Ploot anesthetizes multiplayer item rewards.
Diablo II was so good in large part because of its vitality - the energy of ffa looting is hugely responsible for that.
The danger is vital. If the devs are still inspired, theyll not dilute and p’loot the blood of D2.
-So sayeth Odin
Often, FFA loot had the opposite effect by driving players from D2 or to playing D2 solo. Ironically, many here claim that multiplayer is for xp/leveling while single player is for loot.
Personal loot is distinct from drop rates. One can have the exact same number of total drops with FFA loot or personal loot. Just imagine the the total drops of FFA loot where there is a roll where each drops is assigned to one and only one player. In an 8 player game, each player only sees ~1/8 of total drops (with the confines of binomial variance).
No, plenty of looting to be had in multiplayer…
I didn’t say looting does not happen in multiplayer just commenting on the fact that many claim the primary purpose of multiplayer is xp/leveling.
The danger of what - not getting items? That’s silly. That merely encouraged players to run a loot mod or play solo to avoid the situation. Diablo isn’t modeling a cutthroat lawyers’ office. There’s no real reason to make every other person you play with potential competition. Nor is there any real reason to make players into hyperalert ground spam clickers.
The challenge on getting items should be your efficiency, effectiveness, and the monsters you’re fighting. Not who you’re teaming up with. You want other players to be competition, then go PvP or turn on your hostility flag.
again this disgusting discussion…
you will not get your ploot-crap. end of story. wait for d4…
I fully agree with you.
But just in case some dev is actually following this:
even split loot should be visible for other players and should become shared after a short time period (or only be shared depending on proximity). Otherwise splitting up into different parts of the map (cows) or server (meph run in 8 player game) would work different than it is working now.
Split loot should only be the case, if the party is together, working on the same (possibly boss) opponent. In that case, they should all have their fair share of the loot.
In other cases, the old flow should still be possible.
You might be right that we won’t get it, but your opinion is still terrible.
Again, done correctly, personal loot changes almost nothing except making it so you don’t need to spam click the ground in multiplayer games to get loot. What exactly do you think is bad about that? Is spam clicking the ground, or not participating in fights so you can click faster when it ends, really an essential part of Diablo to you?
i just dont care about it. Im FINE with that.
I’ve been playing it that way for 15-20 years and it doesn’t bother me in the least the way it is.
ploot is not the way diablo 2 should be played. ploot is the way d3 is played. and d3 is Garbage. like all the newer arpgs…(at least for me)
If you disagree I don’t mind but I hate to see this eternal discussion over and over again instead of getting some real news or anything else interesting.
People who want Personal Loot is scared they can’t pick up the item fast enough before somebody else. Ploot sucks (My opinion.) IT doesn’t betong in Diablo 2…
You are right. Personal loot does not belong in Diablo 2. Fortunately for you, Blizzard has announced that Diablo 2 will be maintained as is. An instanced/personal loot option makes sense in Diablo 2 Resurrected.
For some, you may be correct that some players have concern about picking up items faster than others. This is well-justified reservation given ninja looting and pickit cheaters, These players would prefer to be able to see only a small fraction of total drops (e.g. 1/8) to have better equity. FFA loot also break the role playing aspects of aRPGs. Personal loot is the gold standard now in aRPGS as it is far superior due to an overwhelming number of reasons.
Right… this topic will drag on and on, maybe even after release if it doesn’t happen then.
When I step back and forget about all the debating and reasons people are giving, personal-loot in D2 just seems so bizarre. I hated it in D3. That and not being able to trade. I always thought D3 was a step backwards, to imagine people are trying to push it in D2 sounds like a bad joke, but who knows, it could be a reality.
It doesn’t change “nothing”, I agree with somebody else on here, playing with others with personal-loot feels like your playing with bots. You get a sense everybody is playing a separate game. Just because the reasoning isn’t as simplistic as “it’s more fair”, doesn’t mean there isn’t a good reason. Diablo 2 is about the loot-hunt, and the shared experience and excitement of item drops. I have little interest even playing with other people with personal-loot. That is not the D2 I know or want. Personal-loot might be more “fair”, but it’s not worth the trade-off for many of us. I want to play together, even if some people cheat. It’s never stopped me at all from getting gear before, and I can always play alone, away from others, or with friends…it’s not like people wont do that anyway. Your time invested into the game will dictate your gear more than any loot option by far.
That is why most who favor personal loot want it as an option either at game or character creation. We are not advocating to force our preference on you. If you want to only play in FFA loot games in multiplayer, you still have that option. Players who prefer personal loot have that option. It is a win-win.
I don’t know why people are so against a ploot option. Don’t join games with that drop method then. It’s not like people are asking it to be the only drop allocation method. Take a look at PoE’s drop system. It’s one of the best that I’ve seen.
Unfortunately, that is precicly the problem of this argument.
One side of this conversation does not like win-win situations, instead they prefer win-lose situations. Of course they see themselves on the winning side in that, because everybody else is just a “pleb”. you get the picture. sigh
Why not? “Because it’s always been that way” is a lame attempt at evasion, not an actual reason.
D3 being worse has nothing to do with personal loot, though. Seriously, if “that’s the way D3 does it and I hate everything about D3” is your reason, that’s not really very compelling.
Then don’t participate, you goof. Nobody is forcing you to read the threads. It’s not like player created discussions are standing in for “real news” anyway, 'cause all that would be posted by Blizzard. I seriously doubt you even need to visit the forums to see the real news.
Well, yeah, if they’re using loot mods like in OG D2. Doesn’t matter how fast you are, you can’t beat a mod or a bot.
Seriously, though, explain to me why - without using any variant of the phrase “because that’s how D2 was” - why you should have to be faster than the other guy in the first place.
You do realize that open loot facilitates non-participation in fights, right? And you do realize a lot of players play solo precisely because they don’t want to deal with fighting for loot, right?
You can’t present a singular downside to personal loot except “I don’t like it because I don’t like it.” And while you’re entitled to that opinion, it does nothing in a real discussion except get you dismissed as the last 5 letters of your name.
Other way around, really. If there were personal loot you wouldn’t have people running loot mods to automate the process (which is what botting IS - automating processes), and you wouldn’t have people standing around doing nothing while others kill the monsters, which ALSO feels like running with bots.
Maybe you should take advantage of chat and/or voice chat.
I’m really not understanding how having several people spam click the ground makes you feel like you’re interacting with people, let alone interacting in a way that means anything.
There is no more excitement about item drops because others may be able to pick it up.
Riddle me this: If D2 is about the “shared experience,” and open loot makes people choose to play solo so they don’t have loot competition, then isn’t open loot a bad thing? There’s no “shared experience” when you’re solo, is there?
What trade off? And how is there a trade off if choosing personal loot is entirely optional upon game creation? You worried everyone is going to choose that and you won’t have any games to join? Rather telling about which option is better if that’s the case, isn’t it?
Personal loot won’t stop you from playing with others. I don’t know why you think it would, especially with open trade still present.
I think, the last time i saw someone destroyed so hard, was when my first D1 character opened the butchers’ door for the first time back in 96.
The butcher had a cleaver, you did it with a keyboard. Kudos for that.
In D2 item drops are something for the whole party. If you’re that paralyzed at “ninja looting” maybe you should wait for D4 or go back to D3.
It never ceases to amaze at the lengths people will push a remaster just because they believe it will be “better”.
Personal loot is a massive gameplay change and not QoL. I am extremely happy that the likelihood of this being implemented is practically zero.
And I don’t know where some of you took math, but an RNG drop even within a possible set at 8x the query roll is STILL approaching 8x the loot. It may not be from the same pool; due to MF and other parameters, but the argument that 8 individuals receiving personal loot doesn’t arbitrarily push the drop rate towards 8 times is absurd and dishonest.
I’ve outlined many reasons why personal loot is a bad idea. It was also a bad idea in MMOs because it encouraged lazy leeching, a loot council couldn’t deprive you, even if you were doing near bottom dps on purpose. Obviously this doesn’t exactly apply to how D2 plays, but the gist is still entirely relevant.
Maybe you should read the other peoples posts before replying to them.
You clearly prove that you did not understand anything from what has been stated before.
Maybe then you will be able to grasp the “math” that is actually at play here.
Same item drops as before, same mf rules as before, simply give 1 item of the ~6-8 items that are part of a boss loot to each player involved.
Same math = same items. No need for a PHD for that. Simple reading comprehension would suffice. But i guess that is too much to ask for.
For your other “arguments”: just scroll up one post and read the excellent and detailed reply of Orrion. He literally destroyed all of your arguments with simple and cohesive logic.
He also actually tried to read other people replies and react to them on their points.
But hey, let’s just restate the same point again and not read anything.
This is not what most are asking for. If Baal drops 5 total items in an 8 player game, in a instanced/personal loot game only 5 total items will drop. In each case, at least 3 players will get nothing from Baal. It does not mean that 40 total items will drop from Baal.
None are valid in my opinion and moreover, as illustrated above, it appears that you are arguing against what is not even being asked for.