I would make a bet here. If they did introduce personal loot, I guarantee, 100%, nobody would use shared loot. There’s no downside to personal loot. If you grab something that someone else needs, it’s still your loot, but you have the choice of what to do with it.
And you get to avoid all the hate if you chose to keep it.
I suspect that many would still want shared loot. Some players find it thrilling to click first and get the best gear.
They wouldn’t last long. Once they get burned by the one drop they really needed but couldn’t click fast enough, or as soon as someone comes up with an AutoPicker and Blizzard is slow to react, they’ll switch.
If nobody wants it then it sounds like it is working as intended.
I doubt blizzard is ready the drama shared loot is going to create.
How exactly would that work though? How would the system distribute the loot between personal and shared looters?
What about loot that drops off normal mobs? How does the system decide what personal looters can pickup from ground or not?
This way the system would have to regulate every loot by the quality that drops, then somehow disable personal looter from picking them up, it would come off awkward.
What about a guy who joins the server of only personal looters and just follows follows them doing nothing, then he is the only guy who can pickup stuff. What if loot option can be switched in game, then the people can abuse it by switching it to shared in the last second so that person will be the only 1 picking up loot.
Blizz would have to come up with some smart ideas to make two looting systems work in parallel, prevent exploitation, and still make it feel fair to everyone.
Is there even a game out there with more than one looting system? I don’t think Blizzard will go with two looting options, there will be one and final system.
Are you serious with this fallacious nonsense? Yes most people would consider satanism bad, yet they are also buying diablo t-shirts with pentagrams on them, hand over fist. Have you ever dressed up for Halloween? You are completely missing the point: Diablo dictates a theme that is reinforced with every mechanic, including the competition. How about you actually try to understand what is being said and provide insightful input rather than being contrarian just for the hell of it.
No… they really haven’t for every 1 of you, I see at least 4 pleading to keep looting as is.
Totally wrong about this. In my experience there has been plenty of public games with characters united in a common front for Questing. This is why you can also level cap games as a means to restrict power and equalize disingenuous people looking to do that- hell, I’m sure many people wouldn’t be opposed to adding more types of these filters/restrictions, but what you are describing is an endgame meta strategy, driven by the economy of a dying game, after many many years of neglect, and insufficient ways of dealing with cheaters/scammers- not the core principles of the game.
If you log into D2 and start a new character right now, you will of course be limited with the amount of people also starting and looking to complete the same quest as you. With a re-invigorated re-mastering and re-launch of D2, there will be THOUSANDS of people looking to complete quests and experience the game at the same stage you are at. It really is a bad argument trying to compare D2 in its current, dying state, to what it should be in it’s heyday. D2 still is 1000x more social than D3 ever was from day one. PERIOD. The lobby system alone had it dead in the water.
You can’t just do that because it will consequently create 2 unparalleled environments with their own respective drop rates/markets/eco-systems and will be inevitably exploited by private groups looking to maximize their loot chances. I’m not trying to be offensive, but those who support this, have you actually thought about the technical implementation of this, and how it would work from a theoretical stand point? The only way this could even be considered would be to limit/nerf the drop rates for the instanced loot, which would result in no one ever using it. And the argument for shared loot is that it makes things more scarce and competitive, as I’ve already gone over above. It’s not a mechanic that can simply be over-looked. Maybe a mix of the two is more realistic, but having the two independent systems implemented analogously is impossible without ruining the spirit of the game.
Your guys’ willingness to just throw these mechanics in without consideration for how it will affect the game shows just how little you’ve actually engaged with D2 in any technically relevant way.
For every game, the mechanism of loot drop is shared OR personal. No game would be a mixture of both.
For a given multiplayer game there are X players (up to 8) and Y total drops in D2 currently using the global loot system. in a personal loot game, the total drops Y stays constant to the global loot game. Each player receives on average Y/X drops. Due to RNG and rounding, it could be slightly variable per any game session but eventually will approach the average (+/- normal standard deviation) as a function of time.
Yes.
Blizzard has experience with both global loot and personal loot. They have already worked out how to do this programming.
With the migration to battlenet, the elimination of duping and the reduction in botting and autoclickers will also change the item economy. Many are willing to accept some changes for the sake of integrity.
That’s actually a viable option to determine the have loot option by making server and not by players. Each server made would have the option to select either, then players who join will be under the obligation of the selected loot system thus receive loot by that standard. That would definitely satisfy both ends, I like your idea.
Out of curiosity, what games incorporate more than one looting system?
Path of exiles is one. They have 3 loot options.
You can chose to have 3 diferent system for parties. Free for all, same as in d2, loot drops, who ever gets it first it is his. Timed loot. Loot will drop for a random person, and for that few sec only that person can get it. After the timer is out everyone can get it. And last the permanent loot, its same as the timed, but without the time xD.
WoW. Group Loot, Round Robin, Need Before Greed, Personal, Master Loot.
Yes. Adding choices is never the wrong option.
So what, you’ve written D2 mods or something? I doubt it. What do you know about the technical aspects of D2 outside of some math formulas?
The only technical aspect worth talking about is how there is no more technical aspect. When a developer tells you that they have limited technical capacity, it’s because of time/money/effort. If you got the source, you’re not limited by any implementations of new features.
I totally agree, the game is supposed to be hard. Not easy, with tutorials etc.
To learn recipes is also one of the fun facts in Runeword world.
Secret is called secret for a reason. Like Cow Level and Dclone is Secret for a reason. The fun fact is to find It’s way by your own.
I honestly feel like I’m back in the WoW Classic forums, people talking about ideas, secrets, Easter eggs and such…
But everything is out there. The game is discovered and theorycrafted to death.
If by “worked out” you mean implementing strategies that dissuade people from relying on or interacting with each other in any meaningful way, then sure, I guess. It’s certainly a detachment from any “classic” D2 experience I’ve played, that’s for sure, and the proof is in the pudding, with many D2 players rejecting these core changes in D3- but your only rebuttal to this will again be “Ohh look I log into D2 NOOWWW and everybody is reclusive”… It’s a bad argument. D2 is not what it once was, and still encourages more interaction than a game built in this generation.
And this is a good thing, no argument there. You are implying purists are completely against any changes- and while some are, there are plenty of players such as myself who are open to certain QoL changes, you just have to be able to articulate how it would enhance the overall experience, and not change it to suit your personal preferences, that are at odds with majority of the community’s experience. I see most of your guys’ arguments in favor of changing core mechanics appeal to the abundance of cheaters/bots/scammers, and not the intended behavior/flavor of the game without them. No one is going to argue that implementing more safeguards to dissuade cheaters is a bad thing for the economy…
The technical aspects LITERALLY are formulas. I’m not implying you need to be a coder to understand game-theory, but showing any indication that you even remotely understand them or engaged with them would give you that much more credence for proposing ideas to change them, but instead all I see is you guys proposing counter-measures for mechanics that were never intended to be a part of the experience in the first place- like auto-pickit/cheaters. Do you think it would be appropriate to include aim-assist in competitive FPS games just because there are tons of aim-botters ruining the experience? Obviously not…
So? We are here after all, as the devs say, to re-capture the nostalgia of a great game, and like I said- that doesn’t change the general overtone of the game. The choice to NOT reveal everything on a silver spoon still encourages you to explore and experiment for yourself, make mistakes, and grow with the help of the community- even if that does involve online research. D4 would do great justice to this theme by including hundreds of new undisclosed secrets waiting to be uncovered, even if it just for a short blip of time… with new additions each patch. D2R could do the same. Everything is theory crafted to hell but people still to this day aren’t completely convinced the chat gem does nothing… It’s the little details
D3 has personal loot. I interact with other players all the time. I drop gear for them and they me. I give and receive powerleveling. Like most game community, the majority of players are friendly but there are always bad apples.
The community is not a monolith of a singular opinion. First, no one know what the majority wants in relation to personal loot or global loot. The forum is not a representative sample. When I can say factually is that many want global loot and many want personal loot. To accommodate both ideas, the solution is to have the loot system similar to PoE or a variant thereof. D@ fans that favor global loot can choose that while other have the freedom to choose personal loot.
Which Blizzard has worked out for multiple games. Even PoE with a much smaller development team andd less resources have figured it out.
That would still occur if players were given a choice. Choose global loot. Players who want nostalgia and a modern loot drop system have a choice.
The difference is that you can play for several years of D2 and never drop wishlist or ‘best-in-slot’ items, placing strong emphasis on community interaction for barter and trade to achieve maxed-out builds. The chat system supported this, custom lobbies supported this and the trade system encouraged it. With D3, you are always going to be given best in slot items catered specifically to your class without even trying. Sure there are slight variations, but there is virtually NO scarcity and consequently dulls the thrill of finding anything meaningful. This is just an undeniable fact, and sentiment that has been shared amongst MOST well known D2/ARPG players, and the forums ARE in part representative of that fact. The inability to even create a custom lobby makes it difficult to even discover like-minded players to explore the game with- completely against the spirit of D2. The writings were on the wall right from the onset of D3 development. I’ve never seen such a divisive, and demoralized forum in my life. I’m sure all that’s left now are D3 loyalists no doubt.
Just because something is technically possible does not mean it’s the appropriate method. No body is saying the math is particularly hard… so I have no idea what you are trying to convey here. There is plenty of “modern features” that were implemented by the D3 team, or even PoE devs that where wholly rejected by the community.
To be honest, this wouldn’t really even bother me, but if you are balancing global loot to be = with the amalgamated, instanced loot, then you are still placing those individual players at a disadvantage with how frequently they get to “see” scarce items, and will likely revert to global loot with private lobbies anyway. They will undoubtedly crawl back to the forums to whine about their weak drop-rates.
In D3 vanilla, good loot drops and legendaries were incredibly rare, presumably to promote item rarity and the auction house.
I have more than 2,000 hours on demon hunter in D3. I have never seen a primal yang. If a primal well-rolled yang dropped, I would be ecstatic.
This is not a big part of D3, but that is not due to the personal loot system. This results from legendaries drop commonly, ancient 1:10 of regular leg, and primal 1:400of regular legendaries.
Yes and no. In D3 initially, all items dropped for all classes. The playerbase complained and Blizzard implemented smart loop based on player feedback.
D3 vanilla is very different than D3:RoS. It seems most of you complaints are directed to D3:RoS.
This boils down to personal psychology. Would you rather see a much needed item that someone else grabs or to acquire an item when you see it?
i will never stop asking for personal loot, the shared system d2 has is such a trash system.
everyone would not get loot, think wow instanced loot where something always drops but everyone cant get it.
This is a no-brainer for me since with shared loot I would still at least retain an equal chance to pick up the item I possibly need, or see that the person has it and can attempt to barter them for it- rather than wish on a lottery ticket completely beyond my control in any way, and isolated to my own personal experience. It completely eliminates any skill or nuance involved with playing among other players, and just further dilutes your chances of not just receiving a unique item, but one that’s relevant in any way to your character (A self-evident challenge that attempted to be remedied by RoS as you mentioned- and still falls short in my opinion to provide an engaging experience, but just makes it worse).
looting is it’s own skill in D2. It may not be perfect (nothing is); but inventory management, positioning, timing, build & playstyle, + luck are all things that go into that pot that contribute to it’s unique experience. Maybe I want to horde all the Pgems that drop, to be used for crafting or trading- and be left with no inventory space by the end of the run for the boss drop. Maybe I’ll take a trip to town and empty my inventory, momentarily trading off the potential opportunity to earn more loot as the party progresses (players should be rewarded for spending less time in town and more in dungeons; carrying the party). Maybe I won’t loot anything and hold off for only the best drops, just to discover I would have been better off casually looting throughout. These things ARE ALL real mechanics to consider that have a great amount of nuance and impact on the experience of the game, shared with other players.
Why should players who do none of the lifting, sit it town waiting for the dungeon be cleared, be rewarded with a chance to reserve the best item of the run? If you are going to try and snipe loot in a global system, at least then you still have to actually put yourself in harms way to beat out the rest of the players rather than sitting in town or in a secluded area of the map with your pants down… You act like personal loot is a flawless and tested system but those of us that have actually played those games as well KNOW FULLY the challenges associated with both, so don’t try to pretend like there aren’t any. It has gone through many many iterations- none of which have been perfect. Many of us clearly remember the exploits - running multiple areas simultaneously and then simply running through to collect their free loot, or sitting afk while parties finish bounties.
This is just patently false. everyone has an equal opportunity to grab the loot. If you are not positioned well for it…well then you will not receive it over someone who was closer. This is simply part of the skill of the game. With personal loot, you would have just never even seen it, or know it existed. How is that better?
I’ve already mentioned several different factors that determine and improve your chances to earn loot, main one being positioning. Are you really going to try and tell me your positioning is irrelevant?
Why? I made several trips to town throughout the course of a game, and stacked up 10 p gems. I left no inventory space to compete for unique boss drops. Guess what, they were all crap- they held out and got nothing, I now have crafting/trading materials that can be used to turn over rarer items.
You guys are ALL hanging on one single edge-case to support your argument, which is fractional advantages in competing over boss drops. Most of the valuable equipment you find rarely actually comes from bosses and drops casually throughout the course of a run amidst the chaos of mobs, and players positioned sporadically, so all this REEEEEE’ing and FOMO’ing over a single instance out of millions, is quite pathetic. I understand not everyone enjoys competition, but I started this game when I was 12 years old, on a dial-up connection and never experienced the disparity you guys are over-sensationalizing with a global loot system.
To what skills are you referring to? Spamming mouse click? Rofl
There is no skill involved in picking up loot, one thing that helps is better ping, other than that it’s pure luck.
it all boils down to who has the best ping and fastest reaction time and a big bunch of luck to click the right item. one player who just stands ready with an empty inventory should not have a greater chance of scoping up all the loot than anyone else.