They really do need to do some more damage output balancing between classes. Every season I play Barb, I know I’m focused on going zdps after I finish the season journey.
Would love them to finally make SS a competent damage dealer.
Also wish they’d make zdps for all classes viable in some way so that people can take on different roles in groups… the meta needs diversification.
You are kidding, right?
Everyone who ever complains about necromancer says:
“The whole class relies around Land of the Dead. Please, fix”
Now you want to make the entire barbarian class rely on Wrath? Because, necro and DH are not limited enough as is, let’s limit everyone else…
No this is bad. No other class CDR passive offers damage %. Its a matter of utility vs pure damage. 100% damage on a passive is too OP anyways. If you look at all class damage passives, its ranging between 10/15 - 40% whether additive or multiplicative. Changing the passive is easy, but it opens up new balancing problems that other classes starting to demand passive no reworks.
Monk has Determination as additive buff and Relentless assualt / Mythic Rhythm as multiplicative. RA is fine. MR needs an icon buff to info which mobs is properly buffed. EDIT: left Unity out as its kind of group skill.
Will have to look at each build/its actual multipliers/support legs to see which needs what.
On top of head:
Have to research on All servers and pull a record of each build/spec.
This is great, consider many transformation skills has multipliers tied to as base effect (vengeance, Akarat Champion etc)
I can save you some time. I have already grabbed the data for the America top 10 solo greater rift leaderboard. The best monk build is several greater rifts below average.
~https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/d3/t/season-17-solo-grift-top-10-data/1138/7~
Beacon of Ytar according to Diablo3ladder is one of the most common passive selected relative to any class (25% is the maximum and it is @23%). If it is “mandatory” already for monks, then it will remain mandatory. Nothing changes.
Since it would be an across the board DPS buff for a passive that already is used by 92% of high tier monks, how would it create a new problem that does not exist already?
Since this change would only bring up monks to average, I do not think that it well set off a firestorm of protests from other classes.
The problem with your suggestion is that you are asking for distinct buffs to multiple sets at once. If the goal is 6 piece set intra class parity, then use patch 2.6.5 as a guide and buff class set modifiers. This is far simpler than changing one or multiple items for each build.
This proposed idea of yours is completely wack and would require a bit of effort that you so claim it wouldn’t. You are talking about introducing completely new runes and passives.
If you were a true barb enthusiast, you would have read and been aware of the proposal that was prepared by Free and others. Which would prove why this idea is completely wack.
At this point in the game i wouldn’t honestly expect and hope for anything more than simple number adjustments, which would do the job enough to somewhat satisfy.
I did. It was well written. As you know if you read Free’/Rage’s website, it included requests to buff 9 barbarian passive skills, 28 unique items (including more than 10 with new legendary affixes), and the waste of the wrath set bonuses (4 and 6 piece bonuses). For monks, I propose a single change to 1 passive skill that is already used by the overwhelming majority of monks.
Barbs are more tricky. If there was a near “universal” barbarian passive, item, and/or skill that I would advocate dropping the damage modifier on that.
Alternatively for barbs and monk, Blizzard could treat it like patch 2.6.5 and tweak the 6 piece class set bonuses with the “right math.”
Edit. I want to remind everyone what the recommendations were for List 1 that was described as :“This list represents the bare-bones buffs needed to various items to achieve the desired parity between builds, and to increase build diversity for LoN and primary skill builds.” This includes buff to a a 6 piece set bonus as well number buffs to 10 items (Skull Grasp, Girdle of Giants, Fury of the Vanished Peak, Bastion’s Revered, Oathkeeper, Dishonored Legacy, Blade of the Warlord, Arreat’s Law, The Three Hundredth Spear, and Skular’s Salvation). I am not sure that any class has received buffs to 10 class specific items since the release of the necromancer.
You dont play monk do you? Its common because WOL / zmk gears it. Not every monk dps build gears it. Particular one of strongest - Raiment Gen. If memory serves monk solo world record is R6 Gen. Another CDR passive usage rate is higher than BoY - that is wiz evocation.
You can not look at a website for data w/o insight of class.
The reason Free and the barb com comes up with such detailed report is because amongst them they have 100ks of hrs on Barb playing time.
EDIT: We appreciate your post and welcomes any open discussion. But unless you knows the class mechanics, please stick to your main class when requesting class tweaks. IE i will never stick my nose into WD stuff as I only have 200 hrs on it and deleted all my WD toons.
Alternatively for barbs and monk, Blizzard could treat it like patch 2.6.5 and tweak the 6 piece class set bonuses with the “right math.”
There’s a pretty comprehensive website for buffing just the barb alone, monk needs a similar treatment. barbarianbuffproposals.mystrikingly
It is pretty comprehensive on why barb is behind, why it can feel bad to play, etc. and offers workable solutions to all of these. This website has existed for quite some time, unfortunately nothing has happened. Does not inspire confidence and I can tell you a buff to a bracer which can hardly fit into builds because it is already a contentious slot does not help all too much. There are very core problems with the class and sets on both monk and barb that run deep.
If you check out my post that is about 5 above this one, it provides a possible explanation where comprehensive may not be realistic in light of the changes Blizzard has done with the number of passive skills and items being buffed.
For ease, I quoted myself:
Barbs should be buffed; however, perfect buffing to get inter and intra class parity is unrealistic in my mind given where we are in the life cycle in this game. I think that it is critical to remember the magnitude of the proposed comprehensive changes and whether it is reasonable. It seems like this comprehensive proposal is like drafting architectural renderings for a mansion on 150 acres while the home owners budget is a 3 bedroom house in the suburbs.
You could also go the other way and lower the damage of the classes that are ahead of the lowest and balance it that way
Yeah I know that’s a bad idea because it is cutting power to the most powerful and under NO circumstances is that even to be entertained
I’m in favor of nerfing wizards by 3 greater rifts in combination of buffing barbs and monks. If this happened the current 12 grift difference in solo would be ~4. This is not perfect but seems pretty reasonable.
I feel a little silly having to make the argument about reigning in expectations in light of the resources available. Nev has made this clear.
See:
Pay particular attention to her posts in response to Free and vice versa.
You don’t feel silly about having such strong feelings regarding a class with which you’re unfamiliar?
My opinion, at least as it relates to barbs, is that the devs don’t want them to have even remotely close to the same power as other classes. It would be trivial to balance every class in the game. The easiest way that comes to mind off the top of my head would be to just increase a few numbers here or there, using the top 100, top 10, top 1000, whatever number they wanted, from each class. It wouldn’t take a huge team, it would literally take one person with a calculator 5 minutes to figure out the new values needed, then maybe one programmer some time to go make a few changes to some numbers in the code.
The fact that this has not happened in the past 5 years ran most of us off. I’m happy to see that some are still here fighting the good fight, but they simply don’t want the same thing that we want.
Uliana EP = 128 (Lemma 5k para asia)
R6/Shenlong = 133 (RXT 8k para EU)
WoL LoN = 132 (Jebaited 7k para EU, don’t play anymore)
Most monk builds use Epiphany and unity, as 99% of the community hates this item, so it is likely that it should be replaced with a matching item.
In an ideal world, we could create a ring such as “Ring of Ytar” with Legendary Power: “” "Add 35-45% dodge chance + 50-65% CDR to Epiphany. While Epiphany is active, all your damage is increased by 100% (or any required value).
Benefits:
Major builds will benefit equally, and will keep the balance between the class.
It will kill the hated unit once and for all.
Monks will finally have Perma Epiphany and CC Immunity in Gen.
Or …
Simply buff sets again.
But LoN WoL will be dead and we will have Sunwuko in his place again.
I think monk need for options like tempest rush, then more power.
How many times can you play wave of light.
Also double the buff of primary strength gem, will open up many generator builds.
This is awesome… +1
I have come up with a different idea that better balances all classes relative to solo greater rifts. It does not involve making changes to any skill or item. It is based on a “simple” mathematical formula.
See:
PROPOSAL LIST 1 WRITTEN IN THE PROPOSAL.
This info is in the proposal, I take no credit for it. Just a simple copy pasta.
Wrath of the Wastes and Whirlwind:
Skull Grasp bonus increased from 300-400% to 1000-1300%.
Wrath of the Wastes (4) mitigation increased from 50% to 60%
Might of the Earth:
Girdle of Giants bonus increased from 200-250% to 700-900%.
Fury of the Vanished Peak bonus increased from 400-500% to 1000-1300%.
R6/IK HOTA
Gavel of Judgment bonus increased from 600-800% to 1300-1700%.
Vile Charge
Standoff bonus increased from 400-500% to 850-1100%.
Frenzy Thorns:
Bastion’s Revered bonus increased from 10 stacks to 20
Primary Skill Builds:
Oathkeeper bonus increased from 150-200% to 3000-4000%.
Dishonored Legacy bonus increased from 300-400% to 3000-4000%.
Blade of the Warlord bonus increased from 400-500% to 3000-4000%.
Arreat’s Law extra Fury generated increased from 20 to 30
Weapon Throw and Boulder Toss:
The Three Hundredth Spear bonus increased from 45-60% to 2000-2600%.
Skular’s Salvation bonus increased from +100% / +150% to +150% / +275%
@Micro. Simple number changes to existing items. Looks pretty simple to me.
Yes, It would seem that a simple number buff would be easy; however, I will refer you to Patch 2.6.5 and Nevs recent response to Free. All classes to differing extents have issues for parity within class builds (see DMO for bazooka or VYR-Chantodo).
I am giving my own prior suggestions in this thread the Spock eyeroll treatment.
In a new thread, I have proposed a solution for ALL CLASSES relative to class parity for top builds that does not require any buff to items or skills. It would simply be a DPS modifier. It would also buff all builds within a class relatively equally.