Okay but I’m not suggesting they make it one shot everything on the screen like in Diablo 3.
Regardless of hit recovery, screen wipe abilities should not exist in DIablo 4 unless you’re vastly over leveled/geared for the area.
Being stunlocked is not a mechanic that has ever felt good to me, and regardless of even if you think it’s good I can’t see Blizzard going in for it. They nerfed it into the ground in WoW too because unfortunately for you, most people just don’t find it fun to not be able to do anything.
Also you can still feel the hit from the monster, especially if they have an animation to go along with it. You’re still impacted from it, and it’s even more realistic than a full dead stop stagger. It’s silly to suggest that hits in games don’t have impact unless they completely take control away from you.
and no, I’m not saying copy Diablo 3 combat but add in this effect. Diablo 3 combat has a bunch of other issues with it that stem from very poor character build design in that game.
It is not about “not being able to do anything”. It is about realistic hit response and being unable to spam your attacks no-matter-what.
It’s silly to suggest that hits in games don’t have impact unless they completely take control away from you.
Yes. In most arcade games your HP just goes down. And thats it. Diablo 1 back in time was a superior game, because its combat was much better and detailed. With D3 it degraded back to arcade. D4 is the same arcade, and not only me noticed that. Basically every 2nd comment on all youtube vids with D4 gameplay.
If it were about a realistic response you wouldn’t have tried to tell me I was just nit-picking when I pointed out it’s not actually realistic and there was a more realistic way to do it.
Also, the game should be responsive. Responsive games simply feel better to play for the majority of people.
I don’t care what most arcade games do. I’m not suggesting they copy it.
and I’m not saying Diablo 4 should carry on trying to copy Diablo 3.
But thats not a reason to hurt the games balance/strategy and make the gameplay easier because it will just appeal for casual people that wont think about just jumping in.
Azimuth is right, if you want to remove hit recovery or have like zero side effects of receiving a simple hit, you will somehow need another mechanic to pose more threat (and yeah, receiving a slow instead is a nice argument but seems visually off being honestly).
If not, it will just result into powercreep/increase damage numbers of monsters and one hit mechanics just like in PoE and D3.
There is a reason why people enjoy the tactical and positioning gameplay of both D1 and D2.
Even D1 is more tactical, heck I remember as a warrior it was pretty hard to fight at against succobi and those teleporing firebolt mages because everytime you got near them they just kited, either went back or teleported.
You always had to be careful to not make a wrong step or else you will be ganked by many mobs which will result into your death by blocking you.
D3 approach is the total opposite to this.
All games are unrealistic, because lack real physics, even if they have very good emulated one. That’s why hit recovery D1 is quite realistic (for a computer game), and I explained why I don’t like your proposal, and it is not about realism.
Agreed.
But you can add difficulty and strategy in other/better ways than Hit recovery.
I dont see why it would be visually off.
It could be all kinds of different effects depending on the source of the hit.
Slowed down, increased resource cost (you have to put more effort into your counter attack because you were pushed off balance etc.), disarming you, lowering your concentration (increased cast times) and so on.
And this should definitely be more of a thing.
More tactical gameplay, more diverse enemy behaviors, where you cant just go in, gather a group of enemies and AoE them down.
If Blizzard is unable to balance the game without hit recovery then they lack creativity.
In which case, not being staggered on hit is the least of our concerns.
Well I’m not suggesting zero side effects and I don’t care if that’s what the devs have lined up at the moment because I’m not saying that’s a good idea.
You guys can try to keep hammering on “but in Diablo 3…” and what the devs are doing and it’s never going to convince me of anything because I’m not saying that it is a good idea.
It being visually off or not comes down to largely the actual visuals of the effect itself.
Which again never happened to me in Diablo 2.
Well you keep saying it’s about realism so I’m going to keep saying that it’s not realistic. I know games aren’t 100% realistic, but you’re the one bringing realism into this.
I also explained why I hate hit recovery. I can’t think of any game where I feel it improved the experience.
Okay, if you like, I can introduce “game realism” term. But that doesn’t actually change anything, as no hit recovery (D3/D4) = absenсe of realism, and hit recovery (D1/D2) = presence.
It could be many things, including Hit Recovery.
Being Slowed is either pointless, for a melee character that won’t even notice, or very annoying for a ranged one. And it doesn’t have much to do with “realism”.
The idea is also to convey the tangibility of combat. When you get hit, you have a reaction. That’s what Hit Recovery does.
It’s not even a question of gameplay fluidity, as D3 monsters also have many ways to interrupt the player.
Sure, but when people talk about a hit recovery system here, I assume they mean like D1/2, as in a system where basically everything can give you a short stun.
Arguing for more diverse, more impactful, but also more infrequent effects.
Not sure why a melee character would not notice. Being slowed could be deadly for a melee character when trying to move out of a big attack, or trying to escape.
Being slowed after being hit on your legs seems reasonably realistic. Well, as realistic as hit recovery at least.
Personally I couldn’t care the slightest about realism though, but making systems of similar realism to Hit Recovery would be pretty easy.
Of course I agree ! ^^
I should have clarified : what I’d like is something like a 0,25s stun or even less, no more than once per second. Occurrence depends on the size of the monster and character Defense.
Indeed, but most of the time melee characters don’t have to move much while in combat, unlike ranged. There is some slow effect in D3 and it’s rarely dangerous but always annoying.
If every hits were thrown at legs, sure… but most of the time it’s the chest.
Some monsters close to the ground may slow of course.
Since I was exactly arguing for not every hit having an effect, yeah could be small enemies, or specifically from attacks that target your legs. Even a big monster might do a sweep attack targeting your legs.
And of course, it can also be from frost based attacks.
It is a fun mechanic bc it makes you care about combat unlike D3.
Meaning you dont want to get tagged in D2 in D3 you can’t get tagged it’s just elite dodging. The white elephant is that d3 had some good combat system which running by / through mobs not caring, is not.
Nobodys like “here’s how D3 did it better” they’re saying “well in this specific case d2’s system sucked but not generally”
There are other things you can do other than the way Diablo 1, 2 or 3 did things.
You guys really need to stop using “Diablo 3 was bad though” as your answer to every criticism about maybe we could do better than how Diablo 1/2 did it.
Great point
Bosses are severely underpowered when you have good gear. Especially in groups.
That doesnt mean hit recovery isnt a major factor when playing with not overpowered gear, or, solo, or, not vs bosses and such.
But yes having good gear, solved skills, and a D2 boss is like not at all good combat. Find some videos about normal d2 that doesnt involve bosses or op gear. Like someone not flexing a finished build. Hard to find but like a normal playthrough of the game, nobody wants to show that bc they want to show how to solve it.
