You can get a 2/2 Pyros, but not the 6/6 or 10/10 versions. You cannot discover Huffer. So once more, this is consistent.
Exceptions to this rule are Cloning Device and Stitched Tracker (that discover a card from your or your opponent’s deck, but are restricted to minions - so these should be able to pull a Huffer previously shuffled but still not be able to discover a bomb), Eternal Servitude (discovers a minion from the resurrect pool, so it might revive a dead Huffer), and Shadow Visions (discovers a copy of a spell from your deck, so should be able to find a bomb). Tracking is not technically called discover but is close enough - and I have seen people get rid of bombs with it, and in the past of other “Casts When Drawn” cards.
Do you have evidence to show that Shadow Visions cannot discover a Casts When Drawn card? Games where (including the bombs) you had 3 or less spells left in your deck and yet were not given the bomb as an option? If so that would be a bug and I recommend you post that evidence on the Bug Report Forum.
Yes, exactly. As already established before, they are spells. And spells, once in hand (regardless of how they got there), can be cast. Not sure why you use this as an example of inconsistency - I would have considered it inconsistent if they were NOT able to be cast.
(And as to your last question - the reason they have a mana cost is once more purely for consistency. All spells have a cost. These cards are spells. So these cards have a cost).
Whether or not It “shouldn’t” would be a balance issue. You claim inconsistency so let’s focus on that.
Far Sight draws a card and then discounts that card. If that card happens to have a “Casts When Drawn” effect (e.g. Spider Ambush), then that card is cast. And as part of the “Casts When Drawn” keyword, after casting the spell a new card is drawn. That card is not drawn as a result of casting Far Sight, it is drawn as a result of drawing Spider Ambush. Spider Ambush will not discount the card it draws. Far Sight does try to discount the card it draws, but that card has already been cast.
So a purely consistent application of all effects and texts means that Far Sight discounts the card that was already automatically cast, and that the replacement card is not discounted.
You are free to argue that this is unfair. As I said, that’s a balance issue. I have no interest in discussing that. But you should be aware that a change to the cards that causes Far Sight to discount the card that was drawn by Spider Ambush (or Bomb, or any other) would introduce exactly the type of inconsistency that you claim exists now, but in fact does not.
Adressed above already. These cards activate when YOU cast a spell. Which you can do if you somehow manage to get one of these cards in your hand. But when drawn, it is not cast by you, and hence these cards don’t trigger.
Consistent.
I get that you don’t like some of the effects. And it’s fair game to propose change. As I said, I have no interest in discussing whether or not that would be a good thing for game balance and fun levels. But others might, and this forum is the correct place.
But don’t make a straw man argument about inconsistency when all the examples you bring forth and 100% consistent and the changes you request would in fact make it inconsistent.
It also seems to be a bit counter intuitive that if you have a full hand and a card is drawn the effect doesn’t activate instead burning the card. The effect should happen before the card hits your hand to be burned.
When your hand is full, you do not draw a card. You discard a card, which happens instead of burning it.
This has been the case since the inception of the game, and there are no exceptions to this. Flame Leviathan does not damage the board when discarded due to a full hand. Daring Reporter is not buffed when a card is discarded instead of drawn. Etc etc etc.
The thing is, the card doesn’t say “spells you cast” but “your spells have”. The bombs are clearly spells and they are yours as well as they are in your deck, so they should have lifesteal. And even if not so, it most definitely should be so for clarity or the text should be altered.
![:grinning:](https://dacy5cilkxabf.cloudfront.net/en/hearthstone/images/emoji/twitter/grinning.png?v=6" ":grinning:")
