I originally considered simply editing my previous post with the new PTR update (March 4, 2021) but there was already a very long discussion in that thread. I wish to start over with a new list of suggestions on how to address the issues at hand given new input from the developers.
This is a long and analytical post, if you just want to see my proposed solutions, skip ahead to the section marked with s.
The Good
First of all, the relative state of the GoD Hungering Arrow build has improved a little since the last PTR build. The pierce cap incremented by 1 and the 10,000% to 15,000% 6-piece set bonus buff was a step in the right direction. Thank you for listening to our ideas on the matter!
The Bad
The Demon Hunter community sentiment remains mostly negative as from the initial PTR patch (with the 2 pierce cap on GoD sets). My clanmate dmkt, has already created a new post (GoD6 Buff Feedback after Patch 2) regarding the sentiment and some GR equivalency numbers as well. The key point is that the nerf is still too harsh in high GRs.
The Ugly
Moving forward to increase the power of the GoD Hungering Arrow build has some issues. There doesn’t appear to be a perfect solution at this time given the limited dials the developers have to tune performance. In essence, by changing certain parameters, the high GR issue can be fixed but it might create new issues.
This thread will go into details regarding the reasoning behind my suggestions. I hope that this insight will assist the developers in making an informed decision at the conclusion of this PTR cycle.
Objectives and Parameters
As it stands now, there seem to several goals with the given PTR build. I will list these in priority order but an ideal solution should aim to satisfy as many as possible as simply as possible. Here are the six most important objectives from my perspective that any future tuning after this PTR should aim to achieve:
Objective 1: Missile Dampening elites provide too much power
- This objective is currently addressed by implementing a pierce cap.
- Must be satisfied with any proposed solution
Objective 2: GoD Hungering Arrow needs more power for high GR
- The high-GR power of the build needs to be buffed by ~5 GRs.
- Must be satisfied with any proposed solution
Objective 3: GoD Hungering Arrow is strong for low GR
- The low-GR power of the build should not be buffed significantly.
- Should be satisfied with any proposed solution
Objective 4: GoD Hungering Arrow is heavily reliant on Devouring Arrow
- The current pierce cap has Devouring Arrow maybe 1-2 GRs above Shatter Shot.
- Should be satisfied with any proposed solution
Objective 5: GoD non-Hungering Arrow builds are too weak
- Bolas and other generators are still behind Hungering Arrow.
- Would like to be satisfied with any proposed solution
Objective 6: Non-GoD builds are too weak
- Other class sets and builds are behind but within 5-10 GRs.
- Would like to be satisfied with any proposed solution
Now that we have a list of objectives, what are the parameters we can use to tune and adjust settings to satisfy as many objectives as possible? There are of course MANY parameters to play with but I will list only the simplest ones to adjust here! These would be simple number adjustments and nothing more (no coding of new mechanics, no retroactive nerfs to existing items except Ninth Cirri Satchel).
Parameter 1: Pierce cap on Ninth Cirri Satchel
- Currently set to 3.
Parameter 2: Damage bonus on Ninth Cirri Satchel
- Currently set to +450–600% (5.5–7.0x) damage.
Parameter 3: GoD 2-piece set bonus damage
- Currently set to +200% (3.0x) damage at max momentum.
Parameter 4: GoD 4-piece set bonus movement speed
- Currently set to +160% movement speed at max momentum.
Parameter 5: GoD 6-piece set bonus damage
- Currently set to +15,000% (151x) damage.
Parameter 6: Hungering Arrow - Devouring Arrow growth rate
- Currently set to +70% per pierce.
Parameter 7: Leonine Bow of Hashir or Emimei’s Duffel bonus
- Currently set to +150% (2.5x) and +175% (2.75x) respectively.
Again, this list is not exhaustive, but a short list of a few things that can be tweaked numerically without introducing new mechanics or creating new bugs. This may seem like a lot to take in, but I will try to propose a few ideas which will tackle different objectives in different priorities!
Effect of Parameters on Objectives
Each of the parameters listed previously will affect the desired objectives positively, negatively, or not much at all. A good description of this section is known as sensitivity analysis but I’ll only do so qualitatively here.
The notation used in the following chart is: = makes worse,
= makes better,
= does not affect much with the number of circles corresponding roughly to how strong and in what way increasing the parameter will affect the given objective.
Missle Damp. Eff. GoD HA High GR GoD HA Low GR Dev. Arrow Power GoD Non-HA Builds Non-GoD Builds Inc. NCS pierce cap /
Inc. NCS damage Inc. GoD 2 bonus Inc. GoD 4 bonus Inc. GoD 6 bonus Inc. Dev. Arrow bonus /
Inc. Bolas item bonus
The caveats to the missile dampening objective is that if the pierce cap is lifted too much (perhaps over 20) or Devouring Arrow scales too quickly it can become a problem again.
So what can we conclude from this table?
- Increasing the pierce cap will help with the high GR situation, without affecting the low GR situation, BUT it makes Devouring Arrow (and the GoD set in general) even more dominant among DH builds, lessening diversity.
- Decreasing the Ninth Cirri Satchel’s damage multiplier will tone down the Hungering Arrow damage overall to potentially allow for more build diversity.
- Increasing either the GoD 2-piece and 6-piece bonuses roughly achieve the same purpose, but the 2-piece bonus could potentially be used with a different set (e.g. Natalya/GoD hybrid), so it won’t detriment build diversity as much as the 6-piece bonus.
- Decreasing the GoD 4-piece movement speed bonus will mostly slow lower GRs which are more speed-limited than high GRs which are typically damage- or toughness-limited.
- Decreasing the Devouring Arrow scaling factor will hurt high GRs but will lessen the dominance of the rune if the pierce cap is increased further.
- Increasing either or both of the Bolas items will increase build diversity for GoD builds and, to a lesser extent, other sets without affecting much else.
Possible Solutions!
Here I will list my top 3 solutions which will address different objectives to a varying extent. The goal here is to propose 3 such combinations of the parameters I listed with the hope that at least one of them addresses the main concerns of the developers in deciding how to balance the class for this season. Next season, there may be more reworked sets and other major changes, so this list of solutions may not reflect what developers have in mind beyond season 23.
For simplicity, each solution has only 3-4 parameters tuned! The baseline is the current PTR build which includes the 3-pierce cap on Ninth Cirri Satchel and the 15,000% GoD 6-piece set bonus.
Solution 1) Increase pierce cap from
3to 4, increase GoD 6-piece bonus from15,000%to 20,000%, and decrease GoD 4-piece bonus from8%to 5%.
Maintains Missile Dampening issue resolved
Boosts damage in high GRs by about 4.8 GRs
Boosts damage for lower GRs, but offset by less speed
Maintains Devouring Arrow as best HA rune
Maintains GoD HA as best GoD build
Maintains GoD as best DH set
Solution 2)* Increase pierce cap from
3to 8, increase GoD 6-piece bonus from15,000%to 40,000%, decrease Ninth Cirri Satchel damage from450–600%to 200-250%, and decrease Devouring Arrow scaling from70%to 10% per pierce.
Maintains Missile Dampening issue resolved
Boosts damage in high GRs by about 4.5 GRs (with all DA pierces)
Lower GRs roughly unaffected (assuming DA 4 pierces)
Devouring Arrow not strongest rune in all high GR situations
GoD non-Hungering Arrow builds now a viable alternative
Requires retroactive interpolation of damage range
Requires several adjustments to items, sets, skills
Maintains GoD as best DH set
Solution 3) Increase GoD 2-piece bonus from
10%to 20% per second of momentum, decrease GoD 4-piece bonus from8%to 5%, increase either Bolas item from150%/175%to 400% (roughly double power).
Maintains Missile Dampening issue resolved
Boosts damage in high GRs by about 3.25 GRs
Boosts damage for lower GRs, but offset by less speed
Devouring Arrow only slightly ahead in high GR situations
GoD Bolas now a viable alternative
Maintains GoD as best DH set, but Natalya/GoD hybrid improved
*: Solution 2 was adjusted with input from dmkt.
Conclusions
While the list of 3 solutions I propose are not exhaustive, I hope that the list of tune-able parameters and desirable objectives proves useful in determining a suitable balance change that will be agreeable for both the developers’ goals and players’ sentiments.
Regarding DH performance in groups, the analysis and suggestions in this post primarily focus on the solo GR aspect of the build. While the lower solo GRs are generally fine as is, for higher group GRs, the current PTR nerfs have been more drastic than that of solo since density in a group setting can be made higher via the use of pull-in effects from other players. That said, addressing the high-GR issues mentioned for solo builds will simultaneously address the group GR issues somewhat as well.
I know this post is a bit much for most people to read through but this is my genuine effort to best relay what I know, using the skills I have, for the Diablo 3 community.
Thank you for reading!