GoD nerf must be reworked

SirPhoenix-11946 · March 2, 2021, 1:53am

are u kidding DH hasnt been in Meta group play for years. it had a brief appearance with Impale in Season 9 then people worked out Wiz Archon and it replaced DH as RGK. since before that DHs werent in meta from season 3… Wiz has been in the group since season 6 till season 21… cry somewhere else…

Mersinary-11202 · March 2, 2021, 2:02am

Isn’t Wizard currently overperforming on the PTR? So I’m not sure what you’re so salty about.

Also, lets not consider DH builds such as UE, M6, Nats haven’t really received nerfs because they were never truly buffed in the first place. Impale received a buff to holy point shot, but it clearly wasn’t enough to make it impactful.

All DH ever wanted was to be balanced and competitive with other classes, as well as be accepted into 4-man groups…Instead our GoD dps build gets burned because of a bug/exploit with an elite affix.

AcidGlow-1757 · March 2, 2021, 3:34am

That’s the PTR!!! Not non season the PAST YEAR!! Genius reply!! The majority of us are very sure the Dev team will nerf that Firebird Tal Rasha combo severely.

Did you not read what i said? I was talking about all our NERFED builds the past year. Archon, StarPact, Channeling (meteors), HYdra (too weak), Twisters (Too weak and they lag in groups).

We have NOTHING to help in 4 player meta which is why we are excluded from groups. DOesn’t take a genius to know this. What’s your response now?

Oh so you Demon Hunters “only wanted to be included in 4 player metas”? Reallly?
Well how about us wizards who were nerfed on every build the past entire YEAR!!? Tell me, when’s the last time you saw a Wizard part of the 4 player meta? Be honest… (never).

Volatility-11129 · March 2, 2021, 4:19am

Hey, I’m all for having Wizards buffed but don’t come into a DH thread and talk crap about the class. That’s just pathetic.

Desecrate-1764 · March 2, 2021, 4:23am

Are you kidding, wizard’s was in the 4 man meta for 8 seasons. You want to come to my stream and let me personally show you on the LB I’ll be happy.

etherealglow-1369 · March 2, 2021, 5:18am

Blizzard should just remove the missile dampening effect, as others have suggested earlier.

Mersinary-11202 · March 2, 2021, 5:24am

???

First, don’t try to quote me if you aren’t gonna use my exact words.

And what about all the YEARS, not just 1 year, being shafted again and again and again…Where DH had no place being competitive and no place in 4-mans?

What’s wrong with Wizards? Moreso, whats wrong with LoD Twister? It’s actually a very good build for groups, and also has the best pixel pull in the game. And forgive me, I dont play Wizards, I only play DH…So honestly I know diddly squat about their history of being good or not. But feel free to argue your point, I’m sure someone else will step in to confirm or deny your thoughts.

Raistlin-1595 · March 2, 2021, 5:29am

Actually, Wizard was in the Meta for more than 8 seasons.
Twisted Sword was the DPS, then it got nerfed.

Fire Bats WD became DPS. Wizard became the RGK using Manald’s, Hydras, and Archon.

Necro became RGK w/ Pestilence and Firebird’s Starpact became DPS. Then legit LoN / LoD Starpact. Finally, the scripted abomination that was Bazooka.

Really, until Bazooka finally got crushed Wizards were in most of the Metas in one role or another.
Seasons: 3, 5, 6, 10, then 12-19.

I agree Wizards are in a bad place right now, and the T6F4 will be nerfed before PTR ends, That said, it’s really poor form to come to a DH thread crying about being out of the Meta for 1 year. Like a child pitching a fit in a sandbox, because his toy was taken way.

As for DH not being in the Meta… well they are. zDPS GoD has replaced Monks in a lot of groups. Even with the nerf to damage that won’t change.

Nevertheless, the nerfs to both GoD and Mundunugu’s is completely uncalled for. Unfair really, as Necro’s continue to get buffed, and Barbs blissfully Whirlwind away with lamentation untouched.

QuisSeparabi-2346 · March 2, 2021, 5:38am

I only know I play sometimes with the #22 nonseason Wiz of Europe and he has no problems with his builds in 4p meta…And yup, LoD Twister works for most.

The GoD nerf is just beyond any sense. It’s idiotic. It was a fine working build that DH needed since ages, and then they nerf it again because some shiddy monster affix that rarely appears has a bug with it giving some people 1-2 more GR levels to master? Wtf?

Rollback the whole GoD changes, just remove the Missile Dampening affix.

Kitchmann-2504 · March 2, 2021, 5:45am

Or just simply do NOT nerf DH at all.
They also don’t care that nearly every 2nd Elite has the “Waller” affix and we can’t do any damage.
Maybe it’s because DH came closer to their favorite $-genarating class Necromancer.

Kolonel-21779 · March 2, 2021, 8:11am

There are more wiz 150 clears in the EU than DH. Way more.

Stop creating unsubstantiated arguments in other class’s threads and go make one about the wizard.

Desecrate-1764 · March 2, 2021, 8:25am

The priority of this thread is for the GoD DH set and what was suppose be a fix just for a rare Elite Affix that was fished for 500-1k Keys. Not break the set to the ground. With feedback on how it affected the set around one single affix.
Not a discussion on other classes.

BRAVEHEART67-6268 · March 2, 2021, 12:18pm

Mate, just to save you from making an even bigger fool of yourself, I’ve provided below a table listing the 4 player meta for each season (from 1 -22). This is based on the No 1 ranked 4 man groups on the US leaderboards for each season. They make for interesting reading:

Some analysis of that table…

The Barb has been in the meta 19 times out of 22 seasons, missing just 3 times;
The Monk has been in the meta 18 times out of 22 seasons, missing just 4 times and that includes 4 seasons where it has filled 2 of the 4 meta slots;
The Wizard has been in the meta 12 times, including 8 seasons in a row between seasons 12 and 19. It also filled 2 of the 4 meta slots in season 3;
The Necro has appeared in the meta 11 times - missing out just once as it did not exist prior to season 11;
The Witch Doctor has appeared in the meta 11 times, but only once since season 11;
The Crusader has appeared in the meta 5 times, but only once since season 4;
The Demon Hunter has appeared in the meta only 3 times in it’s existence and only once since season 2;

So mate, don’t come in here being salty about the Wizard nerfs and telling us Demon Hunters to accept our GoD nerf. As far as groups and metas are concerned, the Demon Hunter has been the most badly neglected class by a country mile. So we have every right to be angry that the first truly competitive build we’ve had in years is potentially being snatched away from us with this ridiculous piercing cap.

TinneOnnMuin-1187 · March 2, 2021, 2:23pm

Feel free to ignore the people hoping that the interaction between Tal6 and FB4 won’t get fixed.

Most long-term wizard community members don’t want that interaction. We remember the days when Tal6/DMO4 was stronger than DMO6. And when Tal6/Vyr4 was stronger than stronger than Vyr6. We don’t want to go back to those days.

I thought the developers had learned their lesson about putting strong 4p bonuses that fit with Tal’s and a 6p bonus that’s weaker than Tal’s 6p, but I guess not. Or maybe more accurately, they did learn that lesson but those developers are now working on different projects, so the new developers need to relearn that lesson.

Anyway, the only people who don’t think Tal6/FB4 should be nerfed are either bandwagoners who don’t care about wizards at all but just want to play a ridiculously overpowered and broken build regardless of what it is. Or wizard fanboys who can’t see that it’s bad for the game.

Real wizards don’t want this. Real wizards want FB6 to stand on it’s own. And for Tal6/FB4 not to totally dominate every other build in the game.

It’s easy to see for anyone who actually cares about game balance that Tal6/FB4 is bad for the game. And also that the GoD nerf is horrible for DHs and should either be reverted or at least adjusted to be more in line with it’s intended goal without totally gimping a class.

Anyone who can’t see that needs to step back and look at the bigger picture.

Desecrate-1764 · March 3, 2021, 9:45am

Pretty much my thoughts on it . Yeah we finally get something that worked fine just to get pulled down from a single affix spawn. I really hope its fixed in some form or fashion its such an amazing set and its a NEW set.

Psotnick-2640 · March 3, 2021, 4:08pm

You know it’s better to nerf DH GoD or WDs new set, than actually take care of all the 6000-9000 BOTTERS right?

Better fix something that ISN’T broken and ruin the ONLY build that allowed SOLO DH players to have any FUN in the game and why, cause you know LOGIC…

200+ Necros cleared 150 GR SOLO on EU server in season and some player(s) got over 9000 paragon. Plenty of others got over 6000 by either botting or playing with botters with T-HUD, but hey lets RUIN the GoD set or WD set (once again), cause “reasons” (that make no sense, which doesn’t surprise me anymore anyway)…

If they wanted to nerf the DHs GoD, by reducing the amount of pierces than AT LEAST for the love of Gawd increase the 6 pieces set bonus from 10,000 % to 40,000 % or even 50,000 % Gawd d4mn it, so you can try other primary skills at least…

D3 RoS is probably the only game that punishes players for being good or even best at anything, especially when it comes to SOLO players, cause no one is allowed to touch the HOLY 4 Man METAS and their 3-4 minutes 150 GR clears, but lets destroy DHs GoD damage dealing set even though it propably NEVER was a part of the 4 Man META as damage dealing build EVER since it was added to the game or nerfing the WD set for the 2nd time.

Yep it makes sense…

https://media.makeameme.org/created/logic-j8qnke.jpg

UnluckyMan-1494 · March 3, 2021, 5:33pm

Not judging, but I think the discussion got off topic. The nerf will not change 4man meta, zdh got 0 impact in there. Will affect more solo pushes.

So if their goal was avoid the pierce exploit on md, just remove that kind of mechannic from the game(any kind of damage improvement on pierce, clearly not works well on AD and damage escalation if you consider performance wise). After that, check the impact and tune things in the right way.

Removing MD will just push the bomb to blow in the future, because damage gone up to a crazy numbers and those numbers right now are showing the problems they could trigger. Maybe reducing overall values solve the issue(which it’s very unlikely they take this path), so in the end reducing the number of those kind interactions could improve overall performance. AD and piercing are mechannics that messes with the game, but it’s easier to say that MD It’s the villain while most of the time these 2 are the ones who makes performance issues, try to ask yourselves why zbuilds often remove AD from gons and you see the patern and issue show their true colors. MD it’s not the problem, AD and Pierce are. If they remove, most likely everybody will cry because they could barely reach 120-130, instead of 150. So there is no good way to nerf something, because will hurt.

Several targets + AD + Pierce = game performance problems, it’s crystal clear. Other games had the same issue with both mechannics impacting in erradic behavior and game problems, check bl2 b0re on google and you will clear think of HA(dh) and BS(necro).

So about rework ideas, the Iria post had some nice feedbacks in there. If you have something positive to add to help devs sort out things I think most of the folks in there will appreciate.

For me, the nerf was necessary to align dh builds with other dh builds(apples with apples, not with oranges), if you only have one build viable means something bad happening. The changes I suggested on momentum maybe could create a path where, speed could work for GoD, push would work with 2piece GoD + another set while groups could have zdh diversity also. Having this kind of flavored builds generate diversity, the momentum buff also could improve a bit the GoD push potential, but hybrid sets would be more viable than 6piece GoD. In the end dh as whole would improve.

An0nymy0us-11124 · March 3, 2021, 6:15pm

I am looking at barb players wanting to talk about nerf DH, remember the WW Rend Nerf era, I bet the same ones who are in favor of DH Nerf, are the ones who were against nerf barb at the time

Kitchmann-2504 · March 3, 2021, 6:47pm

That means the Rend “nerf” was totally ok. It was to align the only viable WW set with the other crappy Barb sets → Apples with apples. Your words.

Edit: Nerfing the only viable build without offering an alternative is the wrong way.

UnluckyMan-1494 · March 3, 2021, 7:13pm

Yes it is, I only disagree about crappy part you said, every single barb set has utility, even IK(currently one of the less used ones).

As barb player I think the WW had a necessary nerf. The current status of barb it’s more healtier than was in the past, again apples with apples.

As necro player I think they trying a bunch different things, which is great. But doesn’t mean I agree with the power in the current builds. They need to be tunned down, eventually will be, till then they will be META which for me META it’s just optimal not fun.

As WD mundunungu had a big spotlight on wd builds, the tweak severely impacted on the build, but also aligned to other wd builds. Too soon to say how much the impact will reflect on other wd builds.

As DH player, having more sets at same range, means more diversity to play. I would love to see dh builds being closer in terms of power.

As sader I think it’s safe to say the builds needs to get a bit closer to each other, but they’re getting in there.

About barb diversity: Zbarb can use savage,raek, wastes,mote and even ik in several combinations. On speed side ww and frenzy have times really close, but raekors also can do some stuff. On pushes ww have more power, while lacks on rgk potential, while frenzy have less overall power and can be one of the best rgk and mote being a good overall build with some rgk potential. Making ww+frenzy a nice 2-player combo, ww+zbarb+mote a nice 3 player combo. If you check overall barb sets lays on B-C tiers, while wastes it’s on A tier. It’s not like DH with huge gaps between GoD being on S and the rest of the sets being on C-D tiers. So I think it’s nice to say that the WW nerf improved QoL from barbs diversity, so again: “the nerf was necessary to improve diversity on barb builds”.

While GoD made the opposite on DH, if impale dh could compete at same ground you could have something like 2-player GoD+impale or 3 player Nat/UE+zdh+impale more often, not 4 GoD parties with sometimes one of them as zdh. That’s why I suggested the momentum buff that could make hybrid dh builds more interesting, while keeping GoD speed potential and get some push potential back.

I would like every single build become buffed to be at same tier, but also would make the game easier and I would utopic to say all builds are S tier viable, but if they at least have less gap between them could make all builds in that class more healthier, like barb case. So having builds at almost same power range improves diversity, even if they aren’t the most powerful builds out there.

I enjoyed my gr 128 on frenzy barb(a lot effort, augments and almost 2k gons) way more my gr 130 on necro(almost 0 augments, some gears wasn’t even augmented with 1.3k gons). If folks forget about META and learn more their classes could improve severa builds and align sets better between them, that’s why leaderboards by set it’s a nice thing to help that, to compare apples with apples.

Currently I’m on top 1k barbs with a B tier build and I can find at least 2 other sets in there(wastes and mote) if I remember correctly, and their average clears are almost at same range. If that tells something, it’s the nerf made a nice thing to balance barb builds between themselves. Try to check what happens on other classes.

If you would keep the bet, I would gladly take the money

Nerfs can be tough to deal, but doesn’t mean that changes weren’t needed. If you add something and it’s way out the league if compare with the other options, means something it’s not right. Buff stuff for the sake of buff something it’s not that great either, because will make the game even easier and folks will ask for more GR levels in a endless cycle that made AD and Piercing becoming performance issues and numbers reaching bizarre values. It’s a ongoing process that gets some features in the way. We got a ton of new sets and set changes, so it’s normal for them overperform in the beginning and got tunned down afterwards(GoD and mundunungu), same can happen on sets who are underperforming and get buffs (rathma and firebird). It’s a cycle and trial/error thing to try improve diversity of gameplay.