D4 is a P2W MMO game

For my own info, where does it say that? Or do you mean the beta?

So it is pay2win then.

the old man have more knowlege :slight_smile: hight,warlord ect… , something your not :slight_smile:
one day you will have the old man knowlege sadly not today .

for sure this will dont be worst compare this week end beta and most player are already cap 25 very easy with multiple character in 2 day only , so the calcul is easy to make with 4 day , so your excuse is already invalid , don’t get emotionally involved boy this blurry your vision :clown_face:

Win what, exactly?

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I have no idea, I just commented to the MVP arguing with my other post.

This.

I don’t care. I’m not prepurchasing.

I don’t give a crap about PVP or anyones biased views, why should i be emotionaly envolved? :laughing: Your “huge advantage” will not matter in the long run we all know that. And no one will remember nor care, like a year or so after launch. But keep beating the dead horse, because as i see that what’s makes you happy. Also 4 days of “advantage” should not matter for a big pvp god like you, right? :wink:

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np just stay quite stop trolling and talking about something you dont know , i think this will look more wise :+1:

thank you , yes i will try find a way around , this will be maybe more rough if good player hold the place idk what to expect , but this is not my issue is more to start to implement ptw feature slowly and this is already a red flag to me and also other player , you already say is a dead house mean already other player have the same issue i have

How is it extra payment when cost of Pre order and actual order is the same? In what way are discounted products vs non discounted produced a disadvantage or pay to win? In D3… I bought the game in 2012…6k paragon before someone starts @ 2019… So i am pay to win??

No one charges you extra for pre ordering and if you wishes to wait for d4 to be on discount, that is your choice and opportunity cost.

P2W influences the effort vs reward ratio. Starting early does not. The only way starting early would is if D4 wasn’t going to be available long enough for everyone to put in the effort. But since it will be out for years, even decades, it won’t affect the effort vs reward ratio.

Everyone will have an equal opportunity to achieve, even surpass, what early starters achieve, all without buying anything extra.

Again, source?

you’re right, but you will get a lot of friction from bias users who ignore these things because the game could offer a miniscule amount of fun maybe possibly once, and these users are impulse buyers.

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thats not even close to defining pay2win.

you get access to something the rest of the players dont, for paying more money than the standard cost.

i like how you call him out for a source and facts, and then drop this dead burger here.

sounds exactly like the cronies on dilbo immoral tried to use when saying you could earn everything free. “if we play a decade then it all evens out, trust us, lol. its not pay2win because 10 years from now youll have the same things i have today.”

you get worse and worse bias every day, bro.

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It certainly isn’t the only defining factor, but it is one. Whether you or I or anyone likes it or not, P2W allows effort to skipped, thereby altering the effort vs reward ratio.

And your very next qoute of me showed that is not true.

Bravada, it doesn’t matter what anyone says about DI, it’s not comparable.
DI has purchasable power, it has skippable effort. D4 does not have purchasable power, it has no skippable effort.

Additionally, there is no bias involved in those two facts, yet here you are desparately trying to dodge them by attempting to compare the two games. It’s no wonder you have the reputation that you do.

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Just to note here pre-ordering the standard edition doesn’t give you the 4 days of early access before the game’s release date.

So people who pay $90 will be able to play the game before people who pay $70.

Which regardless of the semantics of if it’s P2W or not, is still a scummy thing to do.

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That’s your own narrow definition. My definition is “anything that gives you an advantage over other players that you have to pay with RM for”. According to your definition not even D:I is P2W, because they sell you crests, not gear or weapons.

No, its the proper definition. You’re broadening it because you’re a silly pedant who seeks attention by arguing with strangers on the internet about video games.

No, it’s not because I have not paid more for that advantage, I have just played more: pLay vs pay.

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The OP may very well be a silly pedant but to be fair P2W is one of those things everybody seems to agree on the vague idea of but we all have our own slightly different specific definition of what it does and doesn’t include.

There is no real “proper definition” of it. It’s why these threads always end up in the same stupid semantics argument.

Not that “but I define it this way so I’m right” is much of an argument.

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How are you different?
/
P2W in D4 appears to be a one time thing and very narrow for now, so I agree it’s debatable. Anyway it’s an ugly money-grab that I hope will not be replicated by other games in the future.
Glad to see that no one is arguing about the MMO aspect.

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time is power and d4 sells time. it doesnt matter if you only care about seasons, not everyone does so they lose out to pay2win. and the point being the devs said absolutely ZERO pay2win, and though its a small lie, where does this go? cant trust them.

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Yep! And as I’ve had to repeat, everyone will have ample time to catch and surpass the early starters. Season or non season.

It’s no different for those that start early, start on launch day, start a week later, start a year later. There’s enough time for everyone to reach everything with no requirement to pay for any of it.