If Personal Loot is to be done

[Akai-11466]

MF runs are solo, group runs for xp. It was like this 20 years ago and will likely be the same now.

[Akai-11466]

Personal loot makes more sense in WoW because items are bind on pickup. It stops ninjas from need rolling things they can’t even use. In D2 however since all loot is tradeable, FFA works because you can always give a piece to your alt.

[Akai-11466]

If I made a list of things that made Diablo II great, rng would be painfully low on that list.

[Husker-11214]

It’s not happening. Move on - quickly.

[SalveWarsong-1819]

Gee golly willackers, I can’t wait to do most of the damage while others portal in and stand there for their 1 piece of personal loot.

It’s even gosh darn more exciting if I get nothing.

Personal loot has no place in D2.

[elLoroFeroz-2120]

Sorry my friend, you wont be able to get your free stuff while leeching bot runs, you will have to work for your items.

If you can solo chaos or baal, what are you doing in a party? If you cant, why are you expecting to get the items you dont deserve?

Press alt and click like mad when that last boss is going to die, that is what everybody does and that is what you have to do. If you notice that someone is picking all the stuff just leave that runs and find a new party, it is not that hard to understand.

D2 is ffa and will always be.

[Diakka-1992]

@Akai-11466

Personal loot makes more sense in WoW because items are bind on pickup. It stops ninjas from need rolling things they can’t even use. In D2 however since all loot is tradeable, FFA works because you can always give a piece to your alt.

You are mixing things up.
The risk of being a victim of a ninja is ZERO if you are in a guild. That is my experience.

Personal loot TOGETHER with the impediment of not being able to trade items due to ilvl was what ruined the raid experience for many.

Nobody asked for personal loot in WoW.
The answer was already in the game.

Create your own guild or join one.

In Diablo you also have an option.
You can always play alone.

Blizzard changed things that were working fine.
These changes created problems for several players.
And the “answer” they came up with was to make the problem from before even worse.

1. kill the boss
2. be on the winners table to receive an item
3. If the item you win is not your BiS, it is most likely that you will not be able to trade it. you are progressing in the raid and the items have more ilvl.

Outcome:
You win an item that you do not need and surely you will not win another item while you are in that same ID.
And since you can’t trade the item, your guildmates are left without a possible upgrade and you end up selling the item.

Yes, that was a very good change.
Personal loot, ruining the lives of players since its introduction.

[Luap26-1769]

You rang? lol. Man, I just want the game to come out on this point, getting burned out on the forums.

[Muyu-1611]

Lol. I feel it man. I feel it.

[Mousehouse-11421]

@AnxiousDavid-1818

who said anything about removing rng?

Well, you change it at least. Manipulating the RNG is a major change and makes things way more complicated. Also biased rolls for drops come with difficulties, because all of a sudden you have to calculate through your models and make sure, there are no exploits etc. I think, this is just unnecessary, not a real advantage.

@AnxiousDavid-1818

it broke your logic of black and white solutions

My argument is not black and white… You just don’t seem to understand that there can literally not exist more than the two options

• amount of drops stays the same
• amount of drops changes

I mean, there is no third option in our universe, dude… This has nothing to do with black and white, but with a suitable categorization, which only is good, because it covers all possibilities… I don’t understand how you don’t understand that.

You in contrast are now proposing to change other mechanics aswell, which you can do ofc, but overcomplicating mechanics, just to squeeze in ploot is far from a good solution to a problem, that doesn’t even exist, because shared loot is fine.

[Mindless-1928]

Yah I want to afk in baal runs and get loot same time!

[MicroRNA-1507]

@Pycckue-1800

It needs to be done in a way not to affect overall amount of item flow into the economy.

For example If there are 8 ppl in the game and the ammount of items dropped from baal is 0 - 8. So then if there are 8 ppl in the game with personal loot then each player should receive 0-1 items from a boss drop.

For almost all that want a personal lot option added, that is what we have requested.

@WhirLWinD-1213

Yea. Total drops would still be the same, it’s just a random chance on who gets the drops. If a total of 10 uniques drop during a regular FFA(shared loot) game, if it was instead personal loot the same 10 uniques would drop. Not 8x the amount to equal 80 uniques

Correct, Some keep bringing up the 8X drops because either they do not understand what is being asked for or alternatively trying to spread misinformation.

@Boutus-2455

No, I wouldn’t go down this route, because the people who want personal loot put into D2R are the people who want every rare item on launch day, they will play D2R for maybe 4-5 hours tops, and then put it down for three months

This argument does not carry any merit in my eyes. I have played D2 for thousands of hours, have primarily earned my gear by playing solo, and do not want every rare item on launch day.

This is a spurious strawman argument against some hypothetical player class that does not exist.

If I said: “All player who want FFA loot are botters and pickit cheats”, I would be a laughing stock by making such a preposterous accusation.

Both loot allocation systems have pros and cons. There is a reason that almost all video game aRPGS now opt for instanced/personal loot.

@Muyu-1611

If you can’t click fast enough in a game full of other players, you don’t deserve the loot.

Really??? I am am carrying an entire team and doing almost all the damage, I do not deserve the loot if I can not click fast enough in multiplayer. This seems illogical to me. In legitimate games, there are several variable for getting loot (e.g. ping, range vs. melee, etc…)

@Pycckue-1800

someone is gonna run auto pick it hack , if you played d2 you would know that all the good items are picked up instantly and it doesnt matter how fast you click

This happens frequently. Hopefully, this type of cheating will be reduced in modern battlenet but to think that pickits will be eliminated entirely seems naïve.

@Muyu-1611

What we need is Vicarious Visions to be on top of hacks/cheats.

Unfortunately, the hacks/cheats team is separate.

@Boutus-2455

I knew things like that existed but I refused to have anything to do with pickit, I think most people are like that.

If most are good that means a few are still there. If 1in 8 cheats and you are in an 8 player game…

@Pycckue-1800

I think this current system demotivates playing as a group.

As this thread illustrates, the common saying is solo for gear and xp for loot.

@Muyu-1611

hope your clicking prowess is on its A-Game

If average is C and you have A-game that means that you get a disproportionate amount of good loot at the expense of the other players.

@Boutus-2455

The epitome of selfishness.

You are correct. The epitome of selfishness is pickit users. Next, are those who want to have the option to click on all the good drops irrespective of their contribution.

@Pycckue-1800

Auto pickit will pick the valuable item almost so fast where you won’t even know it dropped

True

@Mousehouse-11421

1. total amount of drops stays the same. Then you will have statistical fluctuations, bringing you huge streaks of no good drops at all. If you play in a party, you see all items drop in D2. So you have the chance on all of them (if no autopickup bit is there). Even there, you can have a month without a Highrune drop. But if you only get to see 1/8 of the Drops, you can have e.g. 3 consecutive ladders without even seeing a single high Rune drop, if you would only play in parties. (It doesn’t matter for the principle, that a lot of people don’t farm in parties)

To make clear: you average drops are the same with ploot and shared loot, where everybody clicks equally well. But the fluctuations will give you horrible times with ploot, which spoils party play.

In your example seeing does not mean acquiring. In a FFA system if a 6 man team constantly plays together and collectively only see 3 drops that means 3 players are guaranteed never to collect a high rune. Nothing changes in that regard in FFA versus instanced loot games.

@Mousehouse-11421

the most basic principle in D2 is rng. If you want to change that, I am against the concept anyway. Rng is what makes D2 Great.

The drops in personal loot games are RNG. For a given monster/boss, the game already calculated if a drop happens and its identitiy. For personal loot, there is an extra roll added that defines that dop to a specific player.

@DizzyDwarf-21379

Only mistake Brevik made with Diablo 2 was the stamina potion

Breivk has stated that he would change 3 things in Diablo 2 if he could. One is removing the stamina bar, the second is autogold pickup.

The third… he would have instanced/personal loot instead of FFA loot.

@Akai-11466

MF runs are solo, group runs for xp.

As I mentioned earlier, FFA leads to this strange dichotomy. Personal loot would make group games better for many.

@Mindless-1928

Yah I want to afk in baal runs and get loot same time

If you AFK during a Baal run, you are guaranteed to get nothing if not in the same zone in an instanced/personal loot game. In FFA loot, you can wait in town and do nothing and still scavenge leftover gear. This can not happen in instanced loot games.

[Muyu-1611]

My lord RNA. You sure do love your informed posts, lol.

[Akai-11466]

If you are progressing and the item is a higher iLvl it is likely a small upgrade if it is not BiS, that said, you can trade items once you have a similar iLvl in that slot. I don’t see how that ruined raiding. The same number of items drop and you don’t have to have DKP or some other bs to qualify.

[Diakka-1992]

The only change that I would like to see is that the TC85 areas keep changing with each season.

Right now I can’t think of an example. But if in S1 we have zones A, C, E then in S2 we could have B, D, F.

I haven’t played Diablo 2 in almost 10 years, except for some very specific areas I don’t remember the rest of the names.

Or was all this already contemplated at the time?

[Muyu-1611]

I actually would not be against this. It would promote healthy replayability and keep people going to different zones to fend of monotony. What was once a zone a FuryZon would be able to do with no sweat would quickly become another class territory.

There’s a lot to be said for the game after release, most of which I believe will be modding territory, but for the most part i hope the base game remains mostly untouched.

[Mousehouse-11421]

@MicroRNA-1507

In your example seeing does not mean acquiring. In a FFA system if a 6 man team constantly plays together and collectively only see 3 drops that means 3 players are guaranteed never to collect a high rune. Nothing changes in that regard in FFA versus instanced loot games.

No, the thing is, that in the 6 man team from your example, everyone has THE CHANCE to get every respective drop, before it is picked up by someone. That motivates to play in a party in the first place.

@MicroRNA-1507

The drops in personal loot games are RNG. For a given monster/boss, the game already calculated if a drop happens and its identitiy. For personal loot, there is an extra roll added that defines that dop to a specific player.

I never said something else… The suggestion, on which I answered though was about manipulating the item rolls.

[Akai-11466]

I am not for Personal Loot in D2R but, everyone would still have the same chance to get loot in personal loot. Personal loot is still randomized and one person could hit the proverbial jackpot.

[Muyu-1611]

@MicroRNA-1507

Really??? I am am carrying an entire team and doing almost all the damage, I do not deserve the loot if I can not click fast enough in multiplayer. This seems illogical to me. In legitimate games, there are several variable for getting loot (e.g. ping, range vs. melee, etc…)

Sucks to be the others doesn’t it? There’s nothing wrong with the game in this regard. It’s the problem of the other players.

@MicroRNA-1507

Unfortunately, the hacks/cheats team is separate.

And this is confirmed, where?

@MicroRNA-1507

If average is C and you have A-game that means that you get a disproportionate amount of good loot at the expense of the other players.

Again, sucks to be the players not getting the loot.

We’re not about being fair here. The reality is that if you join a public game, you should keep your expectations low because there is no handholding in Diablo 2 (and public should automatically imply consent to not being given rights to anything in that game). The game is a product of a hardcore gaming era - and I hate using this as my crutch because it’s such a poor argument but a valid one none the less.

[Mousehouse-11421]

@Akai-11466

I am not for Personal Loot in D2R but, everyone would still have the same chance to get loot in personal loot. Personal loot is still randomized and one person could hit the proverbial jackpot.

Omg people are always replying this, even though I explicitly put this in the description:

@Mousehouse-11421

To make clear: you average drops are the same with ploot and shared loot, where everybody clicks equally well. But the fluctuations will give you horrible times with ploot, which spoils party play.

ON AVERAGE you get the same drops, yes. But with ploot, the statistical fluctuations let you see no good drops for longer periods of time. Equally, you also have longer “good luck” streaks. But on the scales at hand, these streaks can become of the magnitude of a ladder! That’s the problem!

You can have bad rng and find nothing good a whole ladder, if you play in 8 player parties with ploot and the other ladder, you just find everything you ever wanted. That’s totally dumb and is a simple statistical consequence of ploot + same total amount of drops.