Patch 2.6.8 Balance changes Nerfs/Buffs

If that is the lv of arguments you like, i can adapt to it. To my mind it is very one sided and not well thaught but ok. First of all yes i am a wizzard only player.

If you watched it on twitch i guess you saw that this lv 150 Gr build was maybe not archon wizzard?? Spoiler alert it is another build which is uber trash for speed farming. Another spoiler alert blizzard is considering nerfing bazooka wizzard too.

Are you an envies barb player ? Wizzard was permanently nerfed when it was good at speed solo farming. Archon wizzard wouldnt be on par with the trash killer build in group play, even without the nerfs. it was good for solo push and speed farm. It was nerfed by blizzard. I would be fine with barb and even crusader if blizzard hadnt nerfed archon of the exact same reasons people are now demanding barb and crusader nerfs. You should have defended wizzard better when blizzard announced to nerf archon. This are just the consequences

Buy a game with 7 classes and play only one? Well, whatever floats your boat.

I’m a non envious player of most classes, barb in current season. And I never asked for nerfs of any other class.

Sure, bazooka. Which they tried to nerf and failed miserably, lol. Also using archon. And we never got into specific wiz builds.

In current season average group play (1000-1500 paragon) Chantodo Vyr is pretty much the only class keeping up with the barbs (and well). Aov sader is close but struggling, monk is mostly z-monk. Dh and necro are pretty useless, wd rarely seen.

Last season Vyrtodo was totally dominating, so what’s the problem when another class finally got moved up to it? Just leave it alone, it’s fine, and give some love to DH, Nec and WD.

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Why? Please explain. And keep in mind I am DH only player so I will probably understand.

@StuRedman

I want to make sure that I understand your philosophy.

  1. Would you prefer a well-balanced game or a game where one or a few classes totally dominate?

I think that your answer is well-balanced.

  1. Ideally in relation to solo GR potential, what type of GR difference from the highest to lowest GR potential between classes do you consider a reasonable target for balance?

Are you ok with there being a 14 GR difference between the top and worst solo class?

Does a 4 GR difference seems like a reasonable and potentially achievable goal?

  1. Philosophically to achieve balance, do you prefer if the developers utilize “only buff, never nerf” or a combination of nerfs and buffs?
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Please don’t think for me, ty.

I couldn’t care less about top spots on leaderboards held by players with silly high paragon. Game should first of all be balanced around the level the majority of players achieve in a season. At that level for example the “overperforming” sader loses vs the barb.

Also there are roles in this aRpg. Monk is super fun for speeds and keyfarming, Barb is better at pushing higher GRs, so?

What people like you just don’t get: Blizz has started doing updates, one by one. Why can’t you just sit back and wait how the other classes will turn out instead of whining for nerfs of the just improved classes?

Improve people’s fun instead of taking away from others. Good philosophy.

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That seems reasonable. Have you ever analyzed the in game data for player under 2.3K paragon who made the leaderboard in non-seasons. I have in this thread.

It is more than one by one. In patches 2.6.7 and 2.6.7a, 3 classes were buffed (barbs twice, monks once, crusaders once) and 3 were nerfed (wizards, crusaders, and necromancers). Therefore, Blizzard introduced balance changes for the majority of classes. Unfortunately, they clearly missed the mark on some of these modification.

I am waiting; however, Blizzard has already said that they plan to both nerf and buff as illustrated by patches 2.6.7 and 2.6.7a. Using your logic, why can’t you wait to see how the balance changes turn out before invoking “only buff, never nerf”? I am trying to make sure that posters know Blizzards stated plans on game design so that classes are not overnerrfed or overbuffed.

There were 3 classes just improved (monk, barbs and crusaders). They differ at the top end by 7 GRs. So even the just improved classes have siginificant differences.

Stating what Blizzard has posted is not “whining”, it is simply providing information. Whining typically involves wanting something changed that is happening contrary to your personal desires.

When the PTR patch 2.6.7 notes were released, how many players complained on these forum about the thorns necromancer nerf? It was very, very few. Moreover, even necromancer players advocated for a nerf for thorns necromancer even before it was announced. There was more who complained about the wizard nerf, but it really was not that many people. The majority of posters who voiced an opinion were in favor of the nerfs.

I have one and only one seasonal character (linked below). I main a barb this season. Even playing barbs exclusively over the past couple of months, I endorse a minor barb nerf to align it with Blizzard balance goals. I have modest paragon ~1200 in season 19. Barbs at this paragon level outperform all classes with the possible exception of crusaders. Of note, barbarians and crusaders are also the top 2 classes in non-season at low paragon.

https://us.diablo3.com/en/profile/MicroRNA-1507/hero/116200754

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Like barb getting close to wizard at last?

Vyr chantodo is keeping up just fine at this level.

Not true. Just read Free’s barb petition thread.

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Getting sidetracked again. Blizzard has showed us and told us when they nerf things.

I highly suspect that the timing of the balance blog post and the release of the PTR patch notes are being sync’d because it will have some nerfs in it.

I’ll just speak for myself: I’m not asking for nerfs. I’ve been playing WotW since it came out, and I was running fields of misery with my skorn in vanilla.

But I see where this is going. In the last few months they nerfed 3 builds, and both AoV and WotW are outperforming 3/3.

So I can either dig in on the “don’t nerf us” side, or try to come up with something that will hurt as little as possible. I don’t think there’s any point to option 1.

But option 2 is promising. Adding just 3 words to the legendary power of Ambo’s Pride has the potential to keep it under the speed limit, and also keep 100% of the fun and power for most of the players.

Or, you could just revert the 3 second window in the 4 piece bonus. With Ambos, it’s not needed except for hardcast rend, which is the problem.

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Glad some people get it.

Thanks, Green.

Barbs don’t need nerfs. We’re long overdue for our time in the sun.

Here’s hoping other classes get theirs, too–through buffs!

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After all those years as soon as you stopped spinning the player was dead meat even to pick stuff up even if it was a Sand-fly baby! That would be a terrible mistake to change that bonus.
Do not ask to change that set bonus, can’t you remember how long it took to get that buff?
Damn I am getting so sick of people calling for Nurfs, especially to Sets that have been under preforming for years, JUST STOP!

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Did you read my post?

terrible mistake to change that bonus

Yes, I know the history. I’m throwing out ideas of how we can avoid an actual nerf. You could also just rearrange the 4-piece verbiage to make the 3 seconds apply to DR but not Rend. NBD.

JUST STOP!

Something is going to happen, with or without our suggestions.

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You are most likely right.

What bothers me is when posters state/endorse/like comments that simply are factual inaccurate. Some of the claims in this thread are preposterous. One post claimed that barbarians are excluded entirely from the 4 man meta (zDPS barbs called), another claimed that wizard were the top class for 5 years, etc… Difference in opinions is fine. Misinformation is problematic.

See this:

I am not sure why anyone would endorse a class or two to be “absolute GODS” or use that as a justification. Two wrongs do not make a right. Also, wizards have not been “absolute GODS” for 5 years. Propagating misinformation is counterproductive.

You are correct. I personally like the removal of area damage from hard cast rends (help with server lag) or reducing the damage modifier on lamentation to 75% or 100%. 75% and 100% (from 150%) is a very modest ~2.2 GR and ~1.5 GR reduction in DPS, respectively.

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Here we are again, nerf, nerf, nerf - only solution is nerf!

Stop it, really. What about buffing rest of classes sets, instead of nerfing good ones? Nerfing classes according to performance in season where season buff have huge impact on high GR clears is bad idea.

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They need to nerf in Diablo 3 so people get used to nerfs before Diablo 4 is released.

All the nerf discussed here are only about non seasonal clears.

Nobody here is saying to not buff poorly performing sets, but the end goal is to get all sets to around 140 at 8k paragon (NS), which right now Rend barb and crusader are both way above of.

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It’s worth remembering that Micro has already said he has no issue with people being able to solo GR150.

As this point, anything he now says to the contrary, he’s either being a massive hypocrite, or a very bad troll.

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Please quote what I said precisely. The idea was to balance solo to the current GR 140 in relation to monster hp and then rescale solo and only solo GRs by about 10 GR levels to bring balance to players in their ability to clear higher GRs whether they choose to play solo or in 4 man groups. If you make it so all classes can solo GR 150 in its current iteration, 4 man meta play would make it even more trivial as it is now where groups are clearing GR 150 in less than 5 minutes in 4 man. For your convenience, I have below:

The link to the final 2.6.7 patch are below. In patch 2.6.7, all barbs items either remained the same or were buffed relative to their 2.6.6 values.

https://us.diablo3.com/en/blog/23220967/patch-267-now-live-11-12-2019
Free’s thread was about whether a preliminary number change/buff on the PTR (public testing realm) should be kept. By definition, the PTR is for TESTING. So the question was whether or not, Blizzard should add a NEW rend modifier on lamentation (and the precise number of that modifier). It was not about a nerf per se but whether a buff should occur relative to patch 2.6.6

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I think that Pe3eWe3e has suggested to buff another spec (or create a new one) to be the top build for DHs. I think he would agree with the sentiment that rapid fire build is not terribly fun to play.

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Based on what? Give me some numbers, compared to other classes.

If something is boring and dull they need to nerf it so it is more boring and more dull?

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If you read the 3 second damage mitigation buff it is applied to Whirlwind not the Rend Skill at all, you stop Spinning your Barb is in jeopardy from any incoming damage. The Rend 4 piece buff has nothing to do with Whirlwind just the hard cast Rends.